UK pension transfer to USA
Can anyone recommend company that specialize in private pensions in UK and transferring to USA? Thank you |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
If you are thinking of the scheme QROPS (tranferring money from private pension schemes to US) I suggest you do a search on QROPS in this forum.
This question has come up lots of times and I don't remember anyone coming up with a workable solution to being able to do so. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Not permitted under US domestic law.
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Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Thank you for replying, I see there are quite a few companies on social media advertising UK to USA transfer so presuming they are not reputable |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
While HMRC may have given the ok for a number of companies to accept QROPs, HMRC cannot speak on behalf of the IRS. The IRS has made it clear QROPs are not acceptable. If one were to try, you would find yourself with a whole lot of problems, as it would be viewed as a "non qualified" pension on which you took a distribution of the entire amount subject to tax at your highest marginal rate. Not a pleasant. Also don't think a workaround via a Malta QROPS which some companies promote is an option. It isn't. Best thing, keep your pension in the UK.
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Re: UK pension transfer to USA
In one case, there is an outstanding 'cease-and desist proceeding' filed by the US SEC pertaining to such a scheme.
https://www.sec.gov/litigation/admin/2018/ia-4993.pdf From the June 4, 2018 SEC filing: "Clients are primarily U.S. residents or citizens who held U.K. defined benefit and defined contribution pensions." "[respondent*] provided investment advice to its clients in connection with the transfer of these U.K. pension assets to overseas retirement plans that qualified under the U.K. tax authority's regulations as a Qualifying Recognised Pension Scheme ("QROPS")." Further comments in the filing (articles 17 to 19) are listed under the following heading: "......misrepresentations and omissions concerning QROPS benefits - Statements concerning U.S. and U.K. tax treatment" "[respondent*] made a variety of definitive statements to prospective clients concerning purported tax benefits of the QROPS transfer that were materially misleading." Numerous articles have appeared concerning the filing. * I have used the term [respondent] above since the company involved has prevented use of its name on forums such as BE. Any attempt to post the name will appear as "******". |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Rather than start a new thread, I hope it’s ok to digress a little.
I just started to collect my U.K. state pension, which I am allowing to accumulate in U.K. pounds in my Transferwise Borderless account. The money is going to stay there at least until next year. When I file my U.S. taxes in 2019 how will I declare this Income (assuming I must declare it) when it is in a foreign currency. many thanks |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by nearpost1
(Post 12583671)
Rather than start a new thread, I hope it’s ok to digress a little.
I just started to collect my U.K. state pension, which I am allowing to accumulate in U.K. pounds in my Transferwise Borderless account. The money is going to stay there at least until next year. When I file my U.S. taxes in 2019 how will I declare this Income (assuming I must declare it) when it is in a foreign currency. many thanks |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by lansbury
(Post 12583795)
I have mine paid in to my UK bank account and leave there until I transfer it over. It needs to be declared on your US tax return, regardless of where the money is. It goes on line 16 of the 1040.
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Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by nearpost1
(Post 12583803)
thanks Lansbury, I took a little google since posting, and read that I should apply the exchange rate of the day when funds arrive in my gbp acct, and then declare that amount of usd at filing time. The account will be FBAR reportable if you are required to file an FBAR & 8938 reportable if you are required to file an 8938. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Thanks Cook County |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by nearpost1
(Post 12583671)
Rather than start a new thread, I hope it’s ok to digress a little.
I just started to collect my U.K. state pension, which I am allowing to accumulate in U.K. pounds in my Transferwise Borderless account. The money is going to stay there at least until next year. When I file my U.S. taxes in 2019 how will I declare this Income (assuming I must declare it) when it is in a foreign currency. many thanks |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by MidAtlantic
(Post 12584596)
I suggest you examine the financial protection provided if you are going to accumulate money in the Transferwise Borderless Account.
