$80000 a year needed
May 18th 2005, 5:36 am
#316
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: $80000 a year needed
I find these threads often misleading as people often don't know how to calculate what their income is, relative to their UK one.You know as soon as they use the exchange rate, for example that they may be out. There are almost too many things to take in to consideration.
Some things are cheaper here, some aren't. Most people hope to subsidise the cost of their housing and/or take the cheaper ''lifestyle''. Renovation and *home*building (I don't say house building) costs a fortune even then.
I would summarise and say:
It depends on what you are used to, what you are prepared to sacrifice on, and whether you will gain or lose by coming here based on the terms you can work out via research.
Most assume they will be better off across the board- this is, infact, unlikely except for a lucky few. Many are also on a good wicket in the Uk and refuse to take a step backwards.
As I was underpaid in the UK and had no chance of house ownership on the same terms as over here, I have improved my situation. I take in to account my high salary here and know things will not always be easy.
Nonetheless, I have worked out that I would be no better off in the UK all things being equal in comparable circumstances. That is not to say that it won't ever be HARD here, but I can demonstrate that I would rather wake up here without a job and have to battle the same factors (housing, food, bills, family costs) than wake up over in the UK without a job. The reason: it is easier for me to get any job earning enough to get by here than it is to have to have a certain job to get by on the same levels in the UK.
My case is different as
i) I come from London - did not have a small mortgage and a high income - the reverse of many expats.
ii) can earn relatively high salary - housing costs money here
If I had a 3-4 bed detached home in Surrey bought in 1997 and earnt GBP60,000-100,000 I would be better off in the UK but it is no longer possible for me to have those metrics, so I take the upper quantile I have over here.
Badge
Some things are cheaper here, some aren't. Most people hope to subsidise the cost of their housing and/or take the cheaper ''lifestyle''. Renovation and *home*building (I don't say house building) costs a fortune even then.
I would summarise and say:
It depends on what you are used to, what you are prepared to sacrifice on, and whether you will gain or lose by coming here based on the terms you can work out via research.
Most assume they will be better off across the board- this is, infact, unlikely except for a lucky few. Many are also on a good wicket in the Uk and refuse to take a step backwards.
As I was underpaid in the UK and had no chance of house ownership on the same terms as over here, I have improved my situation. I take in to account my high salary here and know things will not always be easy.
Nonetheless, I have worked out that I would be no better off in the UK all things being equal in comparable circumstances. That is not to say that it won't ever be HARD here, but I can demonstrate that I would rather wake up here without a job and have to battle the same factors (housing, food, bills, family costs) than wake up over in the UK without a job. The reason: it is easier for me to get any job earning enough to get by here than it is to have to have a certain job to get by on the same levels in the UK.
My case is different as
i) I come from London - did not have a small mortgage and a high income - the reverse of many expats.
ii) can earn relatively high salary - housing costs money here
If I had a 3-4 bed detached home in Surrey bought in 1997 and earnt GBP60,000-100,000 I would be better off in the UK but it is no longer possible for me to have those metrics, so I take the upper quantile I have over here.
Badge
Last edited by Badge; May 18th 2005 at 5:45 am.
May 18th 2005, 6:05 am
#317
Forum Regular
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 94
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by Pants
Grayling..just thought I would add my 2 pennies worth !
Hubby's income..approx $83,000. Hubby is in IT and works shifts
We are a family of 3 plus dog.
This is not trying to scare anyone but we have no money put aside at the end of the month for anything much at all. We are by no means frivolous...just basics. My hubby can earn more in the UK and we can have the equivalant mortgage etc back home.....maybe we just came to the wrong State..I know it's pretty expensive in NSW. !!All in all we are no better off except we do own an investment property which just pays for itself !!Of course I could go and work and pay childcare fees which would propably be what I earn in wages..!!!
All in all I do think it depends on where you live...circumstances.
As I said this is just the basics.....I could go into details but I don't want to bore anyone.!!!Any info needed I am happy to oblige !!
Hubby's income..approx $83,000. Hubby is in IT and works shifts
We are a family of 3 plus dog.
This is not trying to scare anyone but we have no money put aside at the end of the month for anything much at all. We are by no means frivolous...just basics. My hubby can earn more in the UK and we can have the equivalant mortgage etc back home.....maybe we just came to the wrong State..I know it's pretty expensive in NSW. !!All in all we are no better off except we do own an investment property which just pays for itself !!Of course I could go and work and pay childcare fees which would propably be what I earn in wages..!!!
All in all I do think it depends on where you live...circumstances.
As I said this is just the basics.....I could go into details but I don't want to bore anyone.!!!Any info needed I am happy to oblige !!
