CROWN removals
Apr 1st 2009 | 12:21 pm
#1
Thread Starter
---
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,994
CROWN removals
Before I start, I think this is acceptable, but please can a mod delete if it's not!!!
This brings me no pleasure, but I feel obliged to pass on our experience, which in fairness to Crown I've not done as yet to allow them to reply and to allow enough time to pass so I can be a bit more ... objective, I guess. I'm just going to copy and paste the communication with Crwon over my complaint and then you can be the judge of whether you'd like to use them to move your wordly possessions
After an email telling me it was being invesitigated I received the following:
And I've replied today:
This brings me no pleasure, but I feel obliged to pass on our experience, which in fairness to Crown I've not done as yet to allow them to reply and to allow enough time to pass so I can be a bit more ... objective, I guess. I'm just going to copy and paste the communication with Crwon over my complaint and then you can be the judge of whether you'd like to use them to move your wordly possessions
18/02/2009
Dear ******,
I write further to our telephone conversation on the 16th February where I detailed my dissatisfaction with Crown. We moved from Hawkes Bay, NZ to ******, NSW and the move was arranged through ******* ****** in Hawkes Bay. I've copied ******* into this email because I have no doubt he'd like to know what happened with our move after his part was done. ******* sold us the Crown product on the basis of Crown using Crown movers from start to finish, unlike many other International Removal firms. We had used Crown for our move between the UK and NZ two years prior, and had subsequently recommended Crown to my mother who then used them for her UK to Australia move 18 months ago. We were largely happy with the arrangement of packing our effects and were very happy with the team who came out and did the actual packing and loading. They were professional, polite and courteous and good ambassadors for Crown. Once our effects left NZ we were in communication with yourself (******* *****) regarding our container moving through customs and AQIS and we've also been very happy in our dealings with you. However, when we paid Crown it was for a complete door to door service and what happened on the delivery day was, in our opinion, totally unacceptable.
We were given an estimated arrival time of 9:30 am and so my husband took the day off work and we waited. At 10:30 I called Crown and was told they were on their way and would be with us shortly- in fact they didn't arrive until 11:45, which is very poor, given my husband had then taken 3 (unpaid) hours off work unnecessarily. We were very surprised to see that the container that arrived was not the container our effects had been packed into, despite ******* assuring us our container would be sealed on our property in NZ and then remain in that container until delivery. I understand some things had to be inspected by AQIS, but nonetheless we paid a little more for sole use of the container because we had discussed with Jonathon the increased simplicity (and from our perspective security) of our effects remaining in one container door to door. I was very concerned when I realised only two men had turned up to unload our effects, given we had a steel strung piano on board. In the event they called my husband urgently to come and help unload the piano when it was part way down the ramp as it was proving unsafe to get it down the ramp between the two of them. Although my husband was happy to help out we are appalled that only two men were sent. This shows a total disregard for the health and safety of the unloaders and had my husband not been there, there could easily have been an accident. I would have been very unhappy with having to either help move the piano down the steep ramp on a wheeled trolley with no ropes, or risk it being damaged or causing injury to one of the men. Then, when getting the piano through the front door the men decided they would need to carry it through the house as it was scratching the floor. At this point they stated it was because the bottom of the piano wasn't wrapped as they had expected. When it was put into position we discovered that the wheels on the piano were totally destroyed. Given these wheels were new on the morning of the move we were puzzled until the two movers found a transit (‘Out Turn Report’) document stating the wheels were broken. So we can only deduce (given that nobody from Crown has had the courtesy to inform us of what had happened) that during the transition from one container to another, from Crown to another removal firm our piano had had the wheels completely broken off. The most plausible explanation would be that it was dropped. The piano had scratched deep marks into the wooden floor in two places by the front door and where it had come to rest (see attached pictures). The two removal men accepted liability for the marks at the door but stated they felt that had the piano been appropriately wrapped then the mark where it was set down would not have happened. They also stated that the damage to the piano was not passed on to them, so they were as unaware as we were. Had we known the piano was damaged we would have had it unloaded into the garage where it could more easily have been fixed and safely transported into the house. I asked the men what time they had left Sydney, given we'd been given an arrival time of 9:30 and they were 2 and 1/4 hours behind that. They told us that they were unaware they would be travelling to Newcastle that day and only found out when returning to the 'yard' after completing a job at 9am. This is totally unprofessional; not only in terms of the terrible Crown-customer communication this demonstrates, but also that we were assigned an inadequate number of removal men who had already completed one job before coming to our 'first thing' job. During the afternoon it became clear they were also expected at another job after ours, and so we released them having only unpacked a few boxes. We weren't expecting them to unpack it all regardless as a good deal was going into storage in the garage, but had initially planned on asking them to do the kitchen and books (although they refused to unpack the books onto the shelves, only onto the floor anyway). I'd like to point out that this was not their fault- they had unloaded 120+ cartons from our load including a steel strung piano and we were horrified that they had come from another job to ours, let alone that they were expected to do another that day. Given we paid for a door to door pack and unpack service how can Crown expect to honour that agreement if they send only two men to unload and unpack and our job is one of three they are expected to do that day and we live over 2 hours drive from Sydney?
