anotherlimey

You'd rather they "sponsor-a-sniper"?

Giantaxe

Voting and doing jury duty. Most Americans don't.

another bloody yank

As I do many times when researching a reply to a post, I turned to the dictionary. This time I actually turned to two dictionaries, the Merriam-Webster and the Oxford. The word I looked up was "Patriot" and the definitions were, perhaps not surprisingly, slightly different. The first was: "a person who vigorously supports their country and is prepared to defend it." and the second: "one who loves his or her country and supports its authority and interests" . Any guesses which was which? Maybe the difference is meaningless, but I found it interesting.

A couple of the previous posts got me thinking and I want to get those thoughts down before I lose them. First the question of military service dictating patriotism. The way I see it, the mere act of wearing the uniform does not a patriot make. True, some of our greatest patriots have been soldiers, but so have some of our greatest traitors and criminals. The desire to serve our nation is an admirable reason to commit a period of your life to our Armed Forces, but not everyone joins for that reason. Much like our police, some join to serve their community and some join, or continue to serve, for less honorable reasons.

Second, bumperstickers and other such public displays of personal conviction are more a proclamation of your beliefs to all those who may see it than an action that actually supports anything at all. This goes for the left as well as the right as a sticker demanding that the reader "Coexist" accomplishes about as much as a "Support Our Troops" magnet. IMHO, of course.

To me, a Patriot is someone who loves their Country more than they love themselves. Someone who treats Country as you would a family member, with love and respect, yet not letting that devotion obscure your vision when it comes to seeing those mistakes and imperfections that we all have. No Nation and no Family is all good or all bad, and you cannot let your dissatisfaction dimish your pride in the positive. With family as with country, when you see need it's your duty to fill that need, though it might mean some personal sacrifice. To me, a good Patriot is a good parent, a good worker, and a good citizen.




BTW, the first definition above was the Oxford, the second was Merriam-Webster.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/patriot

http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/patriot?view=uk

Rete

If flying or waving the flag is patriotic, then, yes, many Americans are just that. I know that my Canadian husband always bitched that his country didn't show their flag anywhere near as much as Americans and it ticked him off. It wasn't until the debacle at their Parliament with the Quebec senator that made Canadians take their flags out and hang them from their flagpoles or on their houses.

Regardless of what was the cause of our fight for independence, it was fought and successful. It is a day that we enjoy celebrating and for a vast number of Americans, I'm sure the celebration has nothing to do with freedom but rather having a day off and tradition.

I celebrate it for the day that it is, a day to celebrate the beginning of our independence. I celebrate it because so many men, women, children, died in the Revolution and other wars to allow us to keep that independence. I feel that I honor their sacrifice by showing my pride in my country, the country they were willing to give all their valued.

You don't have to like my reasons and you can lambaste Americans from here to doomsday. It is a national holiday, get over it. We don't begrudge you Guy Fawkes Day when you build large bonfires.

The 4th of July is not about politics or politicans.

dbj1000

Oh dear Rete. Yet again, it appears you didn't read the thread before posting. Nobody's lambasting you, and I've seen no sign of any real criticism of your precious nation or its patriotism, for that matter. But once again, don't let that stop you from jumping to the defence of... well, something or other.

'Get over ourselves'? You first!

fatbrit

Rete jumping into a thread where she has absolutely no idea of the cultural subcontexts is one of our regular BE amusements, though.

anotherlimey

I'd be surprised if the Brits did!

Giantaxe

As far as voting goes, in the last Presidential election approximately two thirds of eligible voters registered to vote and of those 70% voted. So under 50% of eligible voters actually voted. In the UK almost everyone gets registered to vote and 61% voted (unusally low, historically over 70% have).

anotherlimey

But don't you automatically get registered to vote in the UK? I don't even remember if I registered.

Giantaxe

Sorry, that's what I meant by "almost everyone gets registered" - the process is essentially semi-automatic in the sense that it's difficult not to be registered. I guess that wasn't clear. So the UK voting turnouts are essentially of the entire eligible voting population whereas that is not the case in the US.

Kaffy Mintcake

Wow Sunflowergirl - I don't see any arrogance in these lyrics:

"God bless America,
Land that I love,
Stand beside her and guide her
Thru the night with a light from above;

From the mountains, to the prairies,
To the oceans white with foam,
God bless America,
My home, sweet home.
God bless America,
My home, sweet home."

Where does it say - God Bless America - everyone else should go to hell?

And for the record, I don't wear a flag pin, or have a magnet on my car. But when I stand for the anthem, for America the Beautiful, etc. I am silent and respectful. It's not an act for others - it means something. I would also stand for the anthems of other nations - it's a sign of respect.

ugacrew

Then what are your feelings when England sings 'God Save the Queen'? Are you equally as arrogant then?

Bluegrass Lass

I don't sing 'God Save the Queen' because I'm not British. I'm a born and bred American. To me, asking God to save someone, who is (was) their leader, is not the same as asking God to bless an entire country.

I just can't stand the premise of the whole 'God Bless America' phrase, period. No matter what the lyrics actually are, it seems everyone I meet just ticks me off with the arrogance that God will bless America because we so right deserve it, and everyone else can go to hell. Maybe it's a Southern attitude I'm seeing being in somewhat rural, mostly Conservative, bible-thumping KY, and the attitudes are different in other areas. But here, it just rubs me the wrong way.

For the record, KJ, I also stand and am silent (or sing) the national anthem. I've never been present anywhere where another anthem was being played, but I would respect someone else's equally as much. I just can't stand the overt, over-zealousness I see here.

Dan725

Ha, I have many friends in a different organization, and they are opposed to the war in Iraq.... I know I certainly was when I was there

Thats what always cracks me up about some of this patriotism tied with the military thing. Most of the people in the military couldn't give a crap, in the sense those who have no inkling about it do. People who join under that misguided theme generally get that knocked out of them very quickly. All the lip service that is given is fine and dandy, and its nice to hear "back home", but the fact of it is that when you are there, it doesnt matter either ways.

But, I do have to say, away from the military and on a "Pride in the nation" basis, the US does put the UK to shame.

Lorna at Vicenza

[QUOTE=Tootsie Frickensprinkles;6531536] if there were restrictions for flying a flag on public buildings what makes you think there were none for private residences ? Brits actually needed to obtain local planning permission to raise a flagpole (often very difficult if not nearly impossible to get).