Anyone moved back to SA recently?
May 20th 2007, 7:49 pm
#17
Banned
Joined: Jun 2003
Location: North of Auckland
Posts: 1,996
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
Hi, I lived overseas for 8 years. I am South African and along with my British wife we moved back in 2003.
Moving back here will always be different for everyone. I know of friends who have made the move and love it and others who want to go back. We fall into the later category. For us besides the crime, its more to do with the uncertainty that comes along with living in Africa. Things can change here overnight.
If you could take the crime away and the uncertainty ( I know you can't) this place would be Utopia. I have lived in the US,Europe and the UK and still believe your general day to day life here is better.
Having said that I have noticed the increase in crime, the decay of public infrastructure, the poor getting poorer, the general desperation that some people find themselves in here to mention a few getting worse since we arrived back.
We are now contemplating going back to the UK. I am glad we came back because I now have done it and its out of my system. Its going to be a big move back to the UK for many reasons but feel that if we dont do it now I will regret it later on, as although I hope I am proved wrong cos there are many people who I care about who live in SA and cant leave, I believe that this place is going to be totally different in 10-15 years time, maybe sooner!
Moving back here will always be different for everyone. I know of friends who have made the move and love it and others who want to go back. We fall into the later category. For us besides the crime, its more to do with the uncertainty that comes along with living in Africa. Things can change here overnight.
If you could take the crime away and the uncertainty ( I know you can't) this place would be Utopia. I have lived in the US,Europe and the UK and still believe your general day to day life here is better.
Having said that I have noticed the increase in crime, the decay of public infrastructure, the poor getting poorer, the general desperation that some people find themselves in here to mention a few getting worse since we arrived back.
We are now contemplating going back to the UK. I am glad we came back because I now have done it and its out of my system. Its going to be a big move back to the UK for many reasons but feel that if we dont do it now I will regret it later on, as although I hope I am proved wrong cos there are many people who I care about who live in SA and cant leave, I believe that this place is going to be totally different in 10-15 years time, maybe sooner!
Can I ask you to expand on the last sentence, when you say different?
Cheers and good luck with all your decisions etc .......
Last edited by Campbells; May 20th 2007 at 7:53 pm.
May 21st 2007, 7:02 am
#18
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 14
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
Thanks again for your replies. We are in S.A in two months and so I will let you all know how it goes!
May 21st 2007, 10:46 am
#20
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 14
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
thanks - i hope so too!
May 21st 2007, 1:30 pm
#21
BE Co-Founder
Joined: Feb 2000
Location: Florida
Posts: 25,928
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
Stop it now. Arguing amongst yourselves is not constructive nor is it helping the OP. I've repeatedly seen threads in this forum descend into slanging matches and enough is enough. I am aware that SA is a sensitive issue so please approach it with a more sensitive manner. Calling each other names and belittling each others experiences is not helpful to anyone and if it continues I will start closing threads.
I dont need your respect. But you will show respect to the person who will take the time to come here and post her experiences.
These are her experiences, please explain how you are going to tell her how she experienced something? Infact, when she reads this thread, i would be very surprised if she bothers posting at all....
I never once said there is no crime in South Africa..... There is crime HOWEVER its not the war zone you portray it to be.
And YES, South Africa IS a great tourist destination.... if you bothered to look at my video comments you would hear from some very happy customers....
P.S my cousin went to London last year, she has been mugged at knife point for the first time in here life.... she is from Durban
These are her experiences, please explain how you are going to tell her how she experienced something? Infact, when she reads this thread, i would be very surprised if she bothers posting at all....
I never once said there is no crime in South Africa..... There is crime HOWEVER its not the war zone you portray it to be.
And YES, South Africa IS a great tourist destination.... if you bothered to look at my video comments you would hear from some very happy customers....
P.S my cousin went to London last year, she has been mugged at knife point for the first time in here life.... she is from Durban
Respect is a two way street and you haven’t started that off too well by referring to me paranoid and not capable of rational thinking, boet!
