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midwifery in canada

Old Feb 5th 2008, 10:14 pm
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Smile midwifery in canada

Hi
I am a student midwife in the uk,qualifying in feb 09-- hopefully!! Alas there are no jobs for us at the moment even though there is a shortage of 8,000 midwives! Barmy!
We are seriously considering emigrating to canada. I would love to hear from any midwives about their practice and how midwifery is developing over there and also women/mums thoughts on the service.
Karen
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Old Feb 6th 2008, 12:15 am
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

Hmmm..................Canada is a broad canvas and I cant tell you what the whole picture is, but there is no hospital based midwifery as you know it in the UK. I am a Uk trained midwife and I am currently in the process of sitting the nursing exam so I can work as an Obstetric Nurse. There are a handful of midwives in NS, they are not well understood, often thought of as either a Dr or an untrained hippy . Here certainly, it is totally independant practice and care is often handed over at the door of the ambulance. Other Provinces are better equipped to deal with midwifery and have better systems in place, but you still really need to offer full time, oncall commitment and pay a lot of taxes, not to mention jump through hoops to get recognised here. You either pay for a 3-12 month placement with a group of midwives or you do a course. Its costly, its time consuming and it is not the job you are used in the UK. And as a midwife who has worked for 13 years, in both UK regional centres with 5000 deliveries a year, and a small birthing unit in the sticks in New Zealand - I wouldnt work here newly qualified in a full time independant context.

Now if you are dual qualified, then you can return to nursing and do everything but the delivery, but have the shift work, the regular pay, someone else do your taxes etc comfort of a job. I cant offer you a real perspective on that, as I havent started work yet, but having spoken to other UK midwives who have done the same, they are quite happy in nursing. It will suit me because I have young children and dont want to do anything more than 2 shifts a week.

Do you know what area of Canada you are interested in, because if you do, then google the midwifery regulatory body for that province and email them. BC has a lot of midwives, but again, still independant of the healthcare system. I thnk things will change, but I dont know when.

Sorry to not be able to offer you much hope here! Google some organisations and ask questions. It may well suit you well, hope so.

Also remember that the UK is in need of midwives, which means there are always jobs, some shift flexibility and better pay than most countries, so you need to think about moving when you are hot property there!! Also most employers/regulatory bodies would want to see at least 1-2 years post grad work in the country you trained in. So a long term goal maybe.

Now if you were to ask me about Australia or New Zealand - a whole 'nother barrel of fish. Same system for the most part, as the UK. Easy to get into, takes no time to get work permits and you are away. Think about it. Pay not as good as the UK, but not dissimilar. Again, would need at least a year post grad though.

Good luck!!!
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Old Feb 6th 2008, 3:30 am
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

Originally Posted by Poppy2
There are a handful of midwives in NS, they are not well understood, often thought of as either a Dr or an untrained hippy . Here certainly, it is totally independant practice and care is often handed over at the door of the ambulance. Other Provinces are better equipped to deal with midwifery and have better systems in place, but you still really need to offer full time, oncall commitment and pay a lot of taxes, not to mention jump through hoops to get recognised here.
Going slightly off topic (but not much!) - this seem intriguing poppy - so who assists women to give birth then? Is 'midwifery' not wholly included in your health care ? What is the normal practice? Do a woman normally stay within the care of her GP/hospital/consultant? Does she 'choose' to use a midwife instead of the above? Sounds a bit of a nightmare for a well qualified UK midwife (like so many other professions ).
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Old Feb 6th 2008, 4:27 am
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

Originally Posted by ann m
Going slightly off topic (but not much!) - this seem intriguing poppy - so who assists women to give birth then?
Usually doctors -- sometimes GPs, often obstetricians -- in hospitals.

Is 'midwifery' not wholly included in your health care ?
No. As far as I understand, in most provinces midwifery falls outside of the provincial health care insurance plan. That is, if a mother wants a home delivery, with a midwife in attendance, she has to pay for it out of her own pocket.

For an Alberta example, see post #8 of this thread, in which Carolyn said she was paying $4,000 for a midwife.

The exact details vary from province to province. There are a limited number of facilities in which a mother can give birth in a hospital, but in a room that looks and feels like home, with a midwife in attendance. Then, if complications arise and more intrusive intervention is required, the mother can be transferred to an operating theatre or whatever.

But hospital deliveries, with a doctor in attendance, are the norm.

Postscript. The doctor doesn't hang around for the entire labour. Nurses monitor the mother's progress for most of the labour.

