Originally Posted by odyssey

the one I was going to go with is a start up (and I also thought long and hard about the guarantee component of small company who may go bust and larger company). that said its the son of my landlord and we were perhaps going to do a deal where OH actually installs it all and they just provide a layout and wire up. At this stage its just thinking of what to do - my bills are SO high

Originally Posted by Broad Shoulders

Hello stranger!

hmmm.... The issue of getting a larger inverter versus smaller panel configuration is one of the most painful headaches of all solar companies in our industry. The truth is that if the company is worth its salt it would not offer this option. The idea of an "expandable system" (ie: adding panels at a later date) probably makes sense in laymans terms, but in the reality of so many other things in the solar industry it is quite a bad idea....why?

1/ You're not really getting bang for buck. If you're buying a larger inverter, then you are most likely also paying quite a bit more for that extra capacity. You're much better off buying a system where the panels have been configured to match and balance with the inverter. If you have $5k to spend (for instance) spend the $5k on the largest kW system you can get for that money.

2/ The best solar companies will install your system in a configuration and setting that ensures you get the maximum performance from the components you have. If you are buying an expandable system, then there is a chance that the installer is going to set it up in a way that doesn't get the most out of your current setup, as they will be preparing it for an upgrade, to make it easier when that time comes.

3/ It is not ideal to mix and match panels. To get the most out of your system, you should really be looking to make sure all your panels are the same spec (wattage, voltage). Right now, the most common panels are 190 & 200W, however 18 months ago the most common panel was 180W, which are now very hard to come by and likely to be obsolete within 6-12 months. Meaning, if you decide you want to upgrade your system in 2 years time, your panels might either be obsolete or more likely very difficult to come by and therefore VERY expensive.

4/ Cost of actually expanding your system at a later date is quite a shock to those who thought it was a good idea back in the day. We regularly have people call us who had installs done somewhere else wanting us to expand their system for them. When we show them how much this would cost (see panels explanation above), coupled with the extra installation charge and very minimal return on the rebates it generally is enough to make the customer realise it is just not worth their while.

If I were to make one recommendation to people looking to buy solar, then it is if it's too cheap to be true, then it probably is! I would recommend everyone to shop around and get as many quotes as possible, then pretty much scratch off the bottom 40-50% cheapest quotes and work from there.

There are many problems with the industry I am in and there are a lot of cowboys who prey on those who are not very educated in the industry. Because it is a very specialist industry it makes it extremely difficult for the average Joe to know much about what is real and what is bull. Additionally, there are a lot of providers out there who have appeared in the last 12 months off the back of the rebates (similar to the insulation program) who are just looking to make a fast buck. This entails making their prices super cheap to get as much business as fast as possible. In some ways the consumer is also partly to blame, as the hunger to get the cheapest systems possible often means they are unknowingly entering the dragon's lair where no one can be trusted.

I'll PM you with some more info for you!

Originally Posted by steve pickett

Hi Broad shoulders,
Can I ask which part of Oz are you in? I am looking to move across soon and I am just about to start with my CEC installers course, having just received the GSES book. I can do most online. Any advice would be good.

Thanks Steve.

Originally Posted by Broad Shoulders

Hi Steve,

I'm in Brisbane. If you are looking to use your accreditation as your main means of income I would think very carefully about moving to NSW. They have just cut their generous feed-in-tariff from a $60c gross FiT to $20c gross FiT. Since they have done this NSW has become one of the smaller uptake states in the country so business for you will be pretty scarce.

Originally Posted by hoofie2002

One possibility - Clipsal

I've seen the equipment used and it's not cheap junk - the inverters are very good quality.

Originally Posted by steve pickett

No, its Perth or Brisbane for me, depending on work! I am a spark working in Las Vegas as a contractor at the moment, with a solar installers licence here. I recently got my electrical workers licence via the Adelaide route, and will be ready, pretty soon, to make the move.

Originally Posted by LittleKittyCat

Hi Broad Shoulders,

I wonder if you could clarify something for me. We have been looking in to getting both solar hot water and solar electricity. We live in NSW (I know that you are in QLD, but hopefully as you work in the industry you will be able to help). I know that back in October the gross feed in tarrif was dropped from 60c per kWh to 20c, but in reading around over the past few days, it seems that the NSW government target of 300MW has been reached, meaning that the 20c per kWh feed in tarrif has been scrapped altogether. Am I reading this right, or have I misunderstood? Or is it the rebate that has been scrapped?

