miami078

I wonder if somebody could help me I am getting very confused regard the whole UK pension and USA sosical security. I was eager to find out what would happen to my UK pension upon immgirating to the USA. i currently have only paid ten years into it (i am 30) and have been advised I can continue to make either class two or three contributions for another twenty years and this would mean I would be eligible foor full UK state pension even if I am still in the USA....ok so far however what happens when I start working in the USA and pay social security on my earnings., Does this go towards my UK pension (as I am aware there is some sort of agreement between countries). If not what does it go towards as I am aware that upon completing the I-130 visa we had to sign something to say we would not apply for any benefits and that my financial sponsor would be eligible for suporting me....so if social secrutiy goes towards the USA retirement fund or medicare etc and I am not eligible what am I paying the SS for? Or am i eligible for medicare upon enering the USA?

I am so very confused. My parents are even telling me to bother contiunuing paying into the UK state pension but as I dont have any savings and am worried re the future I thought it better to pay into that than nothing? Would I end up paying into two pension though as soon as I start working in the USA (although I intend to go to uni so I prob wouldnt have that many years of paying social security into the USa state retirment fund)

Hope somebody can help as the HM revenue and customs cant seem to advise although they are great if you are only working abroad temporarily.

miamia

Mummy in the foothills

If I could do it all over I'd continue to pay into UK pension if I could. I've worked in US about 20 years, but with kids, mostly I was part time, my SSI will probably allow me to buy the sunday paper once a week once I'm retired.
Also if you have other pensions theres the windfall elimination provision where they reduce your SSI payments seeing you get money from elsewhere.
Call me a pessimist, but here it seems your doomed if you do and doomed if you don't. I much prefer the set amount you receive from UK after 30 years of working and paying the full amount and you get to keep whatever company pension you get, you get ontop.

dunroving

So US windfall would include UK state pension and personal pensions (UK and US)? Could you potentially not get ANY US SS pension?

Crap!

Bob

If you meet the requirements, you can claim both pensions, if you don't meet the requirements, you can use contributions in one country towards the other country to get a full pension in that country.

You won't be eligible for medicare till you meet the requirements, age and number of contributions.

Mummy in the foothills

From what I can gather anyway. Seeing you'd be filling out US taxes forever, they'll know about your UK pension and any other private pensions you have wouldn't they?
Dh's SSI will be reduced, he has a nice teamster pension coming one day we hope. There was me thinking he'd be getting SSI on top.

Zonie

These links may help you, they are about the uk/usa social security agreement that you referred to

http://www.dwp.gov.uk/international/...countries/usa/

http://www.socialsecurity.gov/intern..._Texts/uk.html

Medicare is for people aged 65 and over. If you have worked for 10 years in the USA you should be covered. If you haven’t, then you can buy into it.

Giantaxe

You mean SS not SSI (Supplemental security income).

I don't think this is correct. The government pension offset only applies to those who have a government pension (federal, state, local) and haven't been paying social security contributions in that job. It also applies to state pensions (like the UK's) that there is a reciprocal agreement for. There's a bill in Congress to repeal this (the whole thing is inherently unfair, imo), but given the cost to fix it, I doubt it's got much chance of passing:

http://www.afscme.org/retirees/1724.cfm

Mallory

Does your DH pay social security? If he does, you would be entitled to either your own, or half of his (whichever is bigger). If he dies before you, you would go to his full payment.

You are not double taxed. If you move back to UK, you will pay taxes there into UK system.

If you move back to UK and start working again, they will add your US years to your UK years.

You can get both Brit pension and UK pension if have enough years.

There is no double taxation, US/UK have a tax treaty.

Giantaxe

She's referring to the US windfall elimination provisions as opposed to double taxation:

http://www.dwp.gov.uk/international/...in-social/#usa

dunroving

This part is interesting: "Any part of your UK State Pension based on voluntary contributions to the UK will not affect the amount of your US benefit"

- voluntary contributions are what you pay while out of the country, is that correct? So if, for example, you worked 10 years in the UK and then paid 20 years VC's while overseas, this seems to say the UK pension for 20 years (so, presumably, 2/3 of your UK state pension) won't count against the windfall provision? That doesn't seem very fair to people who worked for 30 years in the UK ...