account I recall learning that my money is not safeguarded quite as safely as an fdic insured U.S. bank acct or it’s u.k equivalent. However I decided I can sleep soundly because the systems/insurances etc. that do safeguard my money are almost as secure. would anyone care to handicap the safety of money in Transferwise for me. Fdic 100% safe u.k. High st bank 100% safe Transferwise. 95%? 85%? thanks Should add that I understand that nothing is guaranteed in our world, I’m just looking for a sense of how secure folks on here feel about Transferwise. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
If Transferwise went bust and they had no assets, unless they have clients money in a “client account” my belief is you would lose all your money. Without searching their web site for the info my recollection is they don’t put the money in a client account. How financially secure they are I have no idea. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by lansbury
(Post 12584973)
If Transferwise went bust and they had no assets, unless they have clients money in a “client account” my belief is you would lose all your money. Without searching their web site for the info my recollection is they don’t put the money in a client account. How financially secure they are I have no idea. Thanks |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by nearpost1
(Post 12584953)
This is important to me as I am holding a large amount of sterling at Transferwise. At the time I opened the account I recall learning that my money is not safeguarded quite as safely as an fdic insured U.S. bank acct or it’s u.k equivalent. However I decided I can sleep soundly because the systems/insurances etc. that do safeguard my money are almost as secure. would anyone care to handicap the safety of money in Transferwise for me. Fdic 100% safe u.k. High st bank 100% safe Transferwise. 95%? 85%? thanks Should add that I understand that nothing is guaranteed in our world, I’m just looking for a sense of how secure folks on here feel about Transferwise. I have no idea what the actual risk is. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by vespucci
(Post 12585009)
You're suggesting that it may only be 95% or 85% safe yet you're thinking of keeping a large amount of money there long-term? Doesn't sound wise.
I have no idea what the actual risk is. I have been googling about this evening, and feel even more confident about them than I did before. FCA etc. Just looking to learn is all. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by lansbury
(Post 12584973)
If Transferwise went bust and they had no assets, unless they have clients money in a “client account” my belief is you would lose all your money. Without searching their web site for the info my recollection is they don’t put the money in a client account. How financially secure they are I have no idea.
Originally Posted by nearpost1
(Post 12584974)
Apologies Lansbury, can you reword that for me as I don’t understand Thanks |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by lansbury
(Post 12585011)
Solicitors, and I know some of the currency brokers, place their clients money in a Client Account. That is a separate account from their business account and the money in such an account doesn't belong to the company. So in the event the company went bankrupt the Client Account is not an asset of the company, and the funds in it belong to the clients and can be returned to them.
thanks |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Where is the boarderless account held? There are different 'Terms and Conditions' for the US arm of Transferwise to those of the U.K. arm. Google Transferwise USA and Transferwise UK. Both have different financial regulations governed by their respective authorities. Funds in a U.K. account , administered by the U.K. arm and under U.K. Financial Regulations (the funds are held in a Barclays account?) may require both FATCA and FBAR reporting if the account holder is a US Person. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by theOAP
(Post 12585110)
Where is the borderless account held? There are different 'Terms and Conditions' for the US arm of Transferwise to those of the U.K. arm. Google Transferwise USA and Transferwise UK. Both have different financial regulations governed by their respective authorities. Funds in a U.K. account , administered by the U.K. arm and under U.K. Financial Regulations (the funds are held in a Barclays account?) may require both FATCA and FBAR reporting if the account holder is a US Person. For the UK it looks like funds are held in a "client account" at Barclays: https://transferwise.com/help/articl...erless-account For the US I have been unable to find an answer. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Hi again. Well I live in the USA and opened my acct on line with Transferwise because I was anticipating receiving an inheritance from my Fathers solicitor back in London, where Dad lived. The money was transferred last month from Lloyd’s of London (solicitors bank acct) to Transferwise in Shoreditch London (I gave the solicitor a sort code and my borderless bank acct number with the Transferwise Shoreditch address. The funds are in U.K. pounds. I had another google yesterday about Transferwise, and it appears they are governed by FCA. I did not realize that my money is actually in a Barclays Bank acct. Be that as it may, do you folks feel I should be confident in having funds there? FCA seems to indicate that Transferwise Shoreditch are bound to refund me if my loot gets pinched. thanks again |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by nearpost1
(Post 12585368)
Hi again. Well I live in the USA and opened my acct on line with Transferwise because I was anticipating receiving an inheritance from my Fathers solicitor back in London, where Dad lived. The money was transferred last month from Lloyd’s of London (solicitors bank acct) to Transferwise in Shoreditch London (I gave the solicitor a sort code and my borderless bank acct number with the Transferwise Shoreditch address. The funds are in U.K. pounds. I had another google yesterday about Transferwise, and it appears they are governed by FCA. I did not realize that my money is actually in a Barclays Bank acct. Be that as it may, do you folks feel I should be confident in having funds there? FCA seems to indicate that Transferwise Shoreditch are bound to refund me if my loot gets pinched. thanks again https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/prud...nsation-scheme Amounts of compensation: deposits Deposits held in banks, building societies and credit unions (including in Northern Ireland) that are authorised by the PRA are protected up to £85,000. This includes, for example, eligible deposits in current accounts, savings accounts, cash ISAs (held with a deposit taker) or savings bonds. The deposit protection limit applies to the total eligible deposits of each person, per PRA-authorised firm. So for deposits in a joint account, this means that each account holder is protected up to the deposit protection limit, i.e. the total protection adds up to two times £85,000. A PRA-authorised firm may own several banking and building society brands. This means that anyone who has deposits in more than one account under a single brand, or multiple accounts under different brands owned by a single firm, is only protected up to a total of £85,000 across all these accounts. There will be temporary deposit protection for up to 6 months above the £85,000 limit for certain types of deposits classified as temporary high balances, such as the proceeds from private property sales. Protection will be up to £1million in most cases. People with eligible deposits that add up to more than the deposit protection limit may wish to take steps to keep their deposits fully protected (e.g. by splitting their deposits across different PRA-authorised firms). Note - PRA The Bank of England prudentially regulates and supervises financial services firms through the Prudential Regulation Authority (PRA). |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
I am sure it probably is not held in an individual account. If you are lucky the account may be covered up to £85k , but if that money belongs to 100,000 people, you will not get much back. I know this happened in 2008 when money market accounts held by insurance companies went under.