So if you want respect give it.
If your connection (to use a SA term) is going to post a whole heap of nonsense then you would expect people to debate the likes.
As you can see anyone that tries to paint the picture that SA has no crime and it is a wonderful place for tourists to visit is going to get people with opposite experiences explaining their view.
So if you want respect give it.
If your connection (to use a SA term) is going to post a whole heap of nonsense then you would expect people to debate the likes.
As you can see anyone that tries to paint the picture that SA has no crime and it is a wonderful place for tourists to visit is going to get people with opposite experiences explaining their view.
Would be good to get some background as an intro. That is the normal process in these forums. It is also courtesy to let other members get to know you.
Usually members with single digit posts ( many come in this forum with a very aggressive approach and disappear as quick) don’t get too much credibility as there is always someone trying to tell people that SA doesn’t have a crime problem and that the ANC have everything under control.
It’s a bit like the millions that have been squandered on stupid battles of name changes in the country from Pretoria to Tshitwane and Potch to some unpronounceable name. What was the whole thing about the ANC demolishing a voortreeker something or other and that too became heated subject. All this going on over a language battle whilst the poverty is rife and the starving stay hungry.
Sorry, bit off topic….
Usually members with single digit posts ( many come in this forum with a very aggressive approach and disappear as quick) don’t get too much credibility as there is always someone trying to tell people that SA doesn’t have a crime problem and that the ANC have everything under control.
It’s a bit like the millions that have been squandered on stupid battles of name changes in the country from Pretoria to Tshitwane and Potch to some unpronounceable name. What was the whole thing about the ANC demolishing a voortreeker something or other and that too became heated subject. All this going on over a language battle whilst the poverty is rife and the starving stay hungry.
Sorry, bit off topic….
And we will not sell a bag of tosh to help you sell your product either.
May 21st 2007, 3:14 pm
#22
Nuts and Bolts
Joined: Sep 2006
Location: Palm Tree in the Snow
Posts: 2,116
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
There is an element that has come on here recently that are members of another site which are intent on causing as much discourse as possible. An old tactic with the intent of provoking. This can be verified by a few long standing members of BE that have seen this behaviour before.
May 21st 2007, 3:22 pm
#23
BE Co-Founder
Joined: Feb 2000
Location: Florida
Posts: 25,928
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
There is an element that has come on here recently that are members of another site which are intent on causing as much discourse as possible. An old tactic with the intent of provoking. This can be verified by a few long standing members of BE that have seen this behaviour before.
Regards
Sue
May 21st 2007, 8:11 pm
#24
Pog mo thoin
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: Dubai
Posts: 4,103
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
I am a U.K citizen married to an S.A guy. We are off to visit relatives in July in Pretoria. We are seriously thinking of moving back, we are going to check out Oz nxt year and then weigh up them both.
Has anyone moved back to S.A recently that can give a balanced response?
thanks
Has anyone moved back to S.A recently that can give a balanced response?
thanks
My best friend is from Pretoria and says she would not move back there. If she were to move back to SA it would be to Cape Town ONLY.
I have a friend who has moved back to Cape Town recently and lives about 15-20 min drive outside the city (near Tyger Valley). I can put you in touch with him if you like to email him or his wife. If so, please send me a PM as I do not get much time to look at the SA section.
May 21st 2007, 8:27 pm
#25
Banned
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 30
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
There is an element that has come on here recently that are members of another site which are intent on causing as much discourse as possible. An old tactic with the intent of provoking. This can be verified by a few long standing members of BE that have seen this behaviour before.
REally ? is this all people who do not sit and complain about South Africa ? If you dont complain about South Africa you are just a provoker ?
This site is in alot of trouble because anybody who has a different view gets attacked here to the point its not worth staying.......
