Mikeyc

Did you not read the part where I said “go educate yourself”?

UK and Ireland were NOT the only countries to have free movement when the new member states joined in 2004- Sweden also allowed them straight away.

Most other countries quickly followed and have moved their restrictions (Finland, France, Greece, Ireland, Portugal, Spain, Sweden, and UK).

And if you actually look into it, it’s not so much restricted or controlled, it just means a more formal process, i.e.: a new member citizen can work in Germany, but they MUST apply for a work permit (which in 99.9% of cases will be granted).

Also, the most a country can apply the restrictions for is 7 years (most have removed them after only 4 years).

Mikey

BAY

Oh wow I missed out mentioning Sweden. Please except my humble apologies.
So when and where did you last live in the UK. I'll say it again you just don't seem to be able to comprehend or understand the problems uncontrolled immigration causes ... and I'm not talking about racial issues ... I'm talking about infrastructure issues, resource issues, running out of landfill sites to put the rubbish etc etc.

Mikeyc

I came back to Australia in October after living over in Ireland (and with staying with some family in the UK). All I noticed was how much the economy had boomed thanks to the new EU citizens (especially in Ireland).

Having a partner who is Polish I also noticed the ignorance and mentality of a lot of people in the UK and Ireland (by the way, his mother tongue is English with fluent Polish, French and German), yet so many times in both the UK and Ireland I heard people complain about all the “illegal polish” that have come over, simply displaying their lack of knowledge, seeing as it is impossible for a Polish person to be illegal in the UK!

I also noticed the attitude my partner was faced with when handing in his CV for jobs, they seen his surname name and assumed he was some Polish migrant who is only good for factory work (yet he is actually much more qualified and more intelligent than most of the locals I met). Only when I told him to talk first and state is nationality on forms as “EU Citizen” instead of Polish, he was then snapped up.

The new EU citizens work (work harder than most of the locals), pay tax and contribute to the society.

To sum it up, I found a lot of Brits don’t get the EU, they are happy to reap the benefits, but not prepared to provide.

I also find it ironic that an immigrant like yourself is whinging about other immigrants.

Mikey

Nu-Shooz

Have to agree with you there Mikey. Nothing wrong with immigrants working in the UK, just like us working in OZ or wherever.
My mate returned to UK from OZ and has done nothing but complain about the immigrants I think we forget what we are at times

ozzieeagle

Yes I've come to realise this, especially after my last visit to London. You would not believe what Brunswick has become.... all the best things about London rolled into one Suburb... especially the Multi Cultural aspect.. within walking distance of where I live. I love walking down Sydney Rd Coburg, and hearing Italian spoken every single time I go there.

Cheers Devlin.

BristolBeary

Hey Mikeyc - I know exactly what your saying but I don't think your quite so understanding of the flip side

Its not that Brits dont get the EU - they don't want the EU. The UK benefits the EU more than it benefits the UK is the general opinion. I think the term uncontrolled is maybe misleading - its controlled as in its part of the law - but uncontrolled as in how it affects peoples daily life.

There are 500 million people within the EU - the UK is packed with 65 million people already - where do you think the majority of people move to within the EU? I'm guessing the UK.

Australia controls migrants by what skills are required - countries within the EU don't - that is probably what people mean by uncontrolled?

Mikeyc

I understand what he/she is saying, but he/she is whinging about the eastern Europeans in general and how they put a strain (forgetting to metion the economic benifits they have had). They can’t win, one minute people complain about them coming and 8 living in 1 house, so would you prefer them to live in a house each and cause a strain on accommodation?

If the UK wants to leave the EU, then good for them, it’s clear by seeing that they won’t change to metric, euro etc etc, that they are happy being themselves and British, but at the same time it annoys me how the then go on to enjoy the perks of the EU (just look at the amount living in Spain etc, or buying property within the EU).

The EU is seen in a lot of aspects as ONE Immigration zone, anyone applying from outside the union is subject to very strict controls, and it is much harder to get into the EU than it is into Australia.

Services may be stretched, but services are also stretched in Australia and most other countries (should we stop migration).

Most of the jobs the Polish are doing in the UK are jobs that Brits don’t want; if they all left straight away it would cause even more problems. The Polish and other EU citizens will only continue to go to UK and other countries as long as there is a demand for workers (already they are heading back to Poland as it starts to pick up now).

If the UK is so worried about all these migrants coming for work, then maybe they should get all those Chavs off their arses and into employment, that way there will be no jobs for the Polish people and they will not head there – That’s the only reason they go, for work to earn money, I mean you don’t think they do for the weather do you?

Mikey

BristolBeary

Yes it does my head in when I hear people single out nationality's claiming they are "taking our jobs". There is a factory not far from where I lived outside Bristol with loads of Polish and Somalian workers - working all hours. Then you walk past the job centre crawling with brits who think working in a factory is beneath them and claim benefits instead!

I see two things from this - the foreign workers are hard working honest people who are doing the best they can and .... if we got slack free loading brits to get off there arse they wouldn't be the demand for so many foreign workers to pick up the slack in the 1st place.

bcworld

You are spot on Mikey.

