Ceri

In a lot of "country" towns here in Aus the drug problem is very high and so is youth suicide (males more than females).

There is a big prob here.

My own feelings - I have no time for them, everyone has a choice in this life. I am angry why my rates and tax money are spent on pandering to their whims.. ie needle bins in toilets - hello it's illegal.

And before anyone has ago at me, I grew up where drugs where rife , and no I did not have a smooth childhood either - I was always running away from home, we did not have the warnings that kids have today. I could have taken drugs, like so many of my friends did (one of my then school friend jumped in front of a train while on drugs - dead ... was just 14 ) .

we all have choices no matter if you're poor, rich, abused , and I do think governments should take a tough stand " a no tolerance attitude" when it comes to drugs.. sorry I'm with Singapore law on this one - stop pandering - get tough- it works in the long run

cheers

downunderpom

Totally agree. Time they accepted responsibility for their own actions. We all have 'the choice', nobody holds these wankers down and injects them. Get a backbone!

RichS

recently both here and in the UK I noticed the increase in the blue lighting in car parks, stairwells etc.

A guy in our office said he'd recently requested them in his unit stairwell as it was attracting junkies (apparently the blue light prevents them from seeing their veins).

Its never nice to see things like that anywhere. Personally I wonder what you can do about it. I tried heaps of drugs when I was younger, but would never touch anything thought to be 'addictive'. The wife less os, but we have both smoked and drunk a fair bit, and genetically you imagine your offspring take after you - in my case thats a worry.

I would say that the most disturbing thing I have ever seen was a 50+ barmaid from our local works pub staggerring around ASDA drunk as a fool at 2 in the afternoon. Don't ask me why, I can't explain, except to say that when she was working in the pub she was an almost frail looking lady who wouldn't say boo to a goose. It just looked so sad.

bondipom

I only spent 2 days in Singapore and found cocaine use rife amongst expat banking types despite the threat of the death penalty. Just an observation and not proper comparative stats.

Sunlover

Absolutely - it certainly was NOT my intention to sound heartless
I was just really surprised at seeing it .

When I thought about it afterwards I realised that it was probably the first time I have actually seen people in the process of getting stoned rather than stoned already - and in a public place in broad daylight.

I actually commented to a work colleague that I thought it was a tragic waste of two young lives. I certainly would have noticed the incident even if they weren't young and good looking but the fact that they were just made it even more sad.

noodle

Yes, we do all have choices, I agree. I do sympathise that people have been so desperate that they end up choosing to take heroin in an attempt to escape what ever their problems are and they deserve to be helped to an extent. I do know of people who have just progressed onto the stuff and I find it hard to sympathise when they are robbing houses, pensioners, pick pocketing etc. They are desperate for their fix and its everyone else who has to suffer.

Vee

But Sunlover, it's sad when anybody has a problem. A drug problem, a booze problem. And it happens everywhere at any time of the day. I just dont' think that people should be expected to be in a "dinghy hole" just because they have a problem. Sunlover if you had seen an old man drinking Tennants extra strong lager on a park bench in sunny ol' Adelaide do you think you would have written about it here? I'm not having a go, really I'm not, but I do just wish that people would realise that a drug problem is a PROBLEM.

Are you all saying that people who are alcoholics should be "in a dinghy hole" somewhere as well? Or is more "acceptable" being an alcoholic because booze is acceptable and we all drink and have gotten drunk in the past?

Quite a few people have said they have lived in London and never seen anything as disturbing as what Sunlover described. You've never seen people "off their faces" in London? My god, where abouts in London did you live? Did you ever go out of your house? I live, work and go out in London and I see it almost every day. (psst - I even saw it in Sydney). It's rife in Holborn, it's happening here on Oxford Street. I've even see drug users and people high on drugs wandering around on the Kings Road.

As a recreational drug user (well use to be: now that I'm pregnant the strongest drug I take is Diet Coke) of weed, very occasionally coke and in the past E's, (as well as cigs and vodka, but those don't count right?) I'll admit that I don't know what the solution is. I am lucky that I never found myself addicted to anything (except the fags, which am now off). I dont' think that you will ever rid the world of drugs completely. They are already illegal and it's not working. Lets look at the Netherlands where certain drugs are still illegal but no charges are brought against those that use them. I've heard different reports that drug problems are not as high as they are in other countries, but then I've also heard that there is still a bad drug problem in the Netherlands. Who knows what the answer is. Those needle bins are a good idea though because it helps to stop users and non users from contracting HIV. The problem of drugs is never going to go away but maybe at least we can stop other problems from happening.

But I would never look down on people just because they do. What would I have done in the situation that Sunlover described? Probably nothing. Like someone said, what could be done. But I'm pretty sure that I wouldn't have written about on a forum to say how disturbed I was by seeing this. And I'm very sure I wouldn't have thought that they should go back to their "dinghy hole". These are people too you know. If I had kids with me then I would explain the situation. And re-inforce that people need help when they have an addiction. (I liked podgypossum's suggestion of calling the police though so that they could maybe get some help).

I'm sure somebody on this discussion forum has got an alcoholic in their family. Please can you tell me what the difference is between alcohol addiction and Class A drug addiction.

But if you guys want to have these ideas about people with drug addictions then that's fine. You are entitled to your own thoughts. But god help any of you if your child ends up a drug user and then ends up with a bad addiction. Surely then you won't be thinking "get back to your dinghy hole".

I was sorry to hear about your brother yvsie. Must have been a terrible shock considering you had no idea that he was a drug user. My cousin died of a drug overdose as well.....she was an alcoholic. But we knew about it because for some reason alcohol is more acceptable than other drugs. It was still a shock and of course it was still very sad.

jandjuk

I'm probably going be called naive, and perhaps I am, but I think due to Oz and NZ's relative isolation, there are less HARD drugs (or at least a different type of drugs).

