So when does it "get better"
#136
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2017
Location: Halifax, NS
Posts: 345
Re: So when does it "get better"
I do 100% agree with this, I am happy living in Canada....but the standard of driving in the GTA in particular the 401 is a disgrace.....its a pet hate of mine - dangerous undertaking, tailgating, swerving across three lanes of traffic, motorists not letting you in the next lane when you have nowhere to go in the lane you are in
...... and then as you say the stop signs many seem to want to have a picnic there! My ex girlfriend (Canadian) used to say about me, "Oh yes Paul thinks stop signs are a suggestion"
An then all the police bang on about is speed! Speed is not the problem!!! its bad inconsiderate driving thats the issue!! The Autobahn in Germany proves that.
Now you have started me! lol
...... and then as you say the stop signs many seem to want to have a picnic there! My ex girlfriend (Canadian) used to say about me, "Oh yes Paul thinks stop signs are a suggestion"
An then all the police bang on about is speed! Speed is not the problem!!! its bad inconsiderate driving thats the issue!! The Autobahn in Germany proves that.
Now you have started me! lol
#137
Forum Regular
Joined: Feb 2016
Location: Ontario
Posts: 192
Re: So when does it "get better"
No maquiladora's in the UK as far as I'm aware although the EU freedom of movement brought in cheap labour and dragged a lot of already low paid jobs down another few notches.
The UK produces enough of its own chickens, around 70%, no need for poisoned ones.
#138
Banned
Joined: Apr 2009
Location: SW Ontario
Posts: 19,879
Re: So when does it "get better"
Can we take talk of Brexit and similar Non-Canada related posts to our off topic forum - The Maple Leaf please... Cheers
#139
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2013
Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
Posts: 44
Re: So when does it "get better"
#140
Just Joined
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 9
Re: So when does it "get better"
Getting the conversation back to the original topic, it seems no good name has struggled to make much progress with profound homesickness, many month after starting this thread. Is 2020 the year you can make some progress and find new hope? If the end-goal of returning permanently to the UK is too big a leap at this stage, maybe shoot for some smaller, shorter-term and realisable goals that, step-by-step, can get you into a better state of mind? Eg. "By this summer, I'll have returned to the UK for a few days to have a drink with my mates". Any other strategies or suggestions out there?
#142
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,900
Re: So when does it "get better"
OP, ignore all the banging on here about politics, which is extraneous to your situation or your interest in moving back. The election result sure does not indicate Britain is "divided," quite the contrary actually. Britain is not much different from circa 2015 or 2016. You may find your professional networks have dried up a bit as these often only last about two years after someone leaves a country.
As you've now been in Canada four years, that is time enough. You need to have a serious talk with your partner about what you are feeling and your desire to go back.
As you've now been in Canada four years, that is time enough. You need to have a serious talk with your partner about what you are feeling and your desire to go back.
#143
Forum Regular
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 93
Re: So when does it "get better"
I accept there is two sides to every story, but it's not simple 'homesickness' that is my issue. I am so annoyed and bitter that we have gave up a modest, secure, decent life and gave ourselves more of an uphill struggle/future financial difficulties. From homeowners to renters - expected to pay WAY over the odds now for less home than we had and could have improved on in the UK. I am annoyed at how naive I was to let myself be convinced the GTA was untouched by the very nagatives people seem to want to 'escape' from in the UK.
Rarely a day has passed in all my time here that I do not regret the decision I made to come here and put myself in this situation.
#144
Re: So when does it "get better"
Believe me, I have tried. I have explained some deep and genuine feelings a hairy ass man stereotypically would keep to himself. But in this modern era, apparantly it is "ok not to be ok"... so I have tried. But after many discussions, many horrible arguments, the subject is now so sensitive my wife ignores it completely (as she is content) and I'm left feeling more and more frustrated, lost, sometimes resentful... The words "I am happy here, I will never go back" have been stated loud and clear many times. So what are my options? Stay in this miserable stalemate 'forever' or leave my wife and kids to live on the other side of the planet.. which doesnt exactly seem a happy existence either..
I accept there is two sides to every story, but it's not simple 'homesickness' that is my issue. I am so annoyed and bitter that we have gave up a modest, secure, decent life and gave ourselves more of an uphill struggle/future financial difficulties. From homeowners to renters - expected to pay WAY over the odds now for less home than we had and could have improved on in the UK. I am annoyed at how naive I was to let myself be convinced the GTA was untouched by the very nagatives people seem to want to 'escape' from in the UK.
Rarely a day has passed in all my time here that I do not regret the decision I made to come here and put myself in this situation.
I accept there is two sides to every story, but it's not simple 'homesickness' that is my issue. I am so annoyed and bitter that we have gave up a modest, secure, decent life and gave ourselves more of an uphill struggle/future financial difficulties. From homeowners to renters - expected to pay WAY over the odds now for less home than we had and could have improved on in the UK. I am annoyed at how naive I was to let myself be convinced the GTA was untouched by the very nagatives people seem to want to 'escape' from in the UK.
