Greed is good!
Oct 24th 2010, 5:36 am
#16
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 15,526
Re: Greed is good!
I could write an essay on why this is all so wrong... not that I actually begrudge WR getting the dosh... its more the way the Football system at the top end is set up these days.
Fact is there are more people that call themselves Man Utd/Barcelona/InterMilan supporters than ever actually attend live.. if they do end up going, it will be like a once in a lifetime pilgramage to Mecca.. They feel close to their chosen team as Customers rather than supporters because of their Cable TV subscription, from which the money trickles down through to the Clubs. This is at the expense of lifelong leagues, as the traditional money used to be shared around more evenly.
Fact of the matter is, as Football starts to take of in Asia, their clubs stand very little chance of becoming World Greats, which is a shame.
Just think of the overall sporting prowess that Australia as a Nation usually manages to achieve. Imagine if the majority of that talent was channeled into Football like most Countries in Europe. Alas It's very unlikely that a Club of World proportions can emerge from Asia or Australasia now the way the Cable TV companies dictate the market.
Problem with this back in England is, a lot of 100 year old clubs are going to go out of Business... all because consumers overseas are paying Cable tv money to watch the top clubs. Like I said it's got nothing to do with the paying attending punter.. in fact most followers outside of the top flight just wish the top clubs would POQ to Europe take Sky with them and restore a semblance of the Status Quo.
Fact is there are more people that call themselves Man Utd/Barcelona/InterMilan supporters than ever actually attend live.. if they do end up going, it will be like a once in a lifetime pilgramage to Mecca.. They feel close to their chosen team as Customers rather than supporters because of their Cable TV subscription, from which the money trickles down through to the Clubs. This is at the expense of lifelong leagues, as the traditional money used to be shared around more evenly.
Fact of the matter is, as Football starts to take of in Asia, their clubs stand very little chance of becoming World Greats, which is a shame.
Just think of the overall sporting prowess that Australia as a Nation usually manages to achieve. Imagine if the majority of that talent was channeled into Football like most Countries in Europe. Alas It's very unlikely that a Club of World proportions can emerge from Asia or Australasia now the way the Cable TV companies dictate the market.
Problem with this back in England is, a lot of 100 year old clubs are going to go out of Business... all because consumers overseas are paying Cable tv money to watch the top clubs. Like I said it's got nothing to do with the paying attending punter.. in fact most followers outside of the top flight just wish the top clubs would POQ to Europe take Sky with them and restore a semblance of the Status Quo.
Oct 24th 2010, 6:52 am
#17
Proudly Deplorable
Joined: May 2003
Location: Alloha snack bar
Posts: 24,246
Re: Greed is good!
If there is no market then there is no product. Football fans have made the current situation happen.
Enjoy.
Oct 24th 2010, 6:55 am
#18
no stressin no fussin....
Joined: Aug 2007
Location: Fantasy Island....
Posts: 12,616
Re: Greed is good!
Oct 24th 2010, 9:03 pm
#20
beach bum
Joined: Feb 2008
Location: Snowy Mountains, NSW
Posts: 1,995
Re: Greed is good!
This is what the fans think...................
http://www.overstream.net/view.php?oid=a7trrvljnqei
Please note - adults only due to some swearing!
http://www.overstream.net/view.php?oid=a7trrvljnqei
Please note - adults only due to some swearing!
Oct 25th 2010, 2:51 am
#21
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 15,526
Re: Greed is good!
In fact 1,000's of traditional fans have been disenfranchised because of the high costs of going to a game. especially travel and admission..
How many Leeds and Portsmouths does the English system want before it wakes up to itself. I'm 100 pct blaming Sky for most of these problems.
How many Man Utd followers really want their arch rivals Liverpool to go into admin ? None that go I bet. Because following Man Utd will be a poorer experience without looking forwards to two Liverpool clashes per season.
In fact there is real trouble looming. People are waking up to how good the German Bundesliga is now. It now has the average highest attendance of any Football league in the world. They Allow Standing as well. The Football League could find the rug pulled out from under it quicker than they realise.
Last edited by ozzieeagle; Oct 25th 2010 at 2:56 am.
Oct 25th 2010, 4:40 am
#22
Proudly Deplorable
Joined: May 2003
Location: Alloha snack bar
Posts: 24,246
Re: Greed is good!
