Gollywogs are back!

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Old May 21st 2012, 1:01 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by moneypenny20
But to me the first one is a doll which is played with as though the child is playing with another child, recreating lifelike scenarios, therefore should be lifelike. The second one is a cuddly toy which isn't lifelike, in much the same way that an Elmer the Elephant isn't lifelike.

Children do not differentiate between colours in people until they have been taught to do so by circumstance. Show a gollywog to a child and they will see a cuddly toy with a happy face, they will not see a negative representation of a black person unless forced to do so by an adult. It only becomes a racist toy when an adult evaluates it against history and personal perception. Imo anyway.
To be sure it's a cuddly toy, but the reason, to me, that it isn't like Elmer the Elephant, is that it copies an ugly racial stereotype used to denigrate black people in Europe and the US for a long time. Had it been any other sort of cudddly toy, then fine, but not that particular image. It just isn't the same as an elephant, or whatever.

I agree that children won't know unless they are taught. I had a golliwog as a child and it certainly didn't turn me into a racist. But now we are adults, and we do evaluate things against a history that a small child simply can't be expected to know. I wouldn't give one to my child, knowing what I now know as an adult. Again, it isn't the colour that is the problem, it's the nasty stereotype.

Last edited by Lion in Winter; May 21st 2012 at 1:08 am.
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:02 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Man, even though I think gollywogs are wrong, they still make me laugh...

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Old May 21st 2012, 1:04 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by GarryP
It's a doll, it's a caricature, or did you think Barbie was accurate? Getting bent out of shape about it is majorly missing the big picture and the big issues. Net positive in my book - particularly compared to ghetto 'culture' that they'll be exposed to a few years later.
I'm not sure what point you are trying to make here. Yes, a golly is a caricature, one that has been used historically in a derogatory way toward black people. Why pick that particular caricature for your cuddly toy?
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:06 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by renth
Man, even though I think gollywogs are wrong, they still make me laugh...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KJnzCs1l5Wk

Yeah. It's a great pity they had to use that particular image - it could have been anything really, but no, they had to go down that route. Sigh.
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:08 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Ok.... Golliwogs are kids cuddly toys... As a child I couldnt stand them, they gave me the heebee jeebees.... Does that make me a racist today? I dont like clowns either....

A childs cuddly toy is something that gets tucked up in bed wih them, gives them reassurance, something to cuddle/love... Like teddy bears...

See where I'm going?????????
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:10 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter
Yeah. It's a great pity they had to use that particular image - it could have been anything really, but no, they had to go down that route. Sigh.
Exactly the kind of reaction one would expect in 2012... You are Watching that out of historical context with perfect hindsight
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:10 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by eddie007
Ok.... Golliwogs are kids cuddly toys... As a child I couldnt stand them, they gave me the heebee jeebees.... Does that make me a racist today? I dont like clowns either....

A childs cuddly toy is something that gets tucked up in bed wih them, gives them reassurance, something to cuddle/love... Like teddy bears...

See where I'm going?????????
Not really, no.

You could make a cuddly toy out of anything. This particular cuddly toy is made in the form of an ugly racial stereotype that has been used to denigrate black people for a long time. Why go out of our way to copy that for a toy? It makes no sense.
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:11 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by eddie007
I dont like clowns either....
Clownist!
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:11 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by eddie007
Exactly the kind of reaction one would expect in 2012... You are Watching that out of historical context with perfect hindsight

And this is bad why?

We learn and advance, do we not? There are many things as a culture that we no longer consider acceptable.
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:12 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter
I'm not sure what point you are trying to make here. Yes, a golly is a caricature, one that has been used historically in a derogatory way toward black people. Why pick that particular caricature for your cuddly toy?
The toy came first, then individuals, such as yourself, decided that it was derogatory (together with Enid Blyton casting them as thieves). It's not the doll, the problem lies elsewhere. You deal with the problem, not the ephemera.
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:17 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by GarryP
The toy came first, then individuals, such as yourself, decided that it was derogatory (together with Enid Blyton casting them as thieves). It's not the doll, the problem lies elsewhere. You deal with the problem, not the ephemera.

Attitudes towards non-whites, by whites, changed. I would say that that was a net gain, given what those attitudes used to entail. Those images used to be perfectly acceptable in the context of a highly racist society. Things have changed, so yes, people then decided that the use of images of racial stereotyping is now unacceptable. Time has moved on.

You will not get rid of racism by not creating gollliwogs. Rather, continuing to find them acceptable is more of a symptom of the work yet to be done.
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:18 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by renth
Clownist!


I wonder if they do midget dolls to represent the midget population or amputee dolls?

If you didnt like amputees, you could be an 'amputeeist'.
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:21 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by Cheetah7


I wonder if they do midget dolls to represent the midget population or amputee dolls?

If you didnt like amputees, you could be an 'amputeeist'.
You can still find those little TROLL dolls... What were they called? Gonks?
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:23 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by eddie007
You can still find those little TROLL dolls... What were they called? Gonks?
I had a Gonk! I loved my gonk, wonder if they still make them?
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Old May 21st 2012, 1:24 am
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Default Re: Gollywogs are back!

Originally Posted by Cheetah7
I had a Gonk! I loved my gonk, wonder if they still make them?
Yes they do
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