In summary, we are hugely dissatisfied with the service we received at the Australian end of the move. We trust ******* ***** also feels dissatisfied that his customers received such poor service and we would like the following points to be addressed:
1) Why wasn't our move completed by Crown unpackers in accordance with the sales pitch? I note that even when telephoning ******* *****'s office the recorded message talks about the uniqueness of Crown in using Crown employees from start to finish. It's not enough to reply that Crown had unprecedented demand- Crown is a business and shouldn't sell the product if they've effectively 'run out'.
2) Why were only two men sent to unload a 20ft container containing over 120+ cartons including a steel strung piano? Doesn’t Crown have health and safety guidelines on this matter?
3) Why were our effects moved from one container to another when this was, again, contrary to the sales pitch that we bought on the basis of?
4) When our piano was damaged in transit why weren't we made aware of this fact? It was marked on the 'Out Turn Report' and therefore was known about by Crown. Why were the unloaders not made aware? This shows a lack of common courtesy.
5) Why was our move one of three that the unloaders were expected to complete that day? How can Crown expect 2 men to unload and unpack entire household contents as well as complete two other jobs in one day?
I have attached photographs I took of the 'out turn report', the damage and the agreement the unloaders and I signed in terms of their liability and what had happened.
I did not take out shipping insurance with Crown, but feel this is irrelevant in this case as I shouldn't have to insure against Crown's incompetence or negligence. I assume Crown have insurance for such matters.
I look forward to a speedy reply but will be sending a hard copy of this email to head office too,
******* *******
Dear ******,
I write further to our telephone conversation on the 16th February where I detailed my dissatisfaction with Crown. We moved from Hawkes Bay, NZ to ******, NSW and the move was arranged through ******* ****** in Hawkes Bay. I've copied ******* into this email because I have no doubt he'd like to know what happened with our move after his part was done. ******* sold us the Crown product on the basis of Crown using Crown movers from start to finish, unlike many other International Removal firms. We had used Crown for our move between the UK and NZ two years prior, and had subsequently recommended Crown to my mother who then used them for her UK to Australia move 18 months ago. We were largely happy with the arrangement of packing our effects and were very happy with the team who came out and did the actual packing and loading. They were professional, polite and courteous and good ambassadors for Crown. Once our effects left NZ we were in communication with yourself (******* *****) regarding our container moving through customs and AQIS and we've also been very happy in our dealings with you. However, when we paid Crown it was for a complete door to door service and what happened on the delivery day was, in our opinion, totally unacceptable.