May 21st 2007, 8:32 pm
#26
Banned
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 30
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
Kato not sure if you saw my friends post through all the bickering 
Hi there,
We moved back here (Jozi) in Oct 2005 after having previously lived here for 11 years then moving back and staying in the UK for 10 years.
We(family of 4) really haven't had any real problems but it depends what you expectations are.
We had no illusions on coming back and to be honest we have been very happy.
Jobs are there, again you just have to keep plugging away as anywhere else.
AA is still alive and well, but if you have the skills you will find a job.
Cost of living has increased but you can't compare what it was 10 yrs ago as you couldn't do anywhere else.
One of the major hassles now is the traffic and gone are the days of commuting from one side of town to the other to work. To travel between Jhb and Pretoria at peak times can take 2 to 3 hrs now, just a joke.
Unbelievable development has taken place, too many complexes for my liking but the are a good safer way of living. Price of houses is also crazy now but still not bad comparing to elsewhere.
Crime is still a major concern, but we have always taken as many precautions as we can no matter where we lived. It is across the board so no one group is any less affected than the other.
The kids settled in well and are even passing Afrikaans exams!
If you have kids, schools here in the public sector are working with large class sizes, but my daughter coped fine. My son however could not keep up with the pace and has gone to a private school with smaller classes until he feels he can manage.
On the plus side we have the great weather, great food and the big outdoors.
I haven't regretted our move at all.
You are doing a good thing by comparing the two countries and are obviously fortunate enough to make a choice. I would have actually loved to spend some time in Aus but being over 40 without a degree, no chance!!
Best of luck, have a great time!
We moved back here (Jozi) in Oct 2005 after having previously lived here for 11 years then moving back and staying in the UK for 10 years.
We(family of 4) really haven't had any real problems but it depends what you expectations are.
We had no illusions on coming back and to be honest we have been very happy.
Jobs are there, again you just have to keep plugging away as anywhere else.
AA is still alive and well, but if you have the skills you will find a job.
Cost of living has increased but you can't compare what it was 10 yrs ago as you couldn't do anywhere else.
One of the major hassles now is the traffic and gone are the days of commuting from one side of town to the other to work. To travel between Jhb and Pretoria at peak times can take 2 to 3 hrs now, just a joke.
Unbelievable development has taken place, too many complexes for my liking but the are a good safer way of living. Price of houses is also crazy now but still not bad comparing to elsewhere.
Crime is still a major concern, but we have always taken as many precautions as we can no matter where we lived. It is across the board so no one group is any less affected than the other.
The kids settled in well and are even passing Afrikaans exams!
If you have kids, schools here in the public sector are working with large class sizes, but my daughter coped fine. My son however could not keep up with the pace and has gone to a private school with smaller classes until he feels he can manage.
On the plus side we have the great weather, great food and the big outdoors.
I haven't regretted our move at all.
You are doing a good thing by comparing the two countries and are obviously fortunate enough to make a choice. I would have actually loved to spend some time in Aus but being over 40 without a degree, no chance!!
Best of luck, have a great time!
May 21st 2007, 8:52 pm
#27
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 308
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
One of my friends moved back to Cape Town last October, she's a Capetonian born and bred. She is currently trying her best to come back to the UK, says she can't live with the way things have changed there in SA.
May 21st 2007, 10:04 pm
#28
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 56
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
It was a little like giving up smoking, my return visits became more frequent until I eventually had the resolve to make the decision to come back.
The settling in process is still ongoing for me and sometimes I long to reverse my decision and return to SA.
This forum has been invaluable in satisfying my thoughts of questions that keep going around my mind and I found there are many others in the same predicament.
I think it must be even harder for South Africans from birth and I am sure they will always consider themselves as South Africans no matter which country they live.
To ease my transition I purposely mix with as many South Africans as I can here in the UK because I prefer them to the English counter parts, I find them better educated, better mannered, warmer, genuine and enjoy their company more.