May 18th 2005, 6:26 am
#318
Brain Drained
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,882
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by NealMartin
I agree with what you say - however I would add that 'a comfortable life' is a subjective statement and that every person will have a different view on what constitutes a comfortable life -
The point of the thread was to show what you would need to survive day to day life in Australia. In many ways its a pointless thread in that everyones circumstances are different and you won't know until you start living your life.
May 18th 2005, 6:27 am
#319
Brain Drained
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,882
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by JAR123
But are you happier there and glad you made the move?
May 18th 2005, 7:45 am
#320
BE Enthusiast
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 448
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by Amazulu
Spot on. Every nation does it. It is fun (your duty actually) winding Aussies up though, 'cause they love to dish it out, but really can't take it back.
Now, this has been a lo-o-ong thread and I confess to only having skim-read it and prob there's more pages. But something for newcomers to Oz to consider (if this has been covered already pls forgive me
) is good old superannuation. If you're planning on staying here till you retire, you will need to consider this. No guaranteed pension -and correct me someone if I'm wrong - but no company pension funds Guaranteed payment by your employer, by law, of minimum 9% of gross salary for - say 25-30 yrs if you're 40-something now, invested by a superfund (of your choice from July '05 but up to now your employer's choice and maybe not effectively invested ) might not amount to much when you are ready to retire, especially if you don't have continuous employment and don't make your own contributions on top cos it's costing you too much to buy your house/raise your kids etc. Just something else to throw into the equation if you haven't already. Maybe consider keeping up your UK pension contributions "in case".
May 18th 2005, 9:25 am
#321
Happy Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Location: On a rollercoaster
Posts: 1,913
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by Grayling
Hi All
A while ago, on this forum, Among all the various debates there used to also be some very useful pieces of information helpful to would-be migrants.
If these were 'positive' they would recieve a lot of attention.
If they were seen as 'negative' they would be rubbished or attacked.
Lately posts seem to be mainly about visas and how to get them or about the process. There have also been a lot of amusing, silly,sad, nasty and frivolous threads.
There is an important ongoing thread by HEVS and HUP which deserves attention.
They are describing a difficult time in their new life.Not negatively but very honestly.
One phrase of HUP's has struck me.
Apologies to HUP for using a quote from that thread:
"I would suggest that for a family of four you will need an income of around $80000".
Think about it.
How many people will have that income without both partners working?
What will that do to dreams of :' more time with family','escape from the Rat Race', 'Quality of life' etc. etc?
This is the kind of issue we should be discussing.
I am starting this thread so this simple statement does not get lost.
Thanks HUP
Best wishes
G
A while ago, on this forum, Among all the various debates there used to also be some very useful pieces of information helpful to would-be migrants.
If these were 'positive' they would recieve a lot of attention.
If they were seen as 'negative' they would be rubbished or attacked.
Lately posts seem to be mainly about visas and how to get them or about the process. There have also been a lot of amusing, silly,sad, nasty and frivolous threads.
There is an important ongoing thread by HEVS and HUP which deserves attention.
They are describing a difficult time in their new life.Not negatively but very honestly.
One phrase of HUP's has struck me.
Apologies to HUP for using a quote from that thread:
"I would suggest that for a family of four you will need an income of around $80000".
Think about it.
How many people will have that income without both partners working?
What will that do to dreams of :' more time with family','escape from the Rat Race', 'Quality of life' etc. etc?
This is the kind of issue we should be discussing.
I am starting this thread so this simple statement does not get lost.
Thanks HUP
Best wishes
G
We have just started the whole process Hubby earns very good money now but when we first met started up home etc we scraped by constantly BUT we did get by.
I believe no matter how much you earn you ALWAYS manage to get by somehow I think the more you earn the more you spend and no matter how much you earn you will always need more.
Kris
May 18th 2005, 10:13 am
#322
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jun 2004
Location: The Gold Coast
Posts: 3,069
Re: $80000 a year needed
I think the more you earn the more you spend and no matter how much you earn you will always need more.
Kris[/QUOTE]
I agree absolutely.
Tracey
Kris[/QUOTE]
I agree absolutely.
Tracey
May 18th 2005, 11:54 am
#323
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by TopCat3
Absabloodylutely. Thank you amazulu
Now, this has been a lo-o-ong thread and I confess to only having skim-read it and prob there's more pages. But something for newcomers to Oz to consider (if this has been covered already pls forgive me ) is good old superannuation. If you're planning on staying here till you retire, you will need to consider this. No guaranteed pension -and correct me someone if I'm wrong - but no company pension funds Guaranteed payment by your employer, by law, of minimum 9% of gross salary for - say 25-30 yrs if you're 40-something now, invested by a superfund (of your choice from July '05 but up to now your employer's choice and maybe not effectively invested ) might not amount to much when you are ready to retire, especially if you don't have continuous employment and don't make your own contributions on top cos it's costing you too much to buy your house/raise your kids etc. Just something else to throw into the equation if you haven't already. Maybe consider keeping up your UK pension contributions "in case".
