Today I had a conversation with a job agent and something strikes me as being more than a little odd.

Really perplexing actually, the more I think about it. Because it just isn't logical and Americans do have a very practical and logical side to them.

So, he asked me what I'm looking for in a job and all that. He asks about health insurance and 401k's and all that jazz.

I'm ok for work until early Summer as of today , so when he gets that particular message, our chat becomes much more conversational and light.

I tell him that the pay rate is #1 importance and that time off is second. A very, very close second. Everything else is tertiary and I can take or leave the rest.

He seems to find this difficult to understand and it leaves me wondering after the phone call ends:

How is it that an American employer will/can negotiate wage, schedule, even offer signing bonusses to "attract and retain" But Heaven/Nirvana forbid the option of having more than 2 weeks time off.

Aside from the usual; "well, the Yanks are workaholics" types of comments, What do you think is the reasoning behind this aversion to being off work and why is this the one thing that is least negotiable?

I think alot of it us down to "yanks are workaholics", but not just because they love the job. They want to keep working so that they don't get passed up for that promotion. Time off work is time away from the boss and time for the boss to notice how good a job that Smith did on those accounts while you were on the beach.

On the flip side, it may be more productive for the employer to just give you some more money than have downtime with people not in the office, that and less vacation means less time for you to attend interviews to get another job. And why let you have 2 weeks off when they could replace you with someone who will take the same benefit package and 1 week off?

Just my thoughts anyway, productivity.

Because pay and benefits they can write off as expenses and they get you working 50 seeks of the year. More time off means less work done. Unless you subscribe to the school of thought that more time off makes you more productive!

On the flip side of that, my company just gave everyone 2 extra days of vacation. Now new hires start with 3, and you get 4 after 3 years. You can also 'buy a week' (or take a week unpaid) if you like on top of this.

I'm hoping it's because they realize that almost no one works 40 hours/week.

I think it is mostly down to being the norm. From the employer's point of view, why differ from the norm in a way that may make you less profitable? Most US employees will expect only 2 weeks off, because that is the norm. Why give them more than they expect? Why give more vacation to some nasty furriner just because they would have got more back home? That doesn't help the employer compete in the US marketplace.

From a purely economic view, giving more pay can be much cheaper than more time off. At my company, employees may be paid $40/hr, but charged out at $150/hr. Giving someone an extra 2 weeks off would therefore lose $12k of revenue a year - much easier to offer a $4k higher salary.

The other side of the coin is, they're off more because they are sick and generally not very productive because they couldn't give a shit, what with only having a crappy 2 weeks off...it's not like places that do offer more time off have everyone maxing out their holiday allowance anyway.

I just applied to a place that offers 4.5 weeks including holiday shut down though, but they also give every other friday off paid on top...

Actually, my company does give way more time off than the average American company (probably because we are British-owned and used to more). I was just trying to answer the original question.

I don't know that I subscribe much to the theory that people are more productive if you give them lots of time off. However, if employees are happy because they get decent vacation/sick leave, they stay longer. Having high turnover is very expensive.

Generally 2 weeks of vacation is entry level. I think most people who have worked for a little while get more.

It might be that the $ are a private issue and if they have to stick you an extra $10k no one else in the office will know - whereas if you get a couple more weeks than all the rest they will soon notice and start wanting the same.

my husband has been with the same company for 15 years and still only gets 2 weeks off!

I would agree with that too.
People I work with call off over the most stupid things... one woman demanded to go home early because her pet rabbit was sick!

In the 4+ years I have been with the company I can count on one hand the amount of times I have called off... 1 time I was sick, another there was a blizzard and the highway shut down, 3rd time I went into labour and 4th time my mum died. It is so bad with people abusing it that now the company limit your call offs to 15 per year.

Your pride in having taken so few days off just highlights the point that Xebedee finds so unnerving about this country's attitude to work.

Clearly you live to work. Personally, I try to work to live, and would certainly take a day off for a sick rabbit, poorly budgerigar, sniffling fish...

Does your company pay you more than the people who take days off? Does it tell you how very, very wonderful you are for never being off sick? Have you been promoted up the fast-track because of your exceptional attendance record?

The US attitude that your employer effectively owns you, and that a person doing a mediocre job 362 days per year is somehow better than someone who excels and takes 4 weeks vacation is a weak point in this country's work ethic. Many Americans I talk to see that viewpoint too... but wouldn't dare ask their boss for a 2-week vacation.

No but I am generally given more hours (probably because they know I will turn up).

I was also trying to make the point that I don't call off for the slightest thing... then again it may not be a bad thing, couple of weeks back a woman I work with came to work with a cold, I kid you not, in the 4 hours I worked with her she must have complained 20 times about having a cold!

I do subscribe to that theory. But American workers are treated largely as disposable and easily replaceable. There is a certain amount of fear inculcated into us about losing our jobs, cos there ain't no safety net.

The theory is that if you are good enough to be working, then you are too good to take more holiday, as the company NEEDS you (up until the point you are made redundant of course).

Corporations used to give more vacation time as an employee had been there longer; but since very few people work for the same employer more than a few years, due in part to redundancies, there's no way to ever build up the number of days/weeks one gets off.

You know, I forgot to mention in my demented ramblings that the actual reason for this thread in the first place was to try to find something. Anything plausible, which could be used as an effective angle during conversation with HR goblins to justify a ludicrous desire to have more time off.

Aside from reaching across the desk and strangling them with their Mickey Mouse tie.

PS: The responses are all great - its so nice to know that I don't belong in a straight jacket because of some wild desire to have more time off.

Dont.
No dont........