This is sh*t
 

and the 'civilized' countries of the world shouldn't stand for it...

Libya protests: 140 'massacred' as Gaddafi sends in snipers to crush dissent

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I agree, it's f**king disgusting. I heard army snipers have been picking off protesters like ducks in a pond.

Apparently the Libyan security forces have refused to fire on fellow Libyans and Gaddafi is using African mercenaries to do his dirty work.

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Gaddafi has always been mad, bad and extremely dangerous, but all that was forgotten because, would you believe it, he has oil.

Now what are the greedy Western bastards going to do about it?

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Latest figure over 200 dead in Benghazi, apparently the govt. forces have been using mortars and heavy machine guns on the protesters.

What can "civilized" countries do? probably nothing. Maybe hope that they aren't next?

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No doubt it'll be swept under the international carpet just as TIananmen and the events of the June the fourth were... In the interests of economic peace....

And countless other atrocities...

Or is this what usa is looking for as a next step in their master plan for world domination????


Wait wAtch and see

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Oh I'm sure they'll be working out how to capitalise on it, eddie.

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What would you have the 'civilized' countries of the world do?

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I agree, little the rest of the world can do except mouth platitudes, which is what has been happening.

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Exactly. There is only one country in the world with the military capability to intervene, and that's the US.

There is absolutely no chance of them attempting that and if they were mad enough to try, they would be accused of doing it 'for the oil'. First few posts in this thread is evidence enough of that.

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How about refusing to purchase their oil, stopping their supplies of weapons, technology, etc - if you want to be really extreme try cutting supplies of medicine and yes I know this will hurt the population.

These places need a revolution, and looks like one is coming sooner than I thought.

Over to you, how would you deal with a govt slaughtering its own people?

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The US don't have the money nor the inclination (and how could they win anyway - they can do nothing with Iraq nor Afghanistan). China has the economic sway but what's in it for them? Ultimately, a few hundred dead here and there is sadly irrelevant to any government. The contagion has astonished me... Israel must be bricking it........

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Sanctions... yeah that's really going to work in the short term, given that we imposed sanctions on Libya in the past for over a decade.

How would I deal with it? I wouldn't, outside intervention is a no win situation.
Even if it escalated to the point where thousands were being killed, unless you are prepared to support large scale military intervention, something that would take months to get into position, there is nothing that you can realistically do about it.

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Sadly, I have to agree with you. History and experience have shown us that unless the people themselves - probably at incredible cost of lives - take matters into their own hands, there is not much the rest of the world can do, except maybe be ready to help them get back on their feet if and when needed.

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To be honest..i say leave them to it. It is their country, their problem. We lost our eldest son in Afghanistan July 2009 and did his loss and the UK's intervention help? Did it sh.te. We have lost more brave boys and still there is no end in sight. We can't leave or the fallen have been lost for nothing. As to new problems, I totally agree, we should stay well clear.

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My grandad who was in Tripoli for a while during WWll always told anyone who'd listen that a third world war would start there...

Sanctions??? They work against the general population... Starve a starving country of essential medical supplies to top it off...

If certain countries hadn't sold them weapons in the first place would they be i. This situation???:sneaky:

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:( Probably Congolese on loan to him from Mugabe's Zimbabwe in return for oil

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Firstly, sorry to read about the loss of your brave son. :(

Completely agree that the West should steer well clear

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Agree, this is always the catch 22. People who are already in a terrible position suffer more.

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Thanks.

One of the many reasons we want to move to Oz for a resh start. Not to forget...that will never happen, but in honour of his memory, do the things he also wanted to do. It is no secret I have been trying to get to Oz for some time but things have not quite worked out. This time it will...it has to.

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I'm sure it'll work out for you this time. :) Good luck to you and your family, mate. :fingerscrossed:

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Are you not a westerner living in a western country? :confused:

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The only external intervention that would have any possibility of success would be Arab forces under a UN flag. However this is unlikely to happen as a lot of the Arab nations are dealing with their own civil rest, are too small, or are led by autocrats who would not want to rock the boat as they might be next.

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Just out of interest, and this isn't directed at you in particular but any posters who think 'we' should 'do something'..... 'do something' against who exactly?

There seems to be an assumption that these events are all the people against all parts of government, which is pretty obviously nonsense.

Just for arguments sake, lets say that NATO managed to get large scale forces on the ground in Libya. They are then faced by a large demonstration in favour of the the Government, with attacks on anti-government supporters... what would you expect them to do?
Wade in on the side of the anti-government people.. or sit back and watch?

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Shouldn't be directed at me at all. Just to clarify. :)

As well as carrying a high possibility of failure the legitimacy of external intervention is always suspect.

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I guess one reason why some western governments might get involved is to try and prevent a scenario where tens of thousands of Libyans end up setting sail across the Mediterranean towards Europe. I don't think they will though.

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Italy already has that problem with Tunisians and Libyans WILL start coming. Europe's reaction to this will be interesting.

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I wrote that a bit poorly, I meant that the governments wont get involved. I do think the Libyans will start fleeing.

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I knew what you meant.
Governments in France, Italy and Spain are about to face some tough decisions about what to do with thousands of migrants from North Africa. Italy already has some serious issues with economic migrants from Africa, breakdown of government in those countries will see a surge in that, potentially in the tens of thousands.

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What nation would you prefer to be the world's dominant power? History shows us that there has always been one. 100 years ago it was the UK, before them it was Spain etc. Right now it is the US. Would you prefer China to be running the world, or maybe India?

I'm happy that the US are the only world power right now because the alternatives are not pretty.

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Agree, very sad. Good luck Oz wannabe1 in your move.

Lets see what the outcomes could be, Status Quo, Islamic Republic, another "Strongman" or full democracy. The last one is the least likely IMO.

Not much the west could do, it would end up like Northern Ireland, or Iraq. Troops arriving to protect locals quickly seen as "occupying force" and the enemy.

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Yes I am. Does that mean I have to agree with or am responsible for everything Bush and his cronies did?

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No one's ever done anything about Mugabe and his henchmen murdering all and sundry, they're not going to do anything about Libya. However evil these leaders are, it's no one else's business regardless of how the rest of the world feel about the atrocities. The only people who can do something are those that live there. Everyone moans when the US throw their weight about towards a country because they don't like the way they do things (Bay of Pigs, Granada etc and then the same people moan that no one does anything in places like Libya.

You either have certain countries throwing their weight around or you don't, you can't pick and chose.

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But they do, usually based on if said country has Oil. Is Mugabe better or worse than Saddam was?

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Just as bad imo. And that's my point about picking and choosing. The US do make that choice but that doesn't make it right. You either go in and sort out all the countries that have atrocities (and who makes that decision anyway) or you steer clear. As far as I'm concerned, none of us outside the country concerned have the right to do anything more than complain on a public forum.

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Well as the nation of Libya was pretty much made up by the Italians and British, what's the chances of it ripping itself to pieces now?

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I suspect that you've benefited in some way from their policies. That's what I found odd when you railed against "greedy Western bastards" (not a mention of Bush and his cronies - nor even Obama).

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I thought that was obvious from the sentence preceding it; apologies if it was not.

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No it wasn't obvious.

It could have referred to us Westerners who like cheap petrol to fuel our cars and cheap goods manufactured using cheap oil.

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I don't think we will get hard-line mussies in Egypt (army too strong) or Bahrain (a US surrogate and too small) but it is possible in Libya (depending on how the army goes), Tunisia and Yemen.

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Jesus mate, nothing like flogging a dead horse.

(BTW, compared to most on here I'm a tree-hugging hippy and I don't drive. End of conversation.)