I dont think they are football fans at all, more like customers. The fans are the people that go. I'm fairly confident that with any given Televised Premier league game has more overseas viewers watching than viewers in the UK.
In fact 1,000's of traditional fans have been disenfranchised because of the high costs of going to a game. especially travel and admission..
How many Leeds and Portsmouths does the English system want before it wakes up to itself. I'm 100 pct blaming Sky for most of these problems.
How many Man Utd followers really want their arch rivals Liverpool to go into admin ? None that go I bet. Because following Man Utd will be a poorer experience without looking forwards to two Liverpool clashes per season.
In fact there is real trouble looming. People are waking up to how good the German Bundesliga is now. It now has the average highest attendance of any Football league in the world. They Allow Standing as well. The Football League could find the rug pulled out from under it quicker than they realise.
In fact 1,000's of traditional fans have been disenfranchised because of the high costs of going to a game. especially travel and admission..
How many Leeds and Portsmouths does the English system want before it wakes up to itself. I'm 100 pct blaming Sky for most of these problems.
How many Man Utd followers really want their arch rivals Liverpool to go into admin ? None that go I bet. Because following Man Utd will be a poorer experience without looking forwards to two Liverpool clashes per season.
In fact there is real trouble looming. People are waking up to how good the German Bundesliga is now. It now has the average highest attendance of any Football league in the world. They Allow Standing as well. The Football League could find the rug pulled out from under it quicker than they realise.
Sky provided a product, the fans bought the product. If fans did not want the way Sky set things up then they should have boycotted it. Simple.
Yes, the EPL has big trouble looming but it is of their own making, and if it does fall apart, something new will come out of it.
Oct 25th 2010, 6:51 am
#23
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Mar 2006
Location: Jeddah, Saudi Arabia
Posts: 1,717
Re: Greed is good!
I dont think they are football fans at all, more like customers. The fans are the people that go. I'm fairly confident that with any given Televised Premier league game has more overseas viewers watching than viewers in the UK.
In fact 1,000's of traditional fans have been disenfranchised because of the high costs of going to a game. especially travel and admission..
How many Leeds and Portsmouths does the English system want before it wakes up to itself. I'm 100 pct blaming Sky for most of these problems.
How many Man Utd followers really want their arch rivals Liverpool to go into admin ? None that go I bet. Because following Man Utd will be a poorer experience without looking forwards to two Liverpool clashes per season.
In fact there is real trouble looming. People are waking up to how good the German Bundesliga is now. It now has the average highest attendance of any Football league in the world. They Allow Standing as well. The Football League could find the rug pulled out from under it quicker than they realise.
In fact 1,000's of traditional fans have been disenfranchised because of the high costs of going to a game. especially travel and admission..
How many Leeds and Portsmouths does the English system want before it wakes up to itself. I'm 100 pct blaming Sky for most of these problems.
How many Man Utd followers really want their arch rivals Liverpool to go into admin ? None that go I bet. Because following Man Utd will be a poorer experience without looking forwards to two Liverpool clashes per season.
In fact there is real trouble looming. People are waking up to how good the German Bundesliga is now. It now has the average highest attendance of any Football league in the world. They Allow Standing as well. The Football League could find the rug pulled out from under it quicker than they realise.
The asians will not start watching German football unless they have the top players in the world playing there, its all about prestige, so apart from Bayern Munich i can't see that happening.
Oct 25th 2010, 9:10 pm
#24
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 15,526
Re: Greed is good!
I don't agree with your reasoning. Just because a person does not attend games does not make them a fan. You are a Crystal Palace fan yet you do not attend their games. Does this make you any less of a fan? I am a huge Springbok rugby fan yet I only make it to a few of their games - usually when they are in my part of the world. Does this make me any less of a fan?
Sky provided a product, the fans bought the product. If fans did not want the way Sky set things up then they should have boycotted it. Simple.
Yes, the EPL has big trouble looming but it is of their own making, and if it does fall apart, something new will come out of it.
Sky provided a product, the fans bought the product. If fans did not want the way Sky set things up then they should have boycotted it. Simple.
Yes, the EPL has big trouble looming but it is of their own making, and if it does fall apart, something new will come out of it.