Last edited by Judy in Calgary; Feb 6th 2008 at 4:35 am.
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Old Feb 6th 2008, 2:20 pm
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

Originally Posted by karenbabycatcher20
Hi
I am a student midwife in the uk,qualifying in feb 09-- hopefully!! Alas there are no jobs for us at the moment even though there is a shortage of 8,000 midwives! Barmy!
We are seriously considering emigrating to canada. I would love to hear from any midwives about their practice and how midwifery is developing over there and also women/mums thoughts on the service.
Karen

http://ce-online.ryerson.ca/ce_2007-...ay.asp?id=2161
This link may help you. I am living in Ontario, I am also a Scottish trained midwife. I did consider midwifery over here but it really is quite different to what I am used to! I used the think 12 hour shifts were bad enough. The midwives ( I take my hat off to them for their devotion) are on call 24/7. They mostly work for 10 months of the year (constantly) to provide all antenatal/labour/postnatal care for the women they have booked, and then are off for 2 months. Although I imagine they must be knackered by then! One midwife I spoke to here was pleased that she got one weekend off call per month! It is quite well paid though!
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Old Feb 6th 2008, 6:07 pm
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

Perhaps PM minimeeze a UK midwife who is going to
take her Midwifery Exams at UBC this spring.
http://britishexpats.com/forum/showt...ight=minimeeze

Hope that helps.
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Old Feb 6th 2008, 8:28 pm
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

Originally Posted by Yoong
Perhaps PM minimeeze a UK midwife who is going to
take her Midwifery Exams at UBC this spring.
http://britishexpats.com/forum/showt...ight=minimeeze

Hope that helps.
Yoong
You beat me to it!

Feel free to PM me for any more information. I'm a midwife currently in the UK and am planning to move to BC later this year to practice as a midwife (provided I pass the exams).

As previously mentioned by others, it all depends where you are considering moving to. Midwifery is relatively new in Canada in terms of being a recognised profession. The process of getting your qualification recognised over there is a long arduous task which is pretty time consuming and expensive. So, why am I doing it?? I feel the prospects and job satisfaction of a midwife in Canada are so much more than those of a midwife in the UK. Midwifery is practised in a way this country could only aspire to - women centred one-one care. Similar to how an independent midwife would practice here. Yes, it involves lots of on-calls which I don't mind (and have done previously), and the pay is better. I am sick of the pressures of the NHS and being stretched in more ways than I can cope with.
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Old Feb 6th 2008, 9:20 pm
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

Originally Posted by minimeeze
You beat me to it!

Feel free to PM me for any more information. I'm a midwife currently in the UK and am planning to move to BC later this year to practice as a midwife (provided I pass the exams).

As previously mentioned by others, it all depends where you are considering moving to. Midwifery is relatively new in Canada in terms of being a recognised profession. The process of getting your qualification recognised over there is a long arduous task which is pretty time consuming and expensive. So, why am I doing it?? I feel the prospects and job satisfaction of a midwife in Canada are so much more than those of a midwife in the UK. Midwifery is practised in a way this country could only aspire to - women centred one-one care. Similar to how an independent midwife would practice here. Yes, it involves lots of on-calls which I don't mind (and have done previously), and the pay is better. I am sick of the pressures of the NHS and being stretched in more ways than I can cope with.
i quite agree. I love the idea of continuity of care and i wouldnt mind on calls either. There are no jobs available to us when we qualify next year although things could change. It was suggested we became doulas or breastfeeding buddies or care assistants in general nursing, all important ,but ive sacrificed lots to train to become a midwife! Utter madness!
On earlies tomorrow on delivery suite, so im logging out and getting some much needed shut eye! Stay in touch
Karen
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Old Feb 6th 2008, 11:39 pm
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

The Canadian approach to midwifery is based upon the New Zealand model, which I know a lot about as I practiced there for the last few years. There are Core midwives in NZ that are in the hospital, that is the difference. Women have fabulous care from their midwives, but the demands are huge. In NZ you book as early as you like with a midwife, she is then paid by the government for the client's care (in NZ) this adds some sense of entitlement on behalf of women and there is a culture of sometimes almost daily contact from some clients. Any obstetric incident, whatever time, day or night, you would be expected to visit, assess, transfer your client. You would be for the most part a Homebirth midwife, with no hospital to provide you with liability, and no supervisor on call to ring and ask advice from.. Not to say you are thrown to the lions, but it is a totally different way of practicing. It is truly independant work. Continuity is one way of looking at it, and we all would love that, but there is no yard stick in the UK midwifery system to give you even close to some idea. It is nothing like Community based Team practice. Your client could be at home, you are 30 minutes away from a hospital and you have a shoulder dystocia - where is your back up, when did you last do your updating on emergency drills, how much experience do you have and how do you deal with situations when the worst case scenario happens. Because they of course do, regardless of all attempts of the most proficient staff.

In context, you are their first port of call for everything which is wonderful when you love your client and not so when you dont. You might plan 4 births a month, but have them all come together like a train wreck and be up for days at a time, which has implications for your performance of course. IN BC I understand there are more groups of midwives, so some aspect of team care can be achieved. And as for well paid, yes, but they are taxed as much as 45% from what a midwife who returned to NZ from Canada told me. And you pay a lot of money to show evidence that you are a safe practitioner and are up to date - there is no *in house* training or education budget.

With a family it is very hard to offer those hours, and be a homebirth based midwife. The continuity us wonderful and the care for women is excellent, I had my last baby in NZ under this sort of system, but I have seen the other side of it and the stress, tax returns, insurance and little back up is enough for me to not want to be a midwife for some years to come.