We were given an estimated arrival time of 9:30 am and so my husband took the day off work and we waited. At 10:30 I called Crown and was told they were on their way and would be with us shortly- in fact they didn't arrive until 11:45, which is very poor, given my husband had then taken 3 (unpaid) hours off work unnecessarily. We were very surprised to see that the container that arrived was not the container our effects had been packed into, despite ******* assuring us our container would be sealed on our property in NZ and then remain in that container until delivery. I understand some things had to be inspected by AQIS, but nonetheless we paid a little more for sole use of the container because we had discussed with Jonathon the increased simplicity (and from our perspective security) of our effects remaining in one container door to door. I was very concerned when I realised only two men had turned up to unload our effects, given we had a steel strung piano on board. In the event they called my husband urgently to come and help unload the piano when it was part way down the ramp as it was proving unsafe to get it down the ramp between the two of them. Although my husband was happy to help out we are appalled that only two men were sent. This shows a total disregard for the health and safety of the unloaders and had my husband not been there, there could easily have been an accident. I would have been very unhappy with having to either help move the piano down the steep ramp on a wheeled trolley with no ropes, or risk it being damaged or causing injury to one of the men. Then, when getting the piano through the front door the men decided they would need to carry it through the house as it was scratching the floor. At this point they stated it was because the bottom of the piano wasn't wrapped as they had expected. When it was put into position we discovered that the wheels on the piano were totally destroyed. Given these wheels were new on the morning of the move we were puzzled until the two movers found a transit (‘Out Turn Report’) document stating the wheels were broken. So we can only deduce (given that nobody from Crown has had the courtesy to inform us of what had happened) that during the transition from one container to another, from Crown to another removal firm our piano had had the wheels completely broken off. The most plausible explanation would be that it was dropped. The piano had scratched deep marks into the wooden floor in two places by the front door and where it had come to rest (see attached pictures). The two removal men accepted liability for the marks at the door but stated they felt that had the piano been appropriately wrapped then the mark where it was set down would not have happened. They also stated that the damage to the piano was not passed on to them, so they were as unaware as we were. Had we known the piano was damaged we would have had it unloaded into the garage where it could more easily have been fixed and safely transported into the house. I asked the men what time they had left Sydney, given we'd been given an arrival time of 9:30 and they were 2 and 1/4 hours behind that. They told us that they were unaware they would be travelling to Newcastle that day and only found out when returning to the 'yard' after completing a job at 9am. This is totally unprofessional; not only in terms of the terrible Crown-customer communication this demonstrates, but also that we were assigned an inadequate number of removal men who had already completed one job before coming to our 'first thing' job. During the afternoon it became clear they were also expected at another job after ours, and so we released them having only unpacked a few boxes. We weren't expecting them to unpack it all regardless as a good deal was going into storage in the garage, but had initially planned on asking them to do the kitchen and books (although they refused to unpack the books onto the shelves, only onto the floor anyway). I'd like to point out that this was not their fault- they had unloaded 120+ cartons from our load including a steel strung piano and we were horrified that they had come from another job to ours, let alone that they were expected to do another that day. Given we paid for a door to door pack and unpack service how can Crown expect to honour that agreement if they send only two men to unload and unpack and our job is one of three they are expected to do that day and we live over 2 hours drive from Sydney?
In summary, we are hugely dissatisfied with the service we received at the Australian end of the move. We trust ******* ***** also feels dissatisfied that his customers received such poor service and we would like the following points to be addressed:
1) Why wasn't our move completed by Crown unpackers in accordance with the sales pitch? I note that even when telephoning ******* *****'s office the recorded message talks about the uniqueness of Crown in using Crown employees from start to finish. It's not enough to reply that Crown had unprecedented demand- Crown is a business and shouldn't sell the product if they've effectively 'run out'.
2) Why were only two men sent to unload a 20ft container containing over 120+ cartons including a steel strung piano? Doesn’t Crown have health and safety guidelines on this matter?
3) Why were our effects moved from one container to another when this was, again, contrary to the sales pitch that we bought on the basis of?
4) When our piano was damaged in transit why weren't we made aware of this fact? It was marked on the 'Out Turn Report' and therefore was known about by Crown. Why were the unloaders not made aware? This shows a lack of common courtesy.
