Neelam

Isnt the pool in kingsbury park there anymore? I remember a class mate of mine drowned in that and died. At the time of me living in that house on Kingsbury Road, I was attending Kingsbury Green school, which was a lot closer. Yeah I remember the plough....

dbd33

It's been closed for yonks. I think it's even been filled in now.

Novocastrian

Delicious irony. In my case, the house I was born into is now a police station.

Oh, by the way, here's the link you wanted to the free cars for immigrants story...

http://www.snopes.com/business/taxes/immigrants.asp

startwin

There are people on this forum who jump in and scream "racist" at the first hint of any criticism of the immigration policies in either Canada or the UK. You cannot have a debate or conversation about it, it becomes a slanging match with insistent cries of "prove it" and when you do, they doubt your sources anyway. Even your own personal experiences and/or observations, because you must by lying, of course. A lot of topics seem to get hijacked this way. Shame.

dbd33

Do you have a better proof than that provided by Novocastrian?

G77

If the UK govt can't say for definite how many people have come into the country in recent years, can't see how anyone is going to prove it conclusively....

dbd33

It should be easy enough to demonstrate that, for example, these people got money for cars and subsidized housing. A link to an article in a reputable publication stating that to be the case would be a start. We don't get that though, we only get "my mate told me".

Liana

I believe the reason we don't see these things is because many of the benefits are provided by the local authorities and as such are not Westminster regulated. It is hard to find any info on any LA website about benefits and services for all individuals. All of these things are usually discretionary policies of the local authorities.

Edit: BTW dbd- liked all your posts on this thread also- but are you being serious? I actually hope so but it seems as if some, perhaps including you, believe you are not. What a shame.

dbd33

Serious about what? I did grow up in and around Burnt Oak, the Plough was a National Front pub and is now a tandoori house, the pool has been filled in. Lower property prices are, I think, the number 1 reason for people to move here from the UK and that, in making the move, they trade intangibles such as history, culture, family and access to the countryside, for tangibles such as big screen televisions. (Just yesterday my partner said wistfully "I wish we could live in England" but we can't because we can't bring ourselves to give up having all this stuff). I do have bad teeth.

otoh, I know my tractor isn't really like a Lotus 7 and I was joking about the Indian pretending to be from Sri Lanka.

I do think the people who complain about immigrants/benefits/etc in the UK (and, indeed, in Canada) do a very poor job of making their case. I don't think there's a real shortage of available information but I think there's a shortage of reliable information supporting the argument that while England has gone to the dogs due to allowing people to come in, Canada will be better off for letting people who complain about that come here.

Googling for "council house residents by ethnicity" produced 1,160,000 hits. Obviously collating them would be a massive task but if I was trying to make the case that "the darkies/Poles/Irish/Gypos/whoever took all the houses" I'd focus on an area with a significant population of whichever minority I had it in for and dig for local information. Those who argue the "gone to the dogs" viewpoint don't even make that much effort, it's all "I know it coz I know it", innit?

btw, I think it's possible to use the term racist without screaming. My attitude to Chinese drivers is casually racist, I think they're very bad at steering and indicating, but I don't have to shout that opinion. (Except when following one).

Liana

Your original posts on this thread about motivation etc- agreed with them that's all. Not the ones you are referring too about your personal life

rae

Back to the OP question.

Push:
can't remember

Pull:
don't know

i feel i am at the peak of the rollercoaster, impossible now to return to the start or get off.

depressing reading the posts for push, as are the posts for pull.

Neelam

spot on! Absolutley agree with you. Nothing can be discussed without hurles of racism.

Suzey

First you say this:

...
then you say this:

Which is it you have the problem with? Legal or illegal? Methinks it is both! Being the child of immigrants, and about to become one yourself, it's a shame you're not a little more tolerant of those trying to make a better life for themselves.

Suze

Neelam

The Polish example was on a different subject - it was the subject of the EU and the EU ECONOMIES. I was talking about how many immigrants from other EU countries the UK are getting in comparison to the percentage of immigrants that other EU countries get. UK has a higher percentage.

Secondly when I was talking about illegals getting in the backdoor - I wasnt talking about the same Polish people (they are part of the EU), I was talking about countries that are NOT part of the EU...

It is not about "who i have a problem with" its about how these things affect the country (UK). Think about it...

1. The UK is very small - geographically small. Canada and the USA are big. Geographically big.
2. Because of this, development is limited and the cities become crowded.
3. When cities are crowded, there are less and less jobs to go around.
4. Those that are qualified in the UK are finding themselves fighting for jobs with people who are new to this country
5. And then the social benefits issues come in and the education quality, the yobs, the housing crises, yadda yadda yadda

These problems exist in other countries, but not so profound as in the UK. Canada and the USA have a lot more opportunities, simply because they are bigger countries and and people tend to want to make a success of themselves and not live in council housing for the rest of their lives.

So yes, both legals (immigrants from the EU) AND illegals contribute to this problem. But it isnt necessarily their fault. Its just how it is...

jempee

actually dont need the link as i know of this happening in 'the real world'. also friends worked for the council so have some inside 'hidden' info as well. Oh what it must be like to only believe in the written word.