Now, this has been a lo-o-ong thread and I confess to only having skim-read it and prob there's more pages. But something for newcomers to Oz to consider (if this has been covered already pls forgive me
) is good old superannuation. If you're planning on staying here till you retire, you will need to consider this. No guaranteed pension -and correct me someone if I'm wrong - but no company pension funds Guaranteed payment by your employer, by law, of minimum 9% of gross salary for - say 25-30 yrs if you're 40-something now, invested by a superfund (of your choice from July '05 but up to now your employer's choice and maybe not effectively invested ) might not amount to much when you are ready to retire, especially if you don't have continuous employment and don't make your own contributions on top cos it's costing you too much to buy your house/raise your kids etc. Just something else to throw into the equation if you haven't already. Maybe consider keeping up your UK pension contributions "in case".It looks like govt pensions as we know them will become a thing of the past over much of the western world.
Badge
May 18th 2005, 12:57 pm
#324
BE Enthusiast
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 448
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by Badge
is it not the case that UK pensions may not turn out to be much cop either - it's a similar situation.
It looks like govt pensions as we know them will become a thing of the past over much of the western world.
Badge
It looks like govt pensions as we know them will become a thing of the past over much of the western world.
Badge
My post was more to make people in their 30s & 40s coming over aware that superannuation takes a long time to build to a liveable retirement sum here and to factor this into their decision with regard to how to provide for their retirement and to consider where that retirement might take place. UK pension is a right to all UK citizens who have worked a minimum number or years, not a means-tested privilege as is the Australian pension. If you've only got a small superannuation and own your own house the UK Pds pension converted to aussie $ might be worth more than the means-tested-reduced Aussie pension. Might mean the difference in having
each week and each week 
May 18th 2005, 10:08 pm
#325
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by samnrob2
Thought I'd bump this thread up for any newbies.
I posted on here before coming out to Oz and was worried that I was being too cocky about cost of living...
Turns out that I wasn't wearing rose-tinted glasses tho'... Where it counts Oz is cheaper and wages aren't necessarily lower over here.
Still can't believe a weekly shopping bill could come to $470! Our biggest bill came to $124 and that lasted almost two weeks!
R
I posted on here before coming out to Oz and was worried that I was being too cocky about cost of living...
Turns out that I wasn't wearing rose-tinted glasses tho'... Where it counts Oz is cheaper and wages aren't necessarily lower over here.
Still can't believe a weekly shopping bill could come to $470! Our biggest bill came to $124 and that lasted almost two weeks!
R
If you don't have kids to fork out for education and medical/dental, a big cost saver in Australia.
We both worked and found our money went further, to the point that the last two years I could work part-time, can't do that in the UK.
M
May 18th 2005, 10:29 pm
#326
Bitter and twisted
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2003
Location: Upmarket
Posts: 17,503
Re: $80000 a year needed
I am often amazed by the number of people who post on here who seem to disregard pensions.
There are many posts about the cost of living and the 'how much do I need to earn type posts' but rarely does anyone consider the (not so distant) future.
It is all very well saying ' I will do anything' or 'We will be OK as we will be mortgage free' but do people realise just how much money they will need to support themselves in old age or when they retire?
Superann. for many people will be a pittance.
I speak as a pensioner (albeit still pretty young). Time goes quicker than you can possibly imagine and one day you will be looking at your future when you do not want to / can't work :scared:
Then what.
Take it seriously guys...it is not far away.
G
There are many posts about the cost of living and the 'how much do I need to earn type posts' but rarely does anyone consider the (not so distant) future.
It is all very well saying ' I will do anything' or 'We will be OK as we will be mortgage free' but do people realise just how much money they will need to support themselves in old age or when they retire?
Superann. for many people will be a pittance.
I speak as a pensioner (albeit still pretty young). Time goes quicker than you can possibly imagine and one day you will be looking at your future when you do not want to / can't work :scared:
Then what.
Take it seriously guys...it is not far away.
G
May 18th 2005, 11:05 pm
#327
Brain Drained
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,882
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by kris maynard
I believe no matter how much you earn you ALWAYS manage to get by somehow I think the more you earn the more you spend and no matter how much you earn you will always need more.