5) Why was our move one of three that the unloaders were expected to complete that day? How can Crown expect 2 men to unload and unpack entire household contents as well as complete two other jobs in one day?
I have attached photographs I took of the 'out turn report', the damage and the agreement the unloaders and I signed in terms of their liability and what had happened.
I did not take out shipping insurance with Crown, but feel this is irrelevant in this case as I shouldn't have to insure against Crown's incompetence or negligence. I assume Crown have insurance for such matters.
I look forward to a speedy reply but will be sending a hard copy of this email to head office too,
******* *******
Hi *******,
Sorry for this delayed response however I have now completed my internal investigation.
You are correct in saying that Crown offers a door to door service by Crown employees however periodically to accommodate the earliest possible delivery we do engage service providers who have a history with us. On this occasion we erred in not communicating with you the need to use another provider to fasttrack your delivery. We were conscious that you were anxious to receive your possessions following a prolonged clearance exercise due to Customs placing a hold on your consignment pending "duty" payment.
The latter prevented us from scheduling your delivery as we were unsure when this matter would be finalised.So it's not so much of a "run out" as you suggest, more an attempt to hasten the delivery service following a prolonged clearance experience even though the delay was outside our control.
Under normal circumstances a crew of 2 could effect a delivery of your size removal within one day. Crown certainly have procedures and specialised equipment for handling pianos and expect any other provider that we use to comply with this instruction. The transhipping of goods into another container is standard practice for removals originating from overseas as we have a responsibility to locate and separate items that the Australian Quarantine Officers wish to examine. On this occasion this worked in your favour as had we left the goods in the shipping container, the delayed clearance would have meant significant demurrage fees for your account. You will note that we chose to waive the storage fees associated with using our hire containers. ******** will be briefed of the unloading methodology's which is a requirement of the Australian Government rather than just a Crown procedure. I note your comment that the crew were not aware they were travelling to Newcastle until 9.00am and this was included in the nonconformance raised against the provider and I have counselled my Operations Manager on his failure to communicate the changed arrival time. .
As for the floor damage, would you please obtain a quote for restoration in the marked area and forward for my attention.
In concluding, I thank you for providing the feed back as it provided the opportunity to address the issues you raised in line with Crown's quality procedures and we offer our sincere apologies for any inconvenience caused.
Regards
******* ******
NSW State Manager
Crown Relocations
Sorry for this delayed response however I have now completed my internal investigation.
You are correct in saying that Crown offers a door to door service by Crown employees however periodically to accommodate the earliest possible delivery we do engage service providers who have a history with us. On this occasion we erred in not communicating with you the need to use another provider to fasttrack your delivery. We were conscious that you were anxious to receive your possessions following a prolonged clearance exercise due to Customs placing a hold on your consignment pending "duty" payment.
The latter prevented us from scheduling your delivery as we were unsure when this matter would be finalised.So it's not so much of a "run out" as you suggest, more an attempt to hasten the delivery service following a prolonged clearance experience even though the delay was outside our control.
Under normal circumstances a crew of 2 could effect a delivery of your size removal within one day. Crown certainly have procedures and specialised equipment for handling pianos and expect any other provider that we use to comply with this instruction. The transhipping of goods into another container is standard practice for removals originating from overseas as we have a responsibility to locate and separate items that the Australian Quarantine Officers wish to examine. On this occasion this worked in your favour as had we left the goods in the shipping container, the delayed clearance would have meant significant demurrage fees for your account. You will note that we chose to waive the storage fees associated with using our hire containers. ******** will be briefed of the unloading methodology's which is a requirement of the Australian Government rather than just a Crown procedure. I note your comment that the crew were not aware they were travelling to Newcastle until 9.00am and this was included in the nonconformance raised against the provider and I have counselled my Operations Manager on his failure to communicate the changed arrival time. .
As for the floor damage, would you please obtain a quote for restoration in the marked area and forward for my attention.
In concluding, I thank you for providing the feed back as it provided the opportunity to address the issues you raised in line with Crown's quality procedures and we offer our sincere apologies for any inconvenience caused.