Oct 25th 2010, 10:21 pm
#25
Officially Bewildered
Joined: Nov 2006
Location: Blue Mountains, NSW
Posts: 5,523
Re: Greed is good!
I still consider myself, and always will, as a reet propa fan, pet. Its nothing to do with the means of watching, even if you've never seen them live, its to do with watching them from the heart.
A fan is someone who follows their team through thick and thin, up and down the divisions, no matter what. And when you're a Sunderland fan, unfortunately there's a lot more thin than thick and a fair amount of down and up and down again. But it doesn't matter, because they're my team and they always will be.
Oct 26th 2010, 2:55 am
#26
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 15,526
Re: Greed is good!
A fan isn't someone who necessarily goes to the games. I haven't been able to go to a Sunderland game since the late 80s (and the last time I saw them live was at Leeds, I had to be very quiet especially as my die hard Leeds supporting friend could only get me a ticket in the Leeds end)
I still consider myself, and always will, as a reet propa fan, pet. Its nothing to do with the means of watching, even if you've never seen them live, its to do with watching them from the heart.
A fan is someone who follows their team through thick and thin, up and down the divisions, no matter what. And when you're a Sunderland fan, unfortunately there's a lot more thin than thick and a fair amount of down and up and down again. But it doesn't matter, because they're my team and they always will be.
I still consider myself, and always will, as a reet propa fan, pet. Its nothing to do with the means of watching, even if you've never seen them live, its to do with watching them from the heart.
A fan is someone who follows their team through thick and thin, up and down the divisions, no matter what. And when you're a Sunderland fan, unfortunately there's a lot more thin than thick and a fair amount of down and up and down again. But it doesn't matter, because they're my team and they always will be.
In my view and those that go to the games, there is a world of difference. Check it out with people that actually go. Sunderland is a great example actually. With the advent of Internet TV you may get the opportunity to start paying to watch your Club pay every week again.. On line season tickets are in the pipeline. Then you'll be a supporter again, that should make most genuine geographically disadavntaged fans very happy. There is a lot of work being done on this much needed project in the background presently.. Viewing opportnities are going to change considerably in the next 3/4 years and the change will be brought around mostly by the Clubs at Championship level, it will involve the rest of the Football league.. Sky will have to stick that one right up their clacker. The Catylyst for this will be when the big 6 financially motivated clubs POQ to the European league.
If you spend any time on Clubs forums you will see what I'm putting forwards is quite an accepted view.
Last edited by ozzieeagle; Oct 26th 2010 at 2:58 am.
Oct 26th 2010, 5:46 am
#27
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Mar 2006
Location: Jeddah, Saudi Arabia
Posts: 1,717
Re: Greed is good!
Ok lets get precise about this.... Fan yes Follower yes... Supporter no... No or very little money coming from you to the club. Same with me... I dont pay to follow my club hence I'm no longer a Supporter. Some of the more hardnosed supporters will actually deam you to be a Customer. Although that label is generally aimed at the bigger merchandised based clubs.
In my view and those that go to the games, there is a world of difference. Check it out with people that actually go. Sunderland is a great example actually. With the advent of Internet TV you may get the opportunity to start paying to watch your Club pay every week again.. On line season tickets are in the pipeline. Then you'll be a supporter again, that should make most genuine geographically disadavntaged fans very happy. There is a lot of work being done on this much needed project in the background presently.. Viewing opportnities are going to change considerably in the next 3/4 years and the change will be brought around mostly by the Clubs at Championship level, it will involve the rest of the Football league.. Sky will have to stick that one right up their clacker. The Catylyst for this will be when the big 6 financially motivated clubs POQ to the European league.
If you spend any time on Clubs forums you will see what I'm putting forwards is quite an accepted view.
In my view and those that go to the games, there is a world of difference. Check it out with people that actually go. Sunderland is a great example actually. With the advent of Internet TV you may get the opportunity to start paying to watch your Club pay every week again.. On line season tickets are in the pipeline. Then you'll be a supporter again, that should make most genuine geographically disadavntaged fans very happy. There is a lot of work being done on this much needed project in the background presently.. Viewing opportnities are going to change considerably in the next 3/4 years and the change will be brought around mostly by the Clubs at Championship level, it will involve the rest of the Football league.. Sky will have to stick that one right up their clacker. The Catylyst for this will be when the big 6 financially motivated clubs POQ to the European league.