I also note that the windfall provision will not reduce your US pension below 50% ... which answers one of my earlier questions.

miami078

Dear All

thank you so much for your comments i think i am starting to get my head around it. one example the pension website gives is the following:

If you had paid five years' UK insurance and 10 years' US insurance, we would work out how much UK State Pension you would have got if you had been paying UK insurance for 15 years. But because you have only actually been paying UK insurance for five years, we would pay you one-third (five-fifteenths) of that UK State Pension.

Do they mean that the US governemnt would then give you the ten years worth as it doesnt seem fair to pay ten years in the USA and although yes its taken into account with regards to the US pension you are still not receiving full payment OR are the fact the ten years in the USA is being used i nthe UK to allow you to get any sort of pension means you have to forgo full payment?

I am also intrigued if you have missed a few years for either pension (Uk or USA) do you still receive the pension just at a reduced rate?

I am very new to thinking re pensions etc and some people are telling me that I am stupid to even think about continuing to pay voluntary contributions whilst in the USA as the UK pension may not even exist in say 3- years time. What does everybody think? as far as I am aware the US pension is equally as dubious infact any pension is a risk? Can any body advise? At the moment I am swaying towards paying class 3 voluntary national contributions whilst in the USA if I can afford it (as I wont be working and if I do it will be very low wages as I intend to return to study.) Then I will also pay towards USA pension through SS and hope that after 30 years I will get a little from both countries?

Does anybody also happen to know if you can get NI exemption whilst abroad e.g from returning to study or pay at a reduced rate due to low earnings or is this only an option for UK citizens?

My husband unfortuantely has been studying for the last ten years in the UK and therefore has no SS payments built up in the USA so unfortuantely I wont be able to rely on any of his saving etc

Thank you again for your help and I look forward to somebody explaining to me how on earth I can make apporpiate provisions for my future (I have recently celebrated my 30th birthday and I think thats where all of these questions are coming from....plus immgirating in 7 weeks!!!)

Best wishes

miamia

miami078

Another quick comment. I had throught I would only be eligible to pay class 3 whilst abroad as it states you can only pay class 2 if employed abroad or self employed. As I am not going directly into employment I had thought I would have to pay class 3 which is £12.50 per week and only covers state pension. However the lady at the HM revenue told me this morning that I am elgible to pay class two because of my contributions to date - this will be £2.40 and cover not just state pension but job seekers etc. I am a little confused. I have been self employed in the past but my account for this closed 3 years ago. I may retunr to self employed work in the future but I wouldnt be registered in the UK if I did...any ideas why this is...although I am not complaining at all as I cant really afford class 3

miami078

Hi all just to keep you updated

I phoned the pension company again as it didn’t quite make sense that I was allowed to pay class 2 without employment straight away. I spoke to another lady who mentioned that not I wouldn’t be able to pay class 2 unless I was working or self employed over there. The problem is as mentioned I wont be employed right away and even when I am it will be through a temp agency so I will prob have many gaps between work. I was considering registering as self employed again (I was a self employed actor/drama teacher in the UK for 6 years). Does anybody know how easy it is to register as self employed in the USA and if I need work as self employed before I register or if I can just register? I will prob be looking for some ad hoc teaching work also in the USA so registering will not only help me prepare for that but also make me eligible for class 2?

Mia

Giantaxe

There's no concept in the US of "registering as self employed".

Bluegrass Lass

As Giantaxe stated, there is no such thing in the US as registering as self-employed. You either work for yourself, or work directly for a private/public entity.

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by 'ad hoc teaching work'. In order to be a full-time teacher you need to research the requirements to teach in the state that you will be living in. It will probably be necessary to pass a PRAXIS exam to become certified to teach in that state. If you only plan on being a substitute teacher, I think each county has an agency/ department that you can sign up with..and you may also have to meet certain minimum requirements in order to be a substitute teacher.