Regards
******* ******
NSW State Manager
Crown Relocations
Hi ******,
I've had some difficulty obtaining quotes- partly due to my schedule and partly just due to everyone being busy, but I hope to have one soon.
I'm not wholly satisfied with your response. I think it's a shame that you've tried to imply that the fact you used another company to unload my possessions, despite Crown heavily advertising themselves as the removal firm where you get Crown staff door to door, was as a result of my desire to have my goods delivered soon, after a period of delay due to my misunderstanding of the customs fees process. I should point out that I genuinely misunderstood the procedure, given it was a very stressful and busy time for me, but I was not made aware that in requesting my possessions delivered asap after I had paid, I would be given a very second rate service with a different company. I also think it's a huge shame that I get the sense that the two guys who delivered my possessions will be the ones who "carry the can" for this, despite it actually being a Crown organisational and management issue.
I acknowledge your apology and I am certain you are not happy with this standard of service, I will forward the quote for your attention as soon as I've obtained it and I trust that by requesting I do so, you anticipate Crown paying for the repairs.
I note you've not addressed the issue of my broken piano, nor why I wasn't made aware of the damage as per common courtesy, and this is disappointing to me. I will be sharing my experience with Crown with my online community, BritishExpats, which I haven't as yet done because I wanted to give Crown the opportunity to reply.
Regards, ******* ******
I've had some difficulty obtaining quotes- partly due to my schedule and partly just due to everyone being busy, but I hope to have one soon.
I'm not wholly satisfied with your response. I think it's a shame that you've tried to imply that the fact you used another company to unload my possessions, despite Crown heavily advertising themselves as the removal firm where you get Crown staff door to door, was as a result of my desire to have my goods delivered soon, after a period of delay due to my misunderstanding of the customs fees process. I should point out that I genuinely misunderstood the procedure, given it was a very stressful and busy time for me, but I was not made aware that in requesting my possessions delivered asap after I had paid, I would be given a very second rate service with a different company. I also think it's a huge shame that I get the sense that the two guys who delivered my possessions will be the ones who "carry the can" for this, despite it actually being a Crown organisational and management issue.
I acknowledge your apology and I am certain you are not happy with this standard of service, I will forward the quote for your attention as soon as I've obtained it and I trust that by requesting I do so, you anticipate Crown paying for the repairs.
I note you've not addressed the issue of my broken piano, nor why I wasn't made aware of the damage as per common courtesy, and this is disappointing to me. I will be sharing my experience with Crown with my online community, BritishExpats, which I haven't as yet done because I wanted to give Crown the opportunity to reply.
Regards, ******* ******
Apr 1st 2009 | 1:16 pm
#2
Forum Regular
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 42
CROWN removals
Hey - tell you what: We had exactly the same experience with Wridgeways in terms or 2 men turned up for more than 100 boxes! Container issue was the same in terms of the container has been sealed at the original destination and a new container arrived at our place in Oz.
Costumer Service from Wridgeways were absolutely poor and initially they even refused to pay damages on our goods ... they sent a Handyman to fix it!
To make the long story short ... it seems to me that this is the common 'costumer service' here in Oz. Get to use to it because the Banks, Telephone companies, workshops, etc. will treat you in the same way like the movers did.
That's one of the downsides of Oz ... they are far behind anything what is called costumer service (although it doesn't seem to be in the first instance!!!).
Frank
PS: I am already concerned what will happen when we'll leave Oz again???? :curse:
Happy welcome in Oz
Costumer Service from Wridgeways were absolutely poor and initially they even refused to pay damages on our goods ... they sent a Handyman to fix it!
To make the long story short ... it seems to me that this is the common 'costumer service' here in Oz. Get to use to it because the Banks, Telephone companies, workshops, etc. will treat you in the same way like the movers did.
That's one of the downsides of Oz ... they are far behind anything what is called costumer service (although it doesn't seem to be in the first instance!!!).
