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Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Old Feb 28th 2021, 9:43 pm
  #106  
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Originally Posted by christmasoompa View Post
Just to clarify for the sake of anybody reading, a visa is still required (as is a job offer). And there is a fairly limited list of jobs on the NAFTA list, so may not be relevant to the OP's daughter anyway, depending on what she ends up doing.



No idea why you'd say that, plenty of other people manage it and that's without the advantage of Canadian citizenship.
No, you are wrong, a visa is not required. According to U.S Citizenship and Immigration Services

"If you are a Canadian citizen, then you are not required to apply for a TN visa at a U.S. consulate. You may establish eligibility for TN classification at the time you seek admission to the United States……….at certain CBP-designated U.S. ports of entry or at a designated pre-clearance/pre-flight inspection station."

You obviously don’t know what a U.S visa is do you? A visa is a document obtained from a U.S embassy. Canadians can apply for TN-1 status at an airport or other port of entry, and the Officer makes a decision ‘on the spot’

TN visas are for Mexicans.

Here is the full list of eligible occupations for TN status, it is quite extensive.

Last edited by BananaMonarchy; Feb 28th 2021 at 9:47 pm. Reason: forgot quotation marks
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Old Feb 28th 2021, 11:41 pm
  #107  
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Originally Posted by BananaMonarchy View Post
No, you are wrong, a visa is not required. According to U.S Citizenship and Immigration Services

"If you are a Canadian citizen, then you are not required to apply for a TN visa at a U.S. consulate. You may establish eligibility for TN classification at the time you seek admission to the United States……….at certain CBP-designated U.S. ports of entry or at a designated pre-clearance/pre-flight inspection station."

You obviously don’t know what a U.S visa is do you? A visa is a document obtained from a U.S embassy. Canadians can apply for TN-1 status at an airport or other port of entry, and the Officer makes a decision ‘on the spot’

TN visas are for Mexicans.
Here is the full list of eligible occupations for TN status, it is quite extensive.
Not quite correct. Please be respectful in your responses, thanks. Christmasoompa is a highly experienced and valued member who is conversant with all types of Immigration status and the requirements thereof.

https://www.nafsa.org/_/file/_/amres...8cfr2146.htm(2) Citizens of Canada. A citizen of Canada seeking temporary entry as a business person to engage in business activities at a professional level shall make application for admission with a Department officer at the United States Class A port-of-entry, at a United States airport handling international traffic, or at a United States pre-clearance/pre-flight station.

(2) The spouse or unmarried minor children of a citizen of Canada or Mexico admitted in TN nonimmigrant status shall be required to present a valid, unexpired TD nonimmigrant visa unless otherwise exempt under 8 CFR 212.1.
I would echo what has been said previously, many people from the UK with some semblance of qualifications usually manage to find employment in Canada, particularly if they work in a profession in demand.




Last edited by Siouxie; Feb 28th 2021 at 11:51 pm.
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Old Mar 1st 2021, 12:49 pm
  #108  
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Originally Posted by BananaMonarchy View Post
No, you are wrong, a visa is not required.
OK so to be specific, a job offer is required, a sponsoring employer is required, paperwork to apply is required, and then an applicants passport is required. To most folks, that's a visa application, even if it's actually a status application. My post was just clarifying that there is more to it, so anybody reading doesn't think they can just rock up and start working in the US without any of that being required.

Originally Posted by BananaMonarchy View Post
Here is the full list of eligible occupations for TN status, it is quite extensive.
We'll have to agree to disagree on that one. I personally don't think those jobs out of tens of thousands of possibles is 'extensive'.