The decision to return was made in Dec 2001 when the rand topped 20 to the Pound, I realised we were becoming financially trapped in one country.
Here in the UK I find I can still afford annual trips back to SA but doubt if I could have been able to do that if I was still there, it would more likely have been holidaying in the Far East or somewhere where the Rand go’s a bit further.
UK has good broadband connections at reasonable prices, another plus for staying in touch with the news/radio stations back in SA.
What I’m trying to say is that apart from the crime in SA, it makes sense to be based in another country that can provide you a reasonable safe standard of living and visit SA as often as you can to be able to make your judgement.
May 21st 2007, 10:27 pm
#29
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,424
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
Good Post Heartfm.
I grew up in a different, more privileged time.
I lived through events like Sharpeville, Rivonia Treason Trials, The Johannesburg Train Station Bomb,Civil Unrest, the odd landmine on farm Roads, Terrorist/Freedom Fighters , Bombs going off in the Cities, bars, massacres in Kraals and Churches ,Military Service, Crime waves and up until the mid 80's I lived in homes without burglar bars.
Somebody on the unmentionable forum gave the analogy of Frog stew ie: dump a frog into hot water, it jumps, heat up a frog from Cold water to hot, it will boil to death.
I had'nt realised how inured and conditioned I had become till I left.
I have friends and family there who will never leave, either through choice or inability.
Thats their reality and/or choice , I miss the place but not what it became for me.
I grew up in a different, more privileged time.
I lived through events like Sharpeville, Rivonia Treason Trials, The Johannesburg Train Station Bomb,Civil Unrest, the odd landmine on farm Roads, Terrorist/Freedom Fighters , Bombs going off in the Cities, bars, massacres in Kraals and Churches ,Military Service, Crime waves and up until the mid 80's I lived in homes without burglar bars.
Somebody on the unmentionable forum gave the analogy of Frog stew ie: dump a frog into hot water, it jumps, heat up a frog from Cold water to hot, it will boil to death.
I had'nt realised how inured and conditioned I had become till I left.
I have friends and family there who will never leave, either through choice or inability.
Thats their reality and/or choice , I miss the place but not what it became for me.
May 21st 2007, 11:48 pm
#30
Banned
Joined: Jun 2003
Location: North of Auckland
Posts: 1,996
Re: Anyone moved back to SA recently?
Exactly.
My wife is SA born & bred and never lived out of SA until we left two years ago.
I tell you it took a very long time for her to come around to leaving and the biggie was the birth of our son. A pale male as referred to in SA.
It was not easy to leave home for her and about six months ago she put her arms around me and thanked me for getting us out of there. If ever I need to question why we left I just need to look at our wee lad ( 4 now) and the freedom and quality of life he has here. He has a smile that beams from ear to ear – priceless.
We used to have our own swimming pool in SA but that has been replaced with an awesome variety of beaches that we go to in summer, they are all safe. The closest one we walk to, yes that’s right.
New Zealand has a huge emphasis on family and everywhere you go there are fantastic play parks for the kids that are spotless, up-to-date and safe. We have not been to one so far that we have had to pay for as in the resorts in SA.
My wife and I have started our own businesses here and both are really taking off and we have no restrictions on who we can do business with etc etc and the key factor is - if we can get the job done efficiently. We are not told who we have to employ or who has to have equity in our companies.
Ultimately for every $ we earn we earn R5 if you want too look at it like that.
We sleep with our doors and windows open and I can go away on business with zero worries that my family are not safe. The children in our street play in the street . We have a stunning play park 300 mtrs walk from our house. If my neighbours are leaving for work at the same time as me in the morning, I greet them by name.
We have a beautiful private school that we are hoping to get our son into next year and he will walk or cycle to school with the other kids. The school is 100% safe and zero history of guns, knifes or any sort of violence like that . I am positive there have been a few boys having a punch-up and that is acceptable ( by comparison). The kids are not allowed to take mobile phones to school and children do not use them here as a check-in system with their parents so the parents know they are safe.