Kris
Kris
From my experience we arrived and felt very cash rich with proceeds from house sale, then when it was all invested back and we were living on the Aussie dollar we came back down to earth and live life back in the real world. We have good months, we have lean months. Same as the UK really.
May 18th 2005, 11:19 pm
#328
High in the Dandenongs
Joined: Apr 2003
Location: Listening to Puffing Billy
Posts: 9,183
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by NealMartin
[QUOTE
I agree with what you say - however I would add that 'a comfortable life' is a subjective statement and that every person will have a different view on what constitutes a comfortable life - it might not necessarily include a large degree of material wealth - it may mean enjoying the simple (cheaper) things in life. So whilst agree with the salary level you mention, it is only because of the lifestyle choices such as house location, car etc that I have chosen.
I think the thread is a great idea and a good reality check.
)
I agree with what you say - however I would add that 'a comfortable life' is a subjective statement and that every person will have a different view on what constitutes a comfortable life - it might not necessarily include a large degree of material wealth - it may mean enjoying the simple (cheaper) things in life. So whilst agree with the salary level you mention, it is only because of the lifestyle choices such as house location, car etc that I have chosen.
I think the thread is a great idea and a good reality check.
)
) However i'd just like to point out that that isn't the case. We have bought a very run down house and have recently got a mortgage to fund the renos which we (quaintly) thought we'd be able to save for. We DO have one new car paid for but the other sadly we couldn't strech to so theres a nice loan going out! We go out for a meal/ day out once a week, the kids go to state school. We arn't members of any gyms etc, the excersise is done walking running etc. My footie membership was paltry and was annual. I havn't bought any clothes, apart from work and footie stuff, since being here etc.
What i am trying to point out is that we do not lead a materialistic life style, infact the opposite, a very simple one, infact the same as in the UK. I guess that was the whole idea of the thread to point out that you will probably not be quids in overhere, it all evens out in the end i guess.
Sam n rob i am happy for you that wages were better, however when you have 2 kids and all that entails (drs, prescriptions, dentists, school fees, clubs etc etc stuff you DIDN'T have to pay for in the UK) things do feel different,and when they get bigger, you shopping bill will also be much bigger
May 19th 2005, 2:04 am
#329
Prisoner of Her Majesty
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: Chapel Hill, Brisbane
Posts: 838
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by hevs
Sam n rob i am happy for you that wages were better, however when you have 2 kids and all that entails (drs, prescriptions, dentists, school fees, clubs etc etc stuff you DIDN'T have to pay for in the UK) things do feel different,and when they get bigger, you shopping bill will also be much bigger
As a side point we aren't having kids so we won't have to consider all the factors you point out but I take your point that for people with kids I'm sure it can soon mount up.
For those who are in their twenties though and are looking to move over, if they haven't got kids and aren't planning any anytime soon, Oz could be a good move.
I think it was Mike Stanton that said anyone moving to Oz to better their career would be making a mistake. In my case that hasn't been the case. I've joined the 6th largest agency in its sector in the world and am on more money.
It can be a really successful move - I just wanted to highlight that for peeps without kids of which I know there are a few on here.
R
May 19th 2005, 8:18 am
#330
Bitter and twisted
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2003
Location: Upmarket
Posts: 17,503
Re: $80000 a year needed
Originally Posted by samnrob2
Didn't want to cause a fight or anything, just thought that it would be an interesting read for people like us to hear that Australia can be financially better.
As a side point we aren't having kids so we won't have to consider all the factors you point out but I take your point that for people with kids I'm sure it can soon mount up.
For those who are in their twenties though and are looking to move over, if they haven't got kids and aren't planning any anytime soon, Oz could be a good move.
I think it was Mike Stanton that said anyone moving to Oz to better their career would be making a mistake. In my case that hasn't been the case. I've joined the 6th largest agency in its sector in the world and am on more money.
It can be a really successful move - I just wanted to highlight that for peeps without kids of which I know there are a few on here.
R
As a side point we aren't having kids so we won't have to consider all the factors you point out but I take your point that for people with kids I'm sure it can soon mount up.
For those who are in their twenties though and are looking to move over, if they haven't got kids and aren't planning any anytime soon, Oz could be a good move.
I think it was Mike Stanton that said anyone moving to Oz to better their career would be making a mistake. In my case that hasn't been the case. I've joined the 6th largest agency in its sector in the world and am on more money.
It can be a really successful move - I just wanted to highlight that for peeps without kids of which I know there are a few on here.
R
My son , who is single, earns a huge wage by Australian (and UK ) standards but he is not typical.
was there not a post by one of you the other day bemoaning the wages for Teachers in Australia?
If you were relying on that wage then it would not be so attractive.
G