London population is what? 17 million? And 12 murders in one month. Calgary population is one million. And 9 murders just in January. Easy math.

After watching Bowling for Columbine I now refuse to live my life in fear, and ignore the local news and sensationalised media reporting.

I dont know anyone who has ever been murdered, or even know anyone who knows someone who was murdered. Does the crime have a direct impact on your life, or is it one gang killing another, or a drug related turf war?

It doesnt matter if you are in London England or London Ontario, be nice to those around you, and 99.99% of the time they will be nice back. The other .01% are arseholes, ignore them.

I seem to be rambling, so I'll stop now! What was my point? I guess it is that you cant live life by reading the statistics, as they do not take the circumstances into account, you have to go by your gut feel of how safe you feel and what your quality of life is.

Good luck

Iain

it depends on which part of london you wish to live, as you well know some areas are very rough/violent eg tottenham, harringay, harlesden, willsden, east ham, plaistow and i could go on, but then you could be in richmond, kingston, wanstead, purley etc and feel quite safe

agreed yes

Calgary seems like a really peaceful place.. We had 15 murders here (Rio de Janeiro) just last night.. and these are just the published figures.. inofficially, maybe 3 times that...

Hampstead. We are going back to darling, cosmopolitan, weird Hampstead. I don't live my life in fear, and it's not about statistics at all. Just the gut feeling. Besides, I kind of have a problem with the whole Canada growing marijuana and I believe even beating Latin America to it. Funny that: you can't drink in public, you can't take your kid in a bar (not that I do it very often), but the whole place if just a large marijuana plantation, and that's OK.

I agree that I have heard lots about people with qualifications not being able to get jobs in their field in Canada - but on the other hand - if you were a lawyer in Canada and you moved to England - would you be able to practice law in England without taking further education?

What about other professions? I am not trying to start an argument - I am just wondering if English employers accept Canadian qualifications and not the other way around.

I am a paralegal in Canada (another word for an underpaid lawyer!!) a legal assistant. Could I go to England and expect to get hired as a legal assistant in an English law firm, based on my Canadian qualifications?

Looking back at the posts - I would comment that there are lots and lots of reasons why some people get on in Canada (or wherever) and some people don't. Once you have a bad experience it affects you and your whole demeanor I think. If you go for a job interview and you are "up" and positive - probably you are more likely to get the job.

I think moving to a new country works for some people and not for others - for lots of reasons. I don't think anyone was suggesting that Alexandra was lazy or lying - just that everyone has a different experience.

Probably Alexandra and her husband had a bad experience and that made them feel negative and then its like a snowball - it just gets bigger and bigger.

In UK I never ever heard the words 'british experience'. When I first moved to UK and got my first job there, nobody cared that I didn't have 'british experience', they have given me the job based on my qualifications. Regarding the legal profession, I had an Australian friend, who was a lawyer in Australia and he could practice in UK after passing a bar exam. I guess with legal assistant things would be a lot easier.

We are actually quite upbeat and happy people, and normally nothing lets us down. However, being treated as second class, does.

Regarding the issue of persevering and having difficulties for the first two years... why should we have difficulties at all? How many Australians come to UK every year for work? Do they work as cleaners and security guards? No, they get jobs according to their qualifications, doesn't it tell you something?

Our decision is a product of a long discussion and weighing pros and cons. I don't want to be seriously underpaid for the next few years. And my husband deserves better than security guard job for $8 an hour.

I have to say, that comments regarding a personal perception of crime are true, you can choose to live your life in fear of the uncertain or you can get out and say I'm not letting the buggers beat me.

As for qualification, I am a building surveyor and I know that I will have to retrain in order to make the transition from an English environment to a canadian environment. I will do anything even if its washing dishes or sweeping the roads whilst i retrain if thats what it takes.
Trouble is I think that people moving abroad generally do not prepare themselves for the transition, expect that they think that they will walk straight in and fit into a new job immediately.

But the truth is different. If you truly want a new life and you are prepared to endure the hardships for the immediate future then you have a better chance of making it. Expect nothing to be given freely to you. be prepared to do anything to survive, and think laterally. If you skills can be adapted to another career or you can run a business then try that.