We do not have a wall at the front of our house . The mail system here is just awesome and VERY cheap, so far nothing has been stolen and we are constantly sending and receiving high value items via mail & courier. Many times the courier companies will leave a parcel at our front door( totally visible from the road) and we had had no instances of theft of such to-date.
I do not remove my radio from the car at night ( or when I park it most places) and many times have left my mobile phone in my car overnight. I have never thought that it will get stolen.
On a business note I have had probably three appointments postponed at the last minute over the last two years and none that were just forgotten about. I can phone most companies and be put through to the MD / CEO. When I go to companies on business I do not get searched and that includes on the major banks head office.
People here still understand the principles of trust and the government is accountable to the people.
We have broadband at a very reasonable rate and our phone bills are acceptable. We do not pay for local phone calls and some service providers are introducing that on a national basis. It is called competition and customer retention.
Hey and guess what. We have a garden service and recently taken on a house cleaning service. We recently bought a very expensive hoover that we would never have dreamed of doing is SA as it would have been broken. My shirts go to dry cleaning.
On most occasion the garden service just arrive do there job and go, there is no security threat and we are totally relaxed about that. We have had a variety of services carried out ranging from phone installed to housecleaning and it is an amazing feeling to be able to let them in a tell them to do what they have to without worrying about theft or violence for that matter. Not once have we considered that any of these people we at our front door ( unlocked most of the time) and here to steal from us or hurt us in any way.
In fact we have left our key a couple of times with our neighbours for such occasions and told the service companies to let themselves in & out. To-date we have experienced zero theft.
We are not limited to Cape Town on Durban for our holiday options and last year went to Fiji and probably UK in December. And next year would like to do Hawaii. The Brit pound is three to one at the moment. Australia is a hop in a plane away and a business with Aus is very common. In a few years we can move to Aus if we want to so there are international options for us if we want to go that route later on.
Hey and for the guys, all my power tools work, my screwdrivers are all there when I need them and if I bring in someone to do a job and pay them to do it the skill levels are much higher than SA.
My point:
All this ( and more) equals less stress for us and of course the biggie, we do not worry about being murdered.
We have changed, we are becoming ( a process) more relaxed and enjoying life way much more. We only get one life so for us; we have done the right thing in moving out of SA.
There are so many South Africans here that Afrikaans is a recognised language and wors is available in most supermarkets. New Zealand lamb, man I’m sorry to say but the chops here on a braai are the best. Oh yes, we have a pretty nice gas braai that stands outside under cover and until this very moment I have never thought that it would get stolen.
Oh yes. I had an ankle injury in January I ended up having a whole range of medical treatment ( first class and spotless) which included a MRI scan. The treatment was extended to Physio and acupuncture. Here’s the deal, I did not pay one dollar for all that and the MRI is probably around R 3500 worth on its own.
Of course we have family health insurance so that if we ever needed an op ( hospital plan) this costs us the total of $120 a month ( around R600) for full cover.
These are just some of the things that come to mind……………………
Now, convince me why we should consider moving back to SA ?
My wife is SA born & bred and never lived out of SA until we left two years ago.
I tell you it took a very long time for her to come around to leaving and the biggie was the birth of our son. A pale male as referred to in SA.
It was not easy to leave home for her and about six months ago she put her arms around me and thanked me for getting us out of there. If ever I need to question why we left I just need to look at our wee lad ( 4 now) and the freedom and quality of life he has here. He has a smile that beams from ear to ear – priceless.
We used to have our own swimming pool in SA but that has been replaced with an awesome variety of beaches that we go to in summer, they are all safe. The closest one we walk to, yes that’s right.
New Zealand has a huge emphasis on family and everywhere you go there are fantastic play parks for the kids that are spotless, up-to-date and safe. We have not been to one so far that we have had to pay for as in the resorts in SA.