Frank
PS: I am already concerned what will happen when we'll leave Oz again???? :curse:
Happy welcome in Oz
Apr 1st 2009 | 6:20 pm
#3
Crazy Cat Lady
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 65,493
CROWN removals
Luck of the draw unfortunately. All shippers, regardless of how good their service is 95% of the time, will fail on the other 5% - my statistics btw 
We didn't use Crown but lots have and like your previous experience, found them more than satisfactory. They seem to be trying to put things right though, there have been companies who've washed their hands of any complaints so whilst it's not been the ideal experience, at least it's not the worse.
My container came from the UK to our house (this end done by Wrigways) and was the same container that left our UK house so I don't quite get the reason for changing. We found Wrigways to be excellent and their staff couldn't do enough to help us so again, one company, different experiences.
Hope it gets sorted quickly.
We didn't use Crown but lots have and like your previous experience, found them more than satisfactory. They seem to be trying to put things right though, there have been companies who've washed their hands of any complaints so whilst it's not been the ideal experience, at least it's not the worse.My container came from the UK to our house (this end done by Wrigways) and was the same container that left our UK house so I don't quite get the reason for changing. We found Wrigways to be excellent and their staff couldn't do enough to help us so again, one company, different experiences.
Hope it gets sorted quickly.
Apr 2nd 2009 | 10:27 am
#4
Thread Starter
---
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,994
Re: CROWN removals
Well now I'm confused!
I posted this yesterday, it was deleted, I went to bed and now it's back!
Perhaps I'm actually in a dream ......
I posted this yesterday, it was deleted, I went to bed and now it's back!
Perhaps I'm actually in a dream ......
Apr 2nd 2009 | 11:30 am
#5
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 387
From: flagstone estate,Jimboomba, Brisbane
Re: CROWN removals
Think you must be as ive been told you cant name & shame companys on this site, to be fair to crown we used them with no problems, funny a post mentioned wrigways if you ment Wridgeways a friend of mine worked for them they were one of the few companys i have delt with that had pride in the service that they provided but that was a few years ago, after a few years in oz i have learnt that customer services is very poor, i find the best way to get things done is to speak direct not email & try to speak to the same person befriend them & you might find things get done. Good luck
Apr 2nd 2009 | 1:07 pm
#6
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 9,400
Re: CROWN removals
The OP's post could have been written by me four years ago. I don't know if Crown are better or worse than any other company, but we had to claim for dozens of broken things - thousands of dollars' worth - and had the same experience of having everything just left on the floor instead of unpacked as paid for and then having to get rid of all the packing ourselves.
Apr 2nd 2009 | 3:54 pm
#7
Crazy Cat Lady
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 65,493
Re: CROWN removals
Think you must be as ive been told you cant name & shame companys on this site, to be fair to crown we used them with no problems, funny a post mentioned wrigways if you ment Wridgeways a friend of mine worked for them they were one of the few companys i have delt with that had pride in the service that they provided but that was a few years ago, after a few years in oz i have learnt that customer services is very poor, i find the best way to get things done is to speak direct not email & try to speak to the same person befriend them & you might find things get done. Good luck
Apr 2nd 2009 | 4:44 pm
#8
I'm Old Gregg!
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 8,460
From: A Former Bogan Colony in QLD
Re: CROWN removals
I thought this thread was going to be about dentistry
Apr 2nd 2009 | 8:09 pm
#10
Thread Starter
---
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,994
Re: CROWN removals
Nope, we didn't get insurance. I did when we moved UK-NZ through Letton Percival marine insurance but we mulled this over a good deal before we left and decided that in a way it's strange that you pay the company to move your stuff and then pay to insure against their negligence. Our piano has been dropped- that's almost indisputable, so I feel sure Crown have insurance that cover them. Honestly, I think insurance when you've payed a company to safely move your stuff is a bit of a swizz. They wanted in excess of $1000 to insure and even if we repair the floor and piano ourselves we'll still be quids in, so I don't regret that decision!
Apr 2nd 2009 | 9:57 pm
#11
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 387
From: flagstone estate,Jimboomba, Brisbane