This article has a pretty comprehensive review of Transferwise. https://www.neverendingvoyage.com/tr...erless-review/ "However, Transferwise isn’t as secure as a normal bank because your money is not guaranteed by the Financial Services Compensation Scheme (FSCS). If the bank where Transferwise stores your money (i.e. Barclays in the UK) were to become insolvent then you aren’t guaranteed the return of your funds (usually you’d get up to £85,000 back)." |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
So I found this, text is at the bottom. It makes clearer to me what Lansbury said earlier. If Barclays went bust I’m out of luck. May I infer from this though that if Transferwise went bust I’m insured up to £85,000? That last part isn’t exactly spelled out. FWIW I’m happy to live with the possibility that Barclays might become insolvent. As I type this I realize I’ve drifted away from my real concern, which is what happens if the account is hacked and my funds are stolen? Is my money covered by a financial protection scheme? TransferWise is an authorised Electronic Money Institution regulated by the Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) in the UK. We're required by law to protect your money by storing it in a low-risk financial institution (in Europe this is in our UK Barclays bank accounts). That means that, in the unlikely event that TransferWise became insolvent, your money would be unaffected and should be refunded to you in full. If our official Banking Institution (in Europe this would mean Barclays), became insolvent, your return of funds would not be guaranteed as the account is not guaranteed by the Financial Services Compensation Scheme (FSCS). We take the safety and security of your money very seriously. We fulfil rigorous regulatory standards in UK, Europe, US, and every country we operate in. As such, millions of customers trust TransferWise with their money, we currently move over £1 billion around the world every single month.” |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Having listened to MoneyBox recently, you funds are not necessarily protected against fraud under current UK banking regulations. There have been many stories where people have lost their life savings and not been protected. To be fair, there is only so much you can do to protect your money.
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Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by mrken30
(Post 12585401)
Having listened to MoneyBox recently, you funds are not necessarily protected against fraud under current UK banking regulations. There have been many stories where people have lost their life savings and not been protected. To be fair, there is only so much you can do to protect your money.
okay mrken. Just to put what you have written in perspective, does Moneybox draw any distinction between the fraud occurring at Transferwise (Barclays), and the fraud occurring at a High St bank. That High St. bank could be Barclays again, or Lloyd’s etc. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by nearpost1
(Post 12585413)
okay mrken. Just to put what you have written in perspective, does Moneybox draw any distinction between the fraud occurring at Transferwise (Barclays), and the fraud occurring at a High St bank. That High St. bank could be Barclays again, or Lloyd’s etc. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by mrken30
(Post 12585416)
From memory the banks were Santander and TSB, I could be wrong. But the story involved High Street banks not online banks. Thought the fraud was committed online.
i just got off the phone with TWise, agent needs to research and get back to me. She stated they will make me whole in the event of a hack/fraud, but could not explain how TWise would achieve that as they are not insured against such an event. I will update on here when I get something in writing from TWise. The reason I am letting the funds sit there at TWise is that I was hoping the GBP might improve between now and April next year, before converting to usd. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by MidAtlantic
(Post 12585129)
For the UK it looks like funds are held in a "client account" at Barclays: https://transferwise.com/help/articl...erless-account |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
So I just got an e-mail from Transferwise: "..in the UK and EEA all of the Borderless accounts are kept within safeguarding accounts within Barclay's bank. This differs for each region, depending on where you live in the world.
In the United States, the funds ... are kept within safeguarding accounts with Wells Fargo. This is regardless of the currency that you're holding your funds in." This still leaves me with a lot of questions, including the need to know where they are for FBAR/8938 purposes and the nature of that "safeguarding". nearpost1 - I believe that, because you live in the USA, your funds are probably with Wells Fargo, assuming your US address is what you registered with Transferwise. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by nearpost1
(Post 12585012)
well I have a borderless account. With that information can you render an opinion on how you feel about TWise? thanks |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by MidAtlantic
(Post 12585441)
including the need to know where they are for FBAR/8938 purposes .