I would say as a household we use 25-30kWh per day, the vast majority being water heating (which we can reduce with the solar hot water) and the pool pump. I guess even if there isn't a feed in tarrif, it is still worth getting the solar electricity because it will reduce the cost of our monthly bills. My father in law has offered to pay for them for us, so the payback period doesn't apply.

Any advice you had about how to find a good and honest installer would be most helpful too!

Thank you!

Originally Posted by LittleKittyCat

Hi Broad Shoulders,

I wonder if you could clarify something for me. We have been looking in to getting both solar hot water and solar electricity. We live in NSW (I know that you are in QLD, but hopefully as you work in the industry you will be able to help). I know that back in October the gross feed in tarrif was dropped from 60c per kWh to 20c, but in reading around over the past few days, it seems that the NSW government target of 300MW has been reached, meaning that the 20c per kWh feed in tarrif has been scrapped altogether. Am I reading this right, or have I misunderstood? Or is it the rebate that has been scrapped?

I would say as a household we use 25-30kWh per day, the vast majority being water heating (which we can reduce with the solar hot water) and the pool pump. I guess even if there isn't a feed in tarrif, it is still worth getting the solar electricity because it will reduce the cost of our monthly bills. My father in law has offered to pay for them for us, so the payback period doesn't apply.

Any advice you had about how to find a good and honest installer would be most helpful too!

Thank you!

Originally Posted by Broad Shoulders

Yeah, when govts make changes they like to make it as confusing for everyone, even those already in the industry! My reading of the recent announcement is that the 300MW cap that was set was actually orientated towards the previous Feed in tariff (FiT) of 60c gross. Back when NSW announced the ceasing of the 60C FiT they stated a few conditions for people to be eligible.

1/ You needed a signed contract AND non-refundable deposit all processed with your installer prior to midnight 27th October 2010.

2/ Your installer must have submitted (not have approved but submitted) the grid-connect request forms to your energy supplier by 18th Nov 2010.

3/ This was capped at 300MW, so once this capacity was reached then NSW Govt were within rights to knock back any outstanding applications.

Given that on the day of the announcement (27/10/10), the already installed capacity was at 190MW and that estimations suggest there was more than 100MW of orders taken on the 27th alone that cap was always going to be reached. In short, this means that even if a customer and installer abided by conditions 1 & 2 they still were not guaranteed to get the 60c Gross FiT.

This is a very long winded way of saying this does not affect you. The 20c Gross FiT will carry on AND you WILL get it. The announcement made by NSW regarding the cap was only relevant to the old scheme.

In regards to your usage. You would need to be looking at a system in the vacinity of 6-7kW to completely eliminate your current usage. However this all depends on when you use power really. The best scenario is where no one is at home during the day and you can feed near to everything back into the grid and get paid for it, then only consume in the evening when it is off-peak rates. Obviously, you can go for more smaller and affordable systems that will significantly reduce your current bills.

Shoot me a PM if you want any more info

Originally Posted by Broad Shoulders

Ok, correction. Unfortunately govts make announcements so ambiguous that it makes these types of readings very difficult to fully comprehend.

I've asked our GM of Power Generation and he has confirmed that in fact, if you sign up now for a solar system, you will NOT receive the the new 20c Gross FiT, as this DOES fall under the 300MW cap!

Technically you are entitled to nothing in terms of FiT from the State Govt.

However, this is still to be confirmed but highly likely that your power company will pay you a FiT rate (could be anything from 7c to 20c and this will likely be a Net FiT rather than a Gross one.

So in theory you should still get something back for your feed in, however it will be quite a reduced amount from what was previously on offer!

Originally Posted by LittleKittyCat

If it is okay, I might just pm you later to see if you would give us a ball park figure that we should be expecting to pay. I live in eternal fear of being ripped off, a couple of tradesmen have tried to charge us way over the odds for things since we got here.

Thanks again!

Originally Posted by Jacqui

I would like to get solar power, but am worried we won't live in the house long enough to pay it off and it will end up being a rather expensive exercise. We used to average 25-30 kWh per day but that jumped a couple of years ago (after our extension was built) and is usually nearer 40kWh per day, although we've had two frightening bills that were 60kWh! We don't have a pool. We do have aircon but only use it when it's really hot (mid 30's) and have a wood fire so try not to use the heating too much. I reckon we would need a 10-12kW system, I dread to think how much that would cost.