Last edited by christmasoompa; Mar 1st 2021 at 1:07 pm.
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Old Mar 1st 2021, 2:33 pm
  #109  
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

TN Status and TN-1 Visa are one and the same:

"TN status or TN visa (Trade NAFTA) is a special non-immigrant classification in the United States that offers expedited work authorization to a citizen of Canada or a national of Mexico, created as a result of provisions of the North American Free Trade Agreement that mandate simplified entry and employment permission for certain professionals from each of the three NAFTA member states in the other member states.[1][2]

A Canadian citizen or Mexican national with a job offer in certain defined professions and who meets the minimal education requirements for each defined profession can work in the United States, for up to three years.[3] The permit potentially may be renewed indefinitely.

Canada's corresponding NAFTA work permit for US citizens and Mexican nationals is sometimes unofficially also referred to as a TN status or TN visa,[4] although this name is technically only a creation of US law.[2]

It bears a similarity, in some ways, to the US H-1B visa, but also has many unique features."

The status as you call it is applied for at the POE by the Canadian and/or Mexican Citizen at entry to the US. No, they do not have to always go to a US Consulate, however, some do. It is a temporary status and must be renewed.

The visa category "Professionals Under the North American Free Trade Agreement" (NAFTA), also known as a TN (Treaty NAFTA) visa, is available only to citizens of Canada and Mexico, under the terms of the NAFTA. Starting in 1989 and continuing through 1993, qualifying individuals practicing one of the professions identified in the Canada–United States Free Trade Agreement (CUSFTA) were able to obtain TC status for legal work in the United States and Canada, creating freedom of labor movement.[15] In 1994, TN status became effective through the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA),[16] which superseded CUSFTA.[17]

Qualifications

A person may be eligible for TN status, if:[1]
  • The prospective employee is a citizen of Canada, or Mexico;
  • The profession is one cited under the NAFTA treaty;
  • The company seeking to pursue TN status with the prospective employee meets qualifications cited under the NAFTA treaty;
  • The prospective employee has been issued a formal, written full-time or part-time offer of employment in the United States, Canada or Mexico;
  • The prospective employee has the qualifications to practice in the profession in question.

Initial period of stay

Once TN status is granted, it is valid for up to three years,[18] but only for the specific employer for which it was originally requested. Changing employers will require to start from scratch with a new application. If employment with a single employer is desired for more than three years, it may be renewed indefinitely.

Prior to October 16, 2008, the initial period of stay for a TN status holder was up to one year only.[19]

Renewal

Renewal is accomplished either by a mail-in renewal within the United States, or by returning to the border and, in effect, presenting a new application.

However, the TN status may be renewed indefinitely in three-year increments, but it is not a permanent visa and if U.S. immigration officials suspect it is being used as a de facto green card, then they may elect to deny further renewals. The set of occupations permitted to petition for TN status is also quite a bit more limited than for the H-1B visa.[20]

Renewal is possible, in theory, indefinitely, but the TN status is not a substitute for permanent residency (a green card), and the border official has the discretion to refuse further renewals if she feels the ability for indefinite renewal is being abused. How this happens in practice depends largely on the mood of the individual border official. Some Canadians have successfully renewed TN status for a decade or more; others have found that after 3–4 years a border official may deny renewal.

America is not the land of plenty and it has even less, if possible, job security than Canada. Ask me, I've been married to a Canuck for nearly 23 years and we are living in the US.

A
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Old Mar 6th 2021, 10:27 am
  #110  
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

The one wrong choice I made was to bring my family to Vancouver Island, something I really regret. You obviously haven't been to this region for a while and not watched the news lately? Did you not see the recent report from the Vic Police - perhaps they do not know what they are talking about either? Crime is rising fast in Victoria. Some people would rather pretend it isn't but sadly it is.
The next time you are in the region take a drive out to Royal Bay, Costco and then the West Coast Road past Sooke to Jordan River, you will have a good idea of what I am talking about. The only sane people in this area seem to be in the Saanich Municipalities on the peninsular.
This region seems to be making a lot of headlines for the wrong reasons laterly. Just about everyone I work with is complaining about what is going on. The place is an absolute mess and looks it (not to mention what they have done to Beacon Hill Park). Quite frankly I can't wait to get out of this place. It's a very expensive dump. Ever since COVID started high density development has accelerated and greenspace is disappearing at an alarming rate - so much for caring about the environment, the silence here is deafening! This place is going to be an absolute zoo soon - all high density development in a geographically constrained region and third world infrastructure. Good luck with that.
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Old Mar 6th 2021, 5:00 pm
  #111  
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

What has information about other people's experiences of living on Vancouver Island got to do with someone who is living in CALGARY and trying to move back to the UK hopefully with her daughter... and asking for general advice ??