I bet the Daily Hate Mail has never ever published any statistics related to the economic benefits migrant labour has brought to the UK - that wouldn't sell papers or suit their agenda. From my personal point of view, I am very glad they came - as you say, they often work in jobs others turn their noses up at, despite being educated to a far higher level - and they do a much better job at the same time - that's all that matters to me.

Of course at the same time, they pay taxes, like any other citizens. Infrastructure may take some time to catch up, but anyone citing this and fleeing to Australia is a hypocrite pure & simple - it's not long ago since we were within 12 months of running out of water in Brisbane - that's an infrastructure problem!

Many people on this site, often those still in the UK, wax lyrical about fortress Australia and how tough its policies on immigration & benefits for new migrants are - a lot of it is utter nonsense (IMO). I'm told all immigrants can speak English....maybe they should try getting in a cab at Sydney Airport! New migrants aren't entitled to any government funds? First home owners grant? Baby bonus anyone? Stamp duty concessions? $15k right there!

Again, I think the media is responsible for these perceptions - it's constantly hammered home just how much of a pushover the UK is, no where else has similar issues right!?

Mikeyc

I would of assumed also that most EU citizens moving within the EU head to the UK too, but having a look it seems different,

The majority of movement within the EU is to Spain and not to the UK, and the best part is – it’s mainly Brits LOL (Germans second), with an estimated over 1,000,000 Brits having relocated to Spain (now that must cause a strain), as opposed to only 380,000 eastern Europeans in the UK (the 600,000 number has been proven to be an exaggeration).

Movement within the EU is pretty balanced, from the Benelux nations, Britain and Germany they move to to Spain, Portugal, Southern France and Italy. From eastern countries they move to Germany, France, Ireland, UK, Italy and Spain).

Mikey

NKSK version 2

Good post.

"I'm leaving the UK and going to become an immigrant and add to the pressure on Australia's infrastructure because I can't stand immigrants arriving in the UK and adding pressure to the UK's infrastructure."

Rastis

Interesting thread… It has made me think, am I racist... I use the word ‘wog’ when talking to my mates, some who are Italian or of Italian descent, it’s not said out of hatred for Italians, it’s an accepted word used by Italians, Greeks etc themselves. I guess it all comes down to the delivery of that word or the context that word is used in.

Now with the Aboriginal friends that I have, I would never call them ‘Abo’ not even in friendly banter, it’s just not done, yet they themselves call some of the Aboriginals in the community ‘Boongs’ who intern call them ‘Poly waffles’ because they mix with the whites.

I do understand the anger towards Aboriginals, I try so very hard not to get drawn into the racist comments towards them, as I said above, I have Aboriginal friends, but living in a community with a large Aboriginal population of mainly dysfunctional families, it’s hard, especially when you’ve been on the receiving end of violence perpetrated by a member of one of these families.

It annoys me that my taxes go towards propping some of these people up. They are given so much in the way of funding and opportunities not afforded to non-indigenous peoples and they waste it all and then want more.

It saddens me that the adults in their community set such low standards for their children. It’s not uncommon to go to my local deli and be confronted by a young child asking if I have a spare couple of bucks, while his parents are waiting around the corner, boozed up, needing extra cash to buy more alcohol, and I can see this kid in a few years time, being one of those adults hiding around the corner while his kid is begging for him.

I really feel for my Aboriginal friends, they are good law abiding citizens, don’t bleed the system for everything they can, teach their kids respect and yet would still be looked on with suspicion when entering a shop. I admire them; their world must be so difficult. Not only do they have to endure the racism of whites but also the non-acceptance of their own people, it really is a dammed if you do, dammed if you don’t scenario…

In conclusion…I still can’t decide whether I am racist or not, I have the same thoughts regarding white people who have no respect for themselves, who bleed the system dry, who come up with excuses for being the way they are, and walk around with a chip on their shoulder and think the world owes them (and there is a lot of them).

I guess the difference is when I make a comment about someone who is white, it’s voicing an opinion. Make the same comment about someone who is black or of an ethic background, then it is termed racism.

E3only

I have 2 people I know work with me (not same team) who say the same thing......it's uncontrolled - whatever that means. I have not experienced it but wanted to make a point

E3only

Interested, this thread is quickly turned into what ‘words’ are racist and what not. Eg. There was some problem with cricketer Symonds being called Monkey in India I think. In India, there is a monkey god they say – which is not racist for them. But for us here, it was.

The point is – yes there are words that tantamount to being racists but these have been defined as new words get added. Its more so the attitude, respect or lack of, tolerance etc that define racism not just a word.

Mikeyc

This is exactly what annoys me, they want equal rights and equal should mean equal. The same for everyone, white or aboriginal.

I don’t like the fact that some Aussie kid can work his arse off to get a high mark and get into Uni, yet an Aboriginal person can lay about and get in via a special aboriginal access program (more than is available for white people).

Pop down to any local TAFE, or even online and look at the fees, for White students you pay, for Aboriginal students you get it FREE, no fees at all!

Now if that’s not racism (against white people) then I don’t know what is!

Mikey