Rarely a day has passed in all my time here that I do not regret the decision I made to come here and put myself in this situation.
#145
Forum Regular
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 93
Re: So when does it "get better"
I don't think people are honest enough about emigration. Typically, it's a bargain in which you give up family, friends, culture (and if going to the GTA scenery and architecture) in exchange for more money. It may be that you want the money for consumer durables or it may be that you want it to buy a better start for your children or you may want it for some other reason but that's the other half of the trade..
Nor do I even see my kids prospering in any grand way. Yeah they are 'ok' at their new school (aged 7+9). But I maintain the majority of the activities they have done here they could have done back home. (*Note to others out there thinking moving to canada will magically make your kids 'outdoorsy' where they ski every winter weekend and play skateboards every day in summer. They are who they are, and if they sit playing computers all day then thats not the UK's fault. )
#146
Re: So when does it "get better"
Nor do I even see my kids prospering in any grand way. Yeah they are 'ok' at their new school (aged 7+9). But I maintain the majority of the activities they have done here they could have done back home. (*Note to others out there thinking moving to canada will magically make your kids 'outdoorsy' where they ski every winter weekend and play skateboards every day in summer. They are who they are, and if they sit playing computers all day then thats not the UK's fault. )
- I had more money than I would have had in the UK so, if they wanted to try something, cost was less of a constraint than it would have been in England.
- More importantly. Growing up in England I felt limited in what I could do, I thought of things as being above my station (not literally but I thought of sailing, for example, as something for toffs, not for me). My children, having grown up here, have no concept that there's anything legal they're not supposed to do. They may not be good enough for the team, they may not like whatever it is, but they have no idea of a class system or social constraints.
#147
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,900
Re: So when does it "get better"
I don't think people are honest enough about emigration. Typically, it's a bargain in which you give up family, friends, culture (and if going to the GTA scenery and architecture) in exchange for more money. It may be that you want the money for consumer durables or it may be that you want it to buy a better start for your children or you may want it for some other reason but that's the other half of the trade. It makes no sense to me to move to somewhere that doesn't offer that unless the emigrant sees some overwhelming intangible benefit from the new place "I'm hungry but I've lived in NYC", "it's cold here but I've sat at the feet of the Dalai Lama". Suburban Toronto is not such a place.
The odds of a successful long-term migration are at their best when there are both pull factors to the intended country specifically, and also push factors away from the UK, and not just one or the other. By that I mean legitimate push/pull factors, not boredom in the UK, "I don't like Boris Johnson" temper tantrums, or illusions like "moving to Canada will get my kids to be more outdoorsy and put their mobiles down."
(*Note to others out there thinking moving to canada will magically make your kids 'outdoorsy' where they ski every winter weekend and play skateboards every day in summer. They are who they are, and if they sit playing computers all day then thats not the UK's fault. )
Unfortunately having read your updates, I do concur with you that you are in a very sticky situation with no obvious exit points now, or at least without exit points that will incur an unacceptably high cost.
I would urge you to seek marriage counseling. It is hard to comment further without knowing why your wife is so attached to staying in GTA or what she finds so appealing about it - is she Canadian and is from there originally, does she have a career that is skyrocketing currently, has she formed a much more dynamic social circle there than in the UK etc.
Good luck.
Last edited by carcajou; Jan 19th 2020 at 1:08 am.
#148
Re: So when does it "get better"
Believe me, I have tried. I have explained some deep and genuine feelings a hairy ass man stereotypically would keep to himself. But in this modern era, apparantly it is "ok not to be ok"... so I have tried. But after many discussions, many horrible arguments, the subject is now so sensitive my wife ignores it completely (as she is content) and I'm left feeling more and more frustrated, lost, sometimes resentful... The words "I am happy here, I will never go back" have been stated loud and clear many times. So what are my options? Stay in this miserable stalemate 'forever' or leave my wife and kids to live on the other side of the planet.. which doesnt exactly seem a happy existence either..
I accept there is two sides to every story, but it's not simple 'homesickness' that is my issue. I am so annoyed and bitter that we have gave up a modest, secure, decent life and gave ourselves more of an uphill struggle/future financial difficulties. From homeowners to renters - expected to pay WAY over the odds now for less home than we had and could have improved on in the UK. I am annoyed at how naive I was to let myself be convinced the GTA was untouched by the very nagatives people seem to want to 'escape' from in the UK.
Rarely a day has passed in all my time here that I do not regret the decision I made to come here and put myself in this situation.
I accept there is two sides to every story, but it's not simple 'homesickness' that is my issue. I am so annoyed and bitter that we have gave up a modest, secure, decent life and gave ourselves more of an uphill struggle/future financial difficulties. From homeowners to renters - expected to pay WAY over the odds now for less home than we had and could have improved on in the UK. I am annoyed at how naive I was to let myself be convinced the GTA was untouched by the very nagatives people seem to want to 'escape' from in the UK.