Last edited by Siouxie; Mar 6th 2021 at 5:10 pm.
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Old Mar 8th 2021, 4:24 am
  #112  
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Originally Posted by BananaMonarchy
Here is the full list of eligible occupations for TN status, it is quite extensive.
Originally Posted by christmasoompa View Post
We'll have to agree to disagree on that one. I personally don't think those jobs out of tens of thousands of possibles is 'extensive'.
Well it certainly is a work-eligibility status aimed at those with tertiary-education degrees more specialised than a Bachelor of Anything. But it encompasses a reasonably broad list of those.
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Old Mar 8th 2021, 4:25 am
  #113  
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Originally Posted by Siouxie View Post
What has information about other people's experiences of living on Vancouver Island got to do with someone who is living in CALGARY and trying to move back to the UK hopefully with her daughter... and asking for general advice ??

I'm not sure why TN visa is relevant either
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Old Mar 8th 2021, 5:59 am
  #114  
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Originally Posted by Siouxie View Post
What has information about other people's experiences of living on Vancouver Island got to do with someone who is living in CALGARY and trying to move back to the UK hopefully with her daughter... and asking for general advice ??

There has been nothing too specific about Calgary at all in this thread, from the OP or anyone else, aside from some suggestions that the OP might try carpering off to Oakville instead.

But Calgary evidently is, emotionally at least, homebase for the daughter now, after a previous uprooting from the UK 6 years prior.

And it is telling that the OP didn't discuss her daughter's evident emotional investment in her now-local environment -- friends, familiarity with local culture, possibly a romantic interest -- as any aspect of the parental "move the family back to the UK" decision, until that matter was raised by other posters, many posts into the thread. Nor, how much consideration was given to the daughter's POV, before the decision to move back was made.

From the parents we have "Calgary is dull and it's not '˜home'€™ and we miss the vibrancy/food" [etc.] From the daughter we have a 'cri de coeur' that she'd really rather stay.

***

I'm a parent who has moved my family extensively over time, including internationally, and have no doubt that there are details / nuances / complexities that go unmentioned in the OP's posts.

But on the face of what the OP *has* posted, there seems to be an attitude of "she can't make it on her own, how can we get her to see that?", rather than any substantive consideration of what the daughter's views about the move are in the first place.

She's not really an adult yet in the full sense, but she does have legal agency as one. She clearly realises that, and seems potentially, tentatively willing to play that card (not that it would necessarily be in her best interest.) Even if she acquiesces to parental force majeure and boards the plane back to the UK, the OP and her partner will *for years* then 'own' -- fairly or otherwise -- every significant negative experience the daughter encounters in dealing with the UK move...

Surely, even if the parental-level decision remains the same in the end, more consultation and extended staging of the move is in order, to cushion the blow. Including, as many others have suggested, securing Canadian citizenship rights for the daughter, should she ultimately insist on remaining in or returning to Canada.
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Old Mar 8th 2021, 11:26 pm
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Originally Posted by abner View Post
There has been nothing too specific about Calgary at all in this thread, from the OP or anyone else, aside from some suggestions that the OP might try carpering off to Oakville instead.

But Calgary evidently is, emotionally at least, homebase for the daughter now, after a previous uprooting from the UK 6 years prior.