Too many people moving abroad have an attitude that 'Hey, I am a qualified this or that, And I will not start again or do any other job unles it's the right one for me'. or are unprepared to change their lifestyles.

I'm not saying this is the case for you Alexandra, its clear that you have had it hard, if you feel that you can no longer fight an unequal struggle, then you must do what you need to, and damn the press. I truly sympathise, and its a brave person to aept the truth and minimise the damage.

I hope you find what you are looking for.
regards and all the best.

Thank you. Funnily enough, it was our attitude at the beginning: we can move mountains, we'll wash dishes, we'll do this and that. My husband went through working in Pizza ('manager' meaning you do absolutely everything for $7 an hour), parking attendant, security guard in god-forsaken place in SE, dockmaster. He still wouldn't mind to do all those jobs, but they don't pay. Now he gets about $1000 a month after taxes. Heating bills, food (don't kid yourself, it's not cheap here), property tax, car insurance, gas, bus ticket, mortgage... Even with my salary we just can't make it.

We wrote and re-wrote our resumes. We applied for every job going. Nothing. Not even interview.

We didn't want anything for free, or a red carpet at the airport. We only wanted to be treated like human beings and to get what we worked hard for.

For the benefit of others reading this post and considering coming to canada, the problem here is not with the government directly but with the professional governing bodies in areas such as law, medicine and engineering. In order to practice in these professions (and earn a decent wage) you need to be licensed in canada, and to be licensed you need a recognised qualification and usually two years of experience with supervision from an existing member of the profession (ie in canada). You can have all the experience in the world elsewhere, but if you do not have a canadian member as a mentor, it doesnt count. Companies want to employ qualified people, or people who they can get qualified, so not having canadain experience is an impediment to this, so they hire others. It is a catch 22 all right, no job = no experience= no job. Typically the only way out of this is to swallow your pride and settle for a low level internship to get on the ladder. This is why emmigrating to advance your career is a non starter. Emmigrate for the lifestyle and accept that things will be financially hard until you are well established. This takes years not months.

The government of course sees a shortage of some skills, (especially as there is a temptation for canadians to head south for the percieved higher wages,) and allows skilled foreigners into the country, but in my opinion it has not done enough to force the provincial regulatory bodies to accept foreign experience, so skilled workers end up getting $8 per hour as security guards, get fed up understandably and then leave the country.

Of course the regualtory bodies are set up to represent the interest of their paying members, and are not going to encourage a huge influx of foreign immigrants, because their members services would become less valuable, so they are not about to change on their own.

Its a bad situation, and anyone coming to canada expecting to find it easy to get a profesional job should be aware of the reality. Do your homework first, find out if your qualification is acceptable for your chosen profession in canada, find out what additional canadian experience you will need. Offer to do internships for little/no money. Do not just show up and expect everything to work out as it did in the UK, this is not the UK, and the professional licensing bodies are very protective. In some cases this is for insurance reasons, or because you would need to know the legal situation in canada for a certain profession (eg canadian building codes etc for structural engineering, or canadian law to be a lawyer), but in others there seems to be no good reason.

All I can say is do not emmigrate for financial or career enhancement, if at all possible visit for at least a month, 6 months is better and see whether the lifestyle is how you imagine it will be, and remember a nice lifestyle requires a reasonable income, so are you prepared to struggle in the short term to achieve this.

Good luck to you

Iain

It's not just for these professions you mentioned. One of my friends is an oncologist (not a doctor, scientist-biologist), she has to work well below her level in University, and once she was even asked to assist a phd student. Her husband, scientist too, is in the same position. I already mentioned my geologist friend specialising in oil sands - a cleaner. What else? Neuropathologist - sewing factory. IT Manager - sales (commission only). Marketing Manager - Secretary. Executive assistant (huge experience in UK working for big companies) - receptionist, temporary. By the way, before getting his law degree, my husband worked in UK as a caseworker for disadvantaged people, refugees, etc., which includes counselling as well. 10 years experience. Security guard. Or, almost forgot: IT systems analyst - night help desk. All these people have 10+ years of experience and perfect English.