Rarely a day has passed in all my time here that I do not regret the decision I made to come here and put myself in this situation.
One day I had to see the GP to have a prescription renewed and while there I told him how miserable I was. We talked about my seeing a therapist to get some clarity on exactly what was at the root of my unhappiness. He also suggested couples sessions so I could express my feelings in a setting where my husband had to listen. Both of these were a huge help.
I've now been in Australia for 13 1/2 years and although my new husband is more than happy to move to Canada with me (I'm Canadian and he's now got a nice shiny PR visa), and our kids are grown, Perth is now home. I do get homesick at times; today my family had a birthday party for my mum's 95th and I would have liked to be there.
Could you access counselling through your benefits? Would your wife go? It could be helpful.
#149
Just Joined
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 9
Re: So when does it "get better"
OP - you've certainly initiated an important and thought-provoking conversation although it's sad to see the Canadian experience hasn't worked out in the way you might have hoped. Point taken you feel your situation isn't simply profound homesickness.
There's been a lot of useful commentary about the reasons why to emigrate, people's own experiences, and some sound advice on marriage guidance, etc. But where do * you * go from here? What action will you take? Some suggest it's clear-cut: go back to the UK now. But if this is off the cards for now, what other realisable, time-focused goals can give you some degree of hope and happiness? What steps, say, are needed to go and have a few drinks with your mates in the UK this summer? Also, what new experiences can clear the claustrophobia and help with focus? This forum is a good place to hear other perspectives and it's a positive step you've shared your thoughts. But what else? Maybe set up a Toronto version of the "The London Expat Canadian Meetup Group"? The guys who run it are great and will give you good advice if you're up for it. Finally, yes, don't bottle it up and get some professional help if possible.
I'm sure many will agree there's a community of supportive strangers here who want to share stories and show you're not alone.
There's been a lot of useful commentary about the reasons why to emigrate, people's own experiences, and some sound advice on marriage guidance, etc. But where do * you * go from here? What action will you take? Some suggest it's clear-cut: go back to the UK now. But if this is off the cards for now, what other realisable, time-focused goals can give you some degree of hope and happiness? What steps, say, are needed to go and have a few drinks with your mates in the UK this summer? Also, what new experiences can clear the claustrophobia and help with focus? This forum is a good place to hear other perspectives and it's a positive step you've shared your thoughts. But what else? Maybe set up a Toronto version of the "The London Expat Canadian Meetup Group"? The guys who run it are great and will give you good advice if you're up for it. Finally, yes, don't bottle it up and get some professional help if possible.
I'm sure many will agree there's a community of supportive strangers here who want to share stories and show you're not alone.
#150
Banned
Joined: Apr 2009
Location: SW Ontario
Posts: 19,879
Re: So when does it "get better"
OP - you've certainly initiated an important and thought-provoking conversation although it's sad to see the Canadian experience hasn't worked out in the way you might have hoped. Point taken you feel your situation isn't simply profound homesickness.
There's been a lot of useful commentary about the reasons why to emigrate, people's own experiences, and some sound advice on marriage guidance, etc. But where do * you * go from here? What action will you take? Some suggest it's clear-cut: go back to the UK now. But if this is off the cards for now, what other realisable, time-focused goals can give you some degree of hope and happiness? What steps, say, are needed to go and have a few drinks with your mates in the UK this summer? Also, what new experiences can clear the claustrophobia and help with focus? This forum is a good place to hear other perspectives and it's a positive step you've shared your thoughts. But what else? Maybe set up a Toronto version of the "The London Expat Canadian Meetup Group"? The guys who run it are great and will give you good advice if you're up for it. Finally, yes, don't bottle it up and get some professional help if possible.
I'm sure many will agree there's a community of supportive strangers here who want to share stories and show you're not alone.
There's been a lot of useful commentary about the reasons why to emigrate, people's own experiences, and some sound advice on marriage guidance, etc. But where do * you * go from here? What action will you take? Some suggest it's clear-cut: go back to the UK now. But if this is off the cards for now, what other realisable, time-focused goals can give you some degree of hope and happiness? What steps, say, are needed to go and have a few drinks with your mates in the UK this summer? Also, what new experiences can clear the claustrophobia and help with focus? This forum is a good place to hear other perspectives and it's a positive step you've shared your thoughts. But what else? Maybe set up a Toronto version of the "The London Expat Canadian Meetup Group"? The guys who run it are great and will give you good advice if you're up for it. Finally, yes, don't bottle it up and get some professional help if possible.
I'm sure many will agree there's a community of supportive strangers here who want to share stories and show you're not alone.
(there's a fair few Brits who live in Burlington too, if the OP can get that far..)
Last edited by Siouxie; Jan 19th 2020 at 3:53 pm.