My wife and I have started our own businesses here and both are really taking off and we have no restrictions on who we can do business with etc etc and the key factor is - if we can get the job done efficiently. We are not told who we have to employ or who has to have equity in our companies.
Ultimately for every $ we earn we earn R5 if you want too look at it like that.
We sleep with our doors and windows open and I can go away on business with zero worries that my family are not safe. The children in our street play in the street . We have a stunning play park 300 mtrs walk from our house. If my neighbours are leaving for work at the same time as me in the morning, I greet them by name.
We have a beautiful private school that we are hoping to get our son into next year and he will walk or cycle to school with the other kids. The school is 100% safe and zero history of guns, knifes or any sort of violence like that . I am positive there have been a few boys having a punch-up and that is acceptable ( by comparison). The kids are not allowed to take mobile phones to school and children do not use them here as a check-in system with their parents so the parents know they are safe.
We do not have a wall at the front of our house . The mail system here is just awesome and VERY cheap, so far nothing has been stolen and we are constantly sending and receiving high value items via mail & courier. Many times the courier companies will leave a parcel at our front door( totally visible from the road) and we had had no instances of theft of such to-date.
I do not remove my radio from the car at night ( or when I park it most places) and many times have left my mobile phone in my car overnight. I have never thought that it will get stolen.
On a business note I have had probably three appointments postponed at the last minute over the last two years and none that were just forgotten about. I can phone most companies and be put through to the MD / CEO. When I go to companies on business I do not get searched and that includes on the major banks head office.
People here still understand the principles of trust and the government is accountable to the people.
We have broadband at a very reasonable rate and our phone bills are acceptable. We do not pay for local phone calls and some service providers are introducing that on a national basis. It is called competition and customer retention.
Hey and guess what. We have a garden service and recently taken on a house cleaning service. We recently bought a very expensive hoover that we would never have dreamed of doing is SA as it would have been broken. My shirts go to dry cleaning.
On most occasion the garden service just arrive do there job and go, there is no security threat and we are totally relaxed about that. We have had a variety of services carried out ranging from phone installed to housecleaning and it is an amazing feeling to be able to let them in a tell them to do what they have to without worrying about theft or violence for that matter. Not once have we considered that any of these people we at our front door ( unlocked most of the time) and here to steal from us or hurt us in any way.
In fact we have left our key a couple of times with our neighbours for such occasions and told the service companies to let themselves in & out. To-date we have experienced zero theft.
We are not limited to Cape Town on Durban for our holiday options and last year went to Fiji and probably UK in December. And next year would like to do Hawaii. The Brit pound is three to one at the moment. Australia is a hop in a plane away and a business with Aus is very common. In a few years we can move to Aus if we want to so there are international options for us if we want to go that route later on.
Hey and for the guys, all my power tools work, my screwdrivers are all there when I need them and if I bring in someone to do a job and pay them to do it the skill levels are much higher than SA.
My point:
All this ( and more) equals less stress for us and of course the biggie, we do not worry about being murdered.
We have changed, we are becoming ( a process) more relaxed and enjoying life way much more. We only get one life so for us; we have done the right thing in moving out of SA.
There are so many South Africans here that Afrikaans is a recognised language and wors is available in most supermarkets. New Zealand lamb, man I’m sorry to say but the chops here on a braai are the best. Oh yes, we have a pretty nice gas braai that stands outside under cover and until this very moment I have never thought that it would get stolen.
Oh yes. I had an ankle injury in January I ended up having a whole range of medical treatment ( first class and spotless) which included a MRI scan. The treatment was extended to Physio and acupuncture. Here’s the deal, I did not pay one dollar for all that and the MRI is probably around R 3500 worth on its own.
Of course we have family health insurance so that if we ever needed an op ( hospital plan) this costs us the total of $120 a month ( around R600) for full cover.
These are just some of the things that come to mind……………………
Now, convince me why we should consider moving back to SA ?