Pablo

They had none. That's why they stuck it out. For an alternative view, look at the bleaters elsewhere on this list who went to Australia and don't like it - for various wet, blah reasons. No backbone, as my old dad used to say.

ebgbs

H Pablo

thanks for the fast response.Are you still in South Africa then?

Pablo

Nope.

ebgbs

Oh-sorry? When you said other bleaters" had left/had no backbone I got the impression some people have left but you've stayed?What you mean then is you don't bleat??
Oh dear-is there anyone with anything positive to say? I guess not-Sounds like most South African's have got out?Are there safer areas to live (as in neighbourhoods not just in securing your individual home)or is it all pretty much a gamble? Are the children going to be able to play in the garden unsupervised?

Pablo

Well of course most South Africans still live in South Africa. And it goes without saying that some areas are safer than others -- but I guess you've sussed that out for yourself during your visit(s) to Cape Town.

Who's being negative? I'm not. The sad bunch who go to Oz and then bleat are the ones whose understanding of the world is determined by gormless programmes like "Place in the Sun" and romantic novels and other pap.

As for crime in South Africa, that has been rehearsed endlessly on this list and elsewhere. It happens, and you can't insulate yourself from it. You just need to read a few news items to understand that. Have you been following the main SA newsfeeds for a while? A useful exercise.

Like I said earlier, you need to live there for a while to understand why people want to get out.

ebgbs

Have you been following the main SA newsfeeds for a while? A useful exercise.

Forgive me-I am surrounded by "little uns" all day & don't keep up too well with the news here let alone elsewhere? WAre you referring to a specific source? I'm not sure I want to live there for a while given the stories I've read! That's the trouble-looking for a happy ending/positive story I suppose! Sounds like I'm being unrealistic/optimistic! Thank you all for giving me your time & kind replies!

Pablo

No really. The newsfeeds are a useful way to get a sort of across-the-board view of what it's like living in SA -- good and bad. And the newsfeeds are convenient too -- just a daily email and you can click on the links that interest you and read more, rather like the ones you can get in the UK for various daily papers, the BBC, etc. So not time consuming unless you want them to be. You just subscribe (for free) and they plop into your inbox and you can read when you feel like it.

I often recommend the Independent on line (iol.co.za) because this picks up all the stuff covered in the various local SA papers. You can also perhaps look at the Cape Times.

There's also the Mail & Guardian site, which also has a newsfeed which you can get as a free daily email. The Mail & Guardian was a big thorn in the side of the old minority government, and is a thorn in the side of the new one too.

I don't know what you mean by wanting "a happy ending/positive story". Is that what you were looking for? I thought you wanted to discuss going to live in South Africa.

It's not a question of "optimistic" or anything else. It's a question of informing yourself and then making an informed decision. What that decision is surely depends on what your priorities are.

ebgbs

Thanks for the recommendations of newspaper links-great idea, yes I'll subscribe to those.
Priorities: keeping me, my boys, my partner & his son out of harms way of course-same as the next South African hey?! If my decision is based upon keeping us all safe then sounds like I shouldn't be entertaining South Africa hey?! So-broken heart it is by the sounds of it.............:-(

Stanley10

A number of reasons, and crime was probably the main one, whilst nothing happened to me or my immediate family, I new people who had been affected to varying degrees. I also have 2 children, and their future there was somewhat murky. An opportunity came up and I took it.

ebgbs

Stanley
AsI am considering a future for my boys in South Africa and as my partner has a son at school would you explicitly state in practical terms what you mean by "murky"-no job etc?

Stanley10

- I wouldn't go so far as to say no jobs, (unemployment is 23% for the country and 5% for whites (from stats SA, I know they are wrong, but lets say the proportions are right, and double them if you like), I'm white and so are my boys), however AA does discriminate against whites, so why should I put my boys in a position where they "may" be discriminated against.

- whilst I say I was never a victim of crime, how would I have felt if they were future victims. I know crime happens everywhere, but it doesn't seem such an immediate possibility over here, and it appears to be less violent when it occurs (excluding bikie shooting in Geelong yesterday (victim deceased), and random stabbing 500 metres from my house on Friday morning (victim survived) as they are exceptional rather than the rule). hmmmm may have shot meself in the foot on this one

- I didn't want to bring them up in a country where everything seems to follow on racial lines. I don't want to bring my boys up as "white" South Africans, I wanted them to be South Africans and this seemed to be an impossibility (so now they are Australians). Basically I was/am tired of the whole race thing, it didn't seem to be going away, so I left.

Uitlander

Hi ebgbs

I am white, British. I lived in Cape Town for many years, and I have NEVER been attacked in Cape Town, unfortunately I have seen considerable horrific violence there. For this reason, I decided that I could not risk the lives of my wife and children, and we returned to England, even though I had a prosperous life in the Cape.

I strongly suggest that you don't go, or at least leave the children with your Mum in the UK.

If you must go then go to a 'gated community', possibly at Century City if you can afford it. and get a panic button connected to 'armed response', Don't burn your bridges behind you, England will seem like paradise after you return from the Cape.

Tegwyn

Ebgbs. Has this man asked you to marry him? If not, what skills do you have to support yourself, and of course see if you qualify for a visa. Getting a job may well be a significant challenge for you.

Only way your children will get a decent education is to go private. They are quite pricey.

Crime is a huge factor, and one that is life altering in all you do. For you to make this giant leap into a very different way of life, with high risks requires a lot of research on your part. To even consider such a significant decision without doing your homework is foolhardy and most certainly a disservice to your children.

The romantic image you enjoy right now may well be blighted by the every day challenges of a restricted lifestyle.

meauxna

What if you went for a six months with the new guy and left the kids at home while you get the first-hand experience? You'll know much better after you've had your own boots on the ground.
My parents moved us away from the US when I was 8 & my sister 5. We had very limited resources and very little idea of what we were doing. While there were dangers and upsets, it all worked out in the end and the experience is irreplaceable.
Don't put all your eggs in the one basket (especially for a love interest).. keep your options open and money in reserve in case you have to leave quickly. There are ways for you to test the waters without jumping all the way in.

ebgbs

Stanley10, Uitlander, Tegwyn, Meauxna, You've all made really valuable contributions here-thank you kindly for your thoughts and diplomatic suggestions. I don't like the idea of leaving my children without me for more than a couple of days let alone weeks or months! I haven't had the opportunity tpo do this in the past and I guess this has quelled the inclination. However-were I able to cope with the separation the suggestion is a sensible and thought provoking one. Yes-my man and I are talking marriage-however has he/I proposed to one another yet? The answer is no! We've been together 1 year. Can I support myself? With AA, visa unknowns etc=probably not (I am an arts graduate so we though I may paint as I have done in the past). I think the bottom lline is could I survive a violent attack on myself-possibly (though even putting myself in the high possibility of attack bracket is crazy!), could I survive/cope with my children being hurt/killed-absolutely not-especially as it would be me that would be putting them in harms way!!!NOW THAT'S CRAZY AND BEYOND SELFISH HEY?! I thought perhaps I might hear that things aren't that bad or that there are specific safe areas or that I was being paranoid/over reacting! It is clear from answers to mine & others on this site that if anything I am not! However-my visit to this site has been a worthwhile one as it has made me realise more than ever that I cannot do this to my children-however much I love a man/he loves me & however heart broken we may both be-the kids come first! THANK YOU ALL