Like I said, the situation sucks for many and the government could do more to help by pushing for recognision of foreign qualifications and experience as they encourage skilled foreigners to try canada in the first place.

How many of the people you mention have membership of the respective provincial icensing body. Your PhD geologist friend, is he a member of the APEGGA, without that he will not be hired in the oil industry for insurance reasons.

Neurpatholigist would need AMA certification?

Marketing can be very market specific, canadian experience will be preffered by many employers

IT systems analysis will need canadian qualifications and PEng will help. Plus as you know the IT market has been saturated recently with well qualified candidates, so he is probably not unique in his situation.

I am not having a go at any of these people, but the canadian experience requirement is not a new thing here, surely they knew about it before making a big step like emmigrating?

Iain

Nobody thought it will be that bad. My geologist friend (she is a girl, by the way) would not get into any professional organisations, because her degree is not Canadian. She is currently studies in SAIT on a course that she originally started her study with. She can teach the tutor. But she has to go through this waste of time and money.

Marketing. I work in this field. There is nothing particularly Canadian specific about marketing, the only thing I can say that they are very backward in marketing and advertising, and creativity is not encouraged.

It seems as if Canada is another planet, because none of this nonsense is happening anywhere in the world. And one more thing about 'knowing what we are getting into': I don't want to blame anybody, but we were selected for skilled worker immigration program based on our qualifications that are not accepted. Is that fair? I don't think so.

Canada is backward in many industries, as we discovered. And it's sad that there is a chance for the country to inject a new blood in the shape of wonderfully qualified workforce. But no, they prefer to keep it that way. By all means. But without us. I don't want to beat my head against brick wall for the sake of mountains and scenery.

You were selected by the government as a skilled worker, not by the licensing body. The problem here lies with the governing bodies, but they are only looking out for the interest of there members, and nothing else. All I am saying is that other people reading this need to be aware of the difference between the government saying "come on over", and the professional bodies saying "can I have fries with that"

Has your geologist friend (sorry about my gender confusion) talked to Apegga, mMy degree is not canadian but was recognised by PEO without a problem. Many foreign degrees are acceptable, or will be if you take some type of proficiency test, the real problem is getting the canadian experience.

As far as being backwards, sure there is a bit of a nanny state, but some of the backwardsness is what makes it so attractive to me, I can live without modern progressive levels of rudeness, petty crime and boorishness.

One more thing for others to considder is that the vast majority of jobs in canada are never advertised, so you have to network network network, cold call employers, send resumes (remember a resume and a CV are not the same thing) to people you think might employ you and follow up with a call. It seems pushy to someone from the UK, but you really have to sell yourself.

All the best

Iain

As if we didn't try to network. Guess what happens. I have a 'barely there' contract with my company, can get fired any time (I have 10+ years of experience for investment banks, wireless industry, telecoms, you name it), but the guy in higher position than me, without much experience, without managerial experience was hired because he had a barbecue with one of our company's VPs. And that's what networking means in Canada, nothing else. Let's not mislead people, maybe we can spare some disappointments. What's happening in Canada, is a total violation of any human rights left (which, by the way, don't exist here). I know a German lady, who is a qualified vet with loads of experience. She can't get licenced here, unless she studies again to get Albertan qualification. She is taking Canadian government to the court of human rights, and good luck to her.

and my friend did contact them. to no avail, unless she studies again. We are talking here about world-recognised scientist with a number of high level publications.

Lack of rudeness and petty crime? Not really. My husband was abused by customs officers when he came to Calgary (yes, we thought it was an isolated incident). They asked him to pay a fee ($15) for a block of cigarettes he was bringing from UK, because the cigarettes weren't Canadian. Duty free, but not Canadian. In the process, they went through his luggage, read his personal letters and grilled him about his trip to London.

I was stopped by police once while driving (was totally my fault, I turned too fast, or something). The way they treated me was appaling, screaming, horrible.

You don't hear people swear on the street? You don't see hookers lining up downtown? Try talking to some government officials, and see how they would treat you.

Low crime, nice and polite people, low taxes, fantastic education... there is none of it.