State Tax Withholding NY/NJ
Jan