And it is telling that the OP didn't discuss her daughter's evident emotional investment in her now-local environment -- friends, familiarity with local culture, possibly a romantic interest -- as any aspect of the parental "move the family back to the UK" decision, until that matter was raised by other posters, many posts into the thread. Nor, how much consideration was given to the daughter's POV, before the decision to move back was made.

From the parents we have "Calgary is dull and it's not '˜home'€™ and we miss the vibrancy/food" [etc.] From the daughter we have a 'cri de coeur' that she'd really rather stay.

***

I'm a parent who has moved my family extensively over time, including internationally, and have no doubt that there are details / nuances / complexities that go unmentioned in the OP's posts.

But on the face of what the OP *has* posted, there seems to be an attitude of "she can't make it on her own, how can we get her to see that?", rather than any substantive consideration of what the daughter's views about the move are in the first place.

She's not really an adult yet in the full sense, but she does have legal agency as one. She clearly realises that, and seems potentially, tentatively willing to play that card (not that it would necessarily be in her best interest.) Even if she acquiesces to parental force majeure and boards the plane back to the UK, the OP and her partner will *for years* then 'own' -- fairly or otherwise -- every significant negative experience the daughter encounters in dealing with the UK move...

Surely, even if the parental-level decision remains the same in the end, more consultation and extended staging of the move is in order, to cushion the blow. Including, as many others have suggested, securing Canadian citizenship rights for the daughter, should she ultimately insist on remaining in or returning to Canada.
Your post is eloquent and quite accurate apart from my wanting to move to Oakville.

We are feeling terribly bad for this decision against her ; cri de couer! (Nicely put) and your advice for extended staging is good. We are applying for citizenship should she wish to return also.
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Old Mar 9th 2021, 2:18 am
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Originally Posted by kate8kate0 View Post
Your post is eloquent and quite accurate apart from my wanting to move to Oakville.

We are feeling terribly bad for this decision against her ; cri de couer! (Nicely put) and your advice for extended staging is good. We are applying for citizenship should she wish to return also.
But you are still going to force her to leave with you, regardless of her wishes??
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Old Mar 9th 2021, 2:18 am
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Originally Posted by kate8kate0 View Post
...quite accurate apart from my wanting to move to Oakville.
I didn't intend to suggest that you did. Rather, it was intended as a (very gentle) dig at Siouxsie's post in #26, but I'd misremembered her preferred suburb for good UK expat experiences in the GTA (Oakville and Burlington are adjacent conurbations just outside Toronto). Anyway, OT really, and I regret the digression.

Originally Posted by kate8kate0 View Post
We are feeling terribly bad for this decision against her ; cri de couer! (Nicely put) and your advice for extended staging is good. We are applying for citizenship should she wish to return also.
We went through a similarly fraught process with our eldest, nearly a decade ago. The details differed, but there was the same fundamental issue of the emerging autonomy of a young adult at risk, in conjunction with a planned family relocation which made perfect sense at the parental level, but was problematic in other respects.

I am glad I stopped to listen; it ended up working out extremely well with a somewhat redirected plan.
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Old Mar 9th 2021, 6:10 am
  #118  
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Default Re: Moving back home but 18 year old refusing .

Originally Posted by abner View Post
I didn't intend to suggest that you did. Rather, it was intended as a (very gentle) dig at Siouxsie's post in #26, but I'd misremembered her preferred suburb for good UK expat experiences in the GTA (Oakville and Burlington are adjacent conurbations just outside Toronto). Anyway, OT really, and I regret the digression.



We went through a similarly fraught process with our eldest, nearly a decade ago. The details differed, but there was the same fundamental issue of the emerging autonomy of a young adult at risk, in conjunction with a planned family relocation which made perfect sense at the parental level, but was problematic in other respects.

I am glad I stopped to listen; it ended up working out extremely well with a somewhat redirected plan.
Ah I see (re: Oakville). Yes it’s a very fraught time. Your posts have really got me thinking. Thanks again 👍
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