You definately need to look into which province you want to work in first, because they all expect very different things from you, but in my understanding, maybe minimeeze can help here, it costs between $5-10,000 to start the process of assessment of your suitability, interviews, placements etc.

I would seriously suggest Oz or NZ, easy to get into and more like the UK systems. You have to really think about it and look more into it. Even get in touch with midwives, via forums, in those countries. I was in touch with 2 midwives in Nova Scotia, where there are about 5 practicing, they would have loved me to join them but the system here is so new that no-one knew what I would need to do! But having established the role, I knew it wasnt for me at this time.

And there are jobs elsewhere if you can move, right? Dont do anything like doula work etc after the course, you need to consolidate your practice so you get a good looking CV or resume. Even if it means a commute to Hereford or Birmingham.

Hope your earlies go well and you have some good food for thought about what you want and where you want to go! Midwifery is a fabulous job with lots of options to travel, but in my experience Australia and NZ are easy to get into and far cheaper!
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Old Feb 17th 2008, 7:15 am
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

I've created a Wiki article on Midwifery, based on the contents of this thread as well as the websites of the Midwives Associations of the Canadian provinces and territories.

I'm not a midwife, have never been a midwife, and do not aspire to being a midwife. However, I have felt for quite a while that the Wiki section would benefit from an article on midwifery. We get questions about midwifery with some regularity.

I've tried to be careful in quoting and paraphrasing the posts in this thread and summarizing the provincial websites. However, it would be surprising if the Wiki article was correct and complete in its present form. If there are errors or omissions, it would be great if qualified posters would correct them.

Many thanks.
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Old Feb 17th 2008, 11:23 pm
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Nice job Judy! If I find anything to add I will let you know, but that offers a sound overview.
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Old Feb 18th 2008, 7:04 pm
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

Originally Posted by Judy in Calgary
I've created a Wiki article on Midwifery, based on the contents of this thread as well as the websites of the Midwives Associations of the Canadian provinces and territories.

I'm not a midwife, have never been a midwife, and do not aspire to being a midwife. However, I have felt for quite a while that the Wiki section would benefit from an article on midwifery. We get questions about midwifery with some regularity.

I've tried to be careful in quoting and paraphrasing the posts in this thread and summarizing the provincial websites. However, it would be surprising if the Wiki article was correct and complete in its present form. If there are errors or omissions, it would be great if qualified posters would correct them.

Many thanks.
Fantastic article, and very informative. Have edited a little on the BC info and added another link. Hope that's ok!
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Old Feb 18th 2008, 8:31 pm
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

Originally Posted by minimeeze
Have edited a little on the BC info and added another link. Hope that's ok!
Thank you for adding to the article, minimeeze.
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Old Dec 17th 2008, 1:33 pm
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

Hi there. I have been a member of expats for years, but lapsed... I am now able to ressurect my dream to go to BC as a midwife. I have done my exams but failed one small one that they are letting me do again this year. Alot of the BC girls I did my exams and such with had qualified and worked in NZ and they said that the system is very much the same (in bc anyway).

I have kept in touch with a few girls that are there practicing and some that have not made it due to time and cost. The system to become registered in BC has changed this year. They are letting me do the old system that I originally started called PLEA. But the new system will allow for there to be more internet based courses and practice for the examination part of the assesment.

To say they make you "jump through hoops" is probably an understatement!!! I think though on the other hand for a newly qualified bright eyed young midwife it would be the place to go. The pay is very good compared to the uk and much more than an obstetric nurse. I have done alot of team midwifery in the UK on a caseload model and it sucks. I love the work but the pay so lets it down.

A midwife in BC is like and independent midwife in the uk except you bill the government for the work.

The wikki article was excellent I have to say, so many people ask me about midwifery in Canada now I know where to send them. Thanks
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Old Dec 17th 2008, 1:42 pm
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Default Re: midwifery in canada

Originally Posted by Madwife
Hi there. I have been a member of expats for years, but lapsed... I am now able to ressurect my dream to go to BC as a midwife. I have done my exams but failed one small one that they are letting me do again this year. Alot of the BC girls I did my exams and such with had qualified and worked in NZ and they said that the system is very much the same (in bc anyway).

I have kept in touch with a few girls that are there practicing and some that have not made it due to time and cost. The system to become registered in BC has changed this year. They are letting me do the old system that I originally started called PLEA. But the new system will allow for there to be more internet based courses and practice for the examination part of the assesment.

To say they make you "jump through hoops" is probably an understatement!!! I think though on the other hand for a newly qualified bright eyed young midwife it would be the place to go. The pay is very good compared to the uk and much more than an obstetric nurse. I have done alot of team midwifery in the UK on a caseload model and it sucks. I love the work but the pay so lets it down.

A midwife in BC is like and independent midwife in the uk except you bill the government for the work.

The wikki article was excellent I have to say, so many people ask me about midwifery in Canada now I know where to send them. Thanks
I completely understand the 'jumping through hoops' bit you referred to as I did the PLEA in May this year. Expensive process isn't it???

Where are you planning on settling? We are going to Abbotsford, BC, hopefully sometime soon!
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