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Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by MidAtlantic
(Post 12585441)
So I just got an e-mail from Transferwise: "..in the UK and EEA all of the Borderless accounts are kept within safeguarding accounts within Barclay's bank. This differs for each region, depending on where you live in the world.
In the United States, the funds ... are kept within safeguarding accounts with Wells Fargo. This is regardless of the currency that you're holding your funds in." This still leaves me with a lot of questions, including the need to know where they are for FBAR/8938 purposes and the nature of that "safeguarding". nearpost1 - I believe that, because you live in the USA, your funds are probably with Wells Fargo, assuming your US address is what you registered with Transferwise. thats quite remarkable as a i always assumed the money was still in the U.k. where it would remain until I transferred it. Of course no actual transfer would occur at that time as TWise would simply send me some u.s. dollars from the u.s. side of the pond. anyway I shall await T wises response to my fraud concerns |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by lansbury
(Post 12585447)
I've just logged into my Transferwise account and my Bordless account still has a London address. I have always assumed that means it is FBAR etc reportable.
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Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by nearpost1
(Post 12585493)
up till now it was my intention to do fbar reporting and also the irs tax form “8000”something or other. Now, based on mid atlantic’s Thoughts, I’m wondering if the money is actually in the U.K. to begin with . Hmm |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by lansbury
(Post 12585497)
The account has a London address, a UK sort code and account number. Regardless of where the money physically is, it might be well nigh impossible to convince the US authorities it isn't in the UK. I plan to report it as if it is UK account and save a potential argument.
Lansbury |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
Originally Posted by lansbury
(Post 12585497)
The account has a London address, a UK sort code and account number. Regardless of where the money physically is, it might be well nigh impossible to convince the US authorities it isn't in the UK. I plan to report it as if it is UK account and save a potential argument.
https://transferwise.com/help/articl...y-money-stored Like you, if I had reportable sums I would declare them anyway, because that is far easier than any dispute about where the funds are located. It also begs the question whether Transferwise does FACTA reporting anyway. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
From the UK site:
"Will you report my transfers to the tax authorities? TransferWise Limited is a UK company authorised by the Financial Conduct Authority as an Electronic Money Institution. We are still evaluating the impact of the Common Reporting Standards, including FATCA, to our business and how we will adopt the new requirements. At this time we are not reporting this information to HMRC or any other tax authority. Who do I have to report my taxes to? Customers are required to disclose and pay any necessary taxes associated with transfers made through our systems. The triggering of a tax liability and/or reporting obligation will depend on your tax residency, the nature of the income/gains and potentially the amount. We recommend you seek tax advice if you are unclear on the implications of a specific transaction. Please note - The above information is based on UK tax law, so you may need to check this information with your own tax authority if you have any more specific questions." https://transferwise.com/help/articl...counts-and-tax [bold mine] I'm guessing here........but assume a user account registered in the UK falls under UK Authority. An individual's account (in the individuals name) would be covered, in case of failure, for £85,000; but what is the coverage of funds held in a client account (in the entities name, held as one whole amount including proceeds from all clients combined). Is coverage of a client account the same as for an individual account or are there separate rules? If the user account is registered in the US, then FDIC rules would apply for individual and entity accounts. As with US banks having UK/EU operations, which authority does the user go to if a loss occurs when the funds are in the UK/EU system?... and, vice versa. If a US registered account has all funds which are deposited into the account from abroad sent immediately to the US, then it may not be a problem. IMHO. |
Re: UK pension transfer to USA
OAP Thanks for info re reporting, which seems to support completing Fatca and the other irs form at tax time. How or if my funds are protected from fraud still seems to be a murky issue only resolved if I immediately transfer funds over to my U.S. Bank is how I interpret the second part if your post. Again, just to be clear, I live in the USA and registered with TWise while in the USA, using the only address I possess, an address in Washington State. However and this was the purpose of me opening the account, the money that is in the account came/comes from two British entities. The DWP, who make a transfer of my state pension every four weeks, and a London solicitor who mad a one time transfer to TWise from their Lloyd’s bank account in London. When I log into my TWise account it shows their address as Shoreditch London and my balance is in GBP. It is there that I also see a sort code and my a/c number. I know you expressed uncertainty with questions marks regarding what protections, if any are in place for customers based in The U.K., but did I read the last part of your post correctly when you said that FDIC will insure my funds in my situation as I am a customer registered in the U.S.? Further, that they will protect me regardless of whether funds are in a personal account or entity account? just wanted to clarify, thanks |
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