I'm not saying there are none, and I'm not saying drug use isn't a big problem in Oz and NZ, but it is somewhat significant that the original poster saw them sniffing glue or whatever.

I'm no expert and I have no stats to back this up - but I would guess there's less herion, crack, cocaine, even ecstacy, on the streets of Oz and NZ.

They are available of course, but I think more expensive and sometimes unaffordable for the kids - which is why the kids sniff glue, smoke heaps of weed, and drink loads of alcohol.

Maybe things have changed - but in Auckland I certainly didn't have to pick my way around herion addicts like I do in Oxford and London. Loads of drunks yes..... and plenty of other equally undesirable people....

Of course glue is no less dangerous or desirable, but given that it is legal and easily accessible, there will less organised crime and drug dealing associted with it. Though of course there is still plenty for marijuana and the drugs that are available....

Personalli I think the whole damn lot should be legalised and tightly controlled - having it illegal just creates crime.

noodle

Vee

I do agree with a lot of what you are saying, we shouldn't look down on them, but sometimes you can't help it when you think of how much money they need to keep up their habit and the lengths that they go to as I have previously said.

PP suggested that you should call the police. I don't see how this would help, as if the police are anything like they are here, the kids would have been long gone!

Also, alcholics can be just as much a nuisance as drug users and I think the reason that alcholics are more excepted in my opinion is because when people choose to start drinking, i guess we don't expect to end up as an alcholic, but surely everyone knows that there's a much higher chance of getting addicted to drugs!

Noodle

jandjuk

I don't think I necessarily look down on people becuase they are drug addicts, but I do think depersonalising people and problems you find difficult to deal with is a natural reaction....

I understand these are real people and I know they need help. But in reality, the only people that can help them are themselves...

I used to have a lot more compassion for people in such situations, but after spending 3 months in India and seeing poverty like you wouldn't believe, I have very little patience patience for people living on the streets of the UK. In the UK everyone has opportunities and govt help that people in the developing world can only dream of. Many of them would literally give their right arm to be given the opportunities which are available to the drug addicts on the streets of the UK.

It seems like such a complete waste - but you can't just shake someone and say "get off the drugs" - they have to figure it out for themselves...

OzTennis

Just a few observations to add to those already posted. I've seen glue sniffing like sunlover describes in Melbourne, London, Glasgow, Edinburgh, Vienna and a couple of other places I can't remember. Strangely the most open drug taking I have seen was in Lucerne, Switzerland by the Chapel Bridge - a group of about 20 sitting on seats as the tourists went by injecting. The most obvious example of glue sniffing was in York last Christmas - 2 guys who looked in their early 30's walking along the Shambles (very narrow cobbled street), bumping off the buildings with a poly bag at their noses. In this instance someone did phone the police on their mobile - an elderly couple who said, 'they need help'. Later on we saw quite a few more sniffing from bags near York railway station.

I have to agree with those who say that it is a problem everywhere now - big city to small town, Australia to the UK to anywhere else. I disagree with the 'why the safe disposal things, it's illegal argument'. It might be illegal but its happening a lot, I don't want to accidentally touch a needle thanks. The safe 'shooting galleries' BP mentions in Sydney also seem like a sensible idea to me. In a way they are vaguely like hotels where another addictive drug is also dispensed in a controlled way with licensing, specified hours etc.

OzTennis

bundy

Ah yes, this brings back memories. Last year we accidentally found ourselves living next to a crack den for a whole year. One small bedsit occupied by 8 crack addicts and 6 dogs...you can just imagine. Except that you probably can't. It was hell. What these people do is not damaging themselves - it has a massive impact on those who come into contact with them and it can ruin other people's lives as much as their own. There are plenty of people in this world who have had to face difficulties (Mr Bundy is one of them) but they don't all turn into drug addicts.

Sunlover

OK Vee , I think you've made your point.......

I am really am not a total naive idiot and I do realise that any kind of substance abuse problem is tragic. Drug and alcohol abuse in any form has always disturbed me which is probably why I noticed that couple yesterday while very few other people appeared to.

And No you really don't know what I would have written about the old man on the park bench. In fact I did see an old man sitting at the bustop today with a bottle of Methylated spirits and found that equally sad and disturbing - sorry that I just happened to post about an incident which was somewhat less common.

As for the "dingy hole" : sorry if my use of words offended you to the point of endless repetition. However I certainly did NOT intend to imply that that is where anyone belongs and it is unfair of you to imply that I did. I believe that these people need to be somewhere where they can get as much help as possible - because I actually DO care.

I was simply surprised at the blatant drug taking in the middle of the sidewalk during rush hour - a fairly normal reaction I would have thought.

Fuzzyness

its not surpising they are taking glue or solvents. the cost of other drugs (e, coke, speed, heroin) are extortionate compared to uk prices.

Vee

Ah well, I guess that's what people mean by "it's hard to convey emotion over a discussion forum board".

Anyways, we all have different views about this. It was just the tone of this thread that offended me. And I go on about a dinghy hole because there are so many people who think that this is where drug addicts should be.

I accept that you are a compassionate person (and I'm not trying to be snarky or patronising here or anything). But please remember that there are people on this board who may have people in their families who are drug absuers and I'm sure they wouldn't want to see their family members in a hole. It can be quite offending.

Off soapbaox now. Anyways, my 2 cents worth (actually it was more like 10 cents worth but hey, I'm feeling generous what with it being Christmas and all)