If you spend any time on Clubs forums you will see what I'm putting forwards is quite an accepted view.
I do agree tho about the European league, that will happen in the not to distant future.
Oct 29th 2010, 1:14 pm
#28
Forum Regular
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 68
Re: Greed is good!
It is obscene but football fans are mainly to blame. They slavishly and sheeplike buy the tickets and merchandise, read the newspapers who write about these guys and their WAGS, lap up all the media coverage etc. Football is now a billion $ industry basically created by the fans.
Football is the opiate of the masses in the UK and the fans have got a setup they created.
Football is the opiate of the masses in the UK and the fans have got a setup they created.
English football is now a worldwide brand and unfortunately the losers are the people of England. You are ultimately right in saying people have a choice to buy a ticket but when you look at generations of families who have supported their clubs being recently priced out of attending matches.
Even so, the money from attendees is minimal compared to income from TV and worldwide merchandise. Its all good for the millions in Asia who are now the target market, and the expats in Australia etc with foxtel but the powers that be have completely ripped off the people closest to them.
The obscene salaries of the players has not helped 'the peoples game'
Imagine if AFL games (or equivalent) suddenly cost 70-80 AUD to attend with little concessions for kids and players earning millions per annum and walking round as if they are untouchable?
Oct 29th 2010, 1:18 pm
#29
Forum Regular
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 68
Re: Greed is good!
A fan isn't someone who necessarily goes to the games. I haven't been able to go to a Sunderland game since the late 80s (and the last time I saw them live was at Leeds, I had to be very quiet especially as my die hard Leeds supporting friend could only get me a ticket in the Leeds end)
I still consider myself, and always will, as a reet propa fan, pet. Its nothing to do with the means of watching, even if you've never seen them live, its to do with watching them from the heart.
A fan is someone who follows their team through thick and thin, up and down the divisions, no matter what. And when you're a Sunderland fan, unfortunately there's a lot more thin than thick and a fair amount of down and up and down again. But it doesn't matter, because they're my team and they always will be.
I still consider myself, and always will, as a reet propa fan, pet. Its nothing to do with the means of watching, even if you've never seen them live, its to do with watching them from the heart.
A fan is someone who follows their team through thick and thin, up and down the divisions, no matter what. And when you're a Sunderland fan, unfortunately there's a lot more thin than thick and a fair amount of down and up and down again. But it doesn't matter, because they're my team and they always will be.
Oct 30th 2010, 12:07 am
#30
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 15,526
Re: Greed is good!
Assuming you are having a bit of fun and fishing for a bite...so I might aswell give you one.
English football is now a worldwide brand and unfortunately the losers are the people of England. You are ultimately right in saying people have a choice to buy a ticket but when you look at generations of families who have supported their clubs being recently priced out of attending matches.
Even so, the money from attendees is minimal compared to income from TV and worldwide merchandise. Its all good for the millions in Asia who are now the target market, and the expats in Australia etc with foxtel but the powers that be have completely ripped off the people closest to them.
The obscene salaries of the players has not helped 'the peoples game'
Imagine if AFL games (or equivalent) suddenly cost 70-80 AUD to attend with little concessions for kids and players earning millions per annum and walking round as if they are untouchable?
English football is now a worldwide brand and unfortunately the losers are the people of England. You are ultimately right in saying people have a choice to buy a ticket but when you look at generations of families who have supported their clubs being recently priced out of attending matches.
Even so, the money from attendees is minimal compared to income from TV and worldwide merchandise. Its all good for the millions in Asia who are now the target market, and the expats in Australia etc with foxtel but the powers that be have completely ripped off the people closest to them.
The obscene salaries of the players has not helped 'the peoples game'
Imagine if AFL games (or equivalent) suddenly cost 70-80 AUD to attend with little concessions for kids and players earning millions per annum and walking round as if they are untouchable?
It's actually going to kill off Clubs,. When a 100+ year old club like Portsmouth with 18,000 regulars is threatened, it's time to have a good hard look at the league structure. Thats hardly going to worry anyone in Asia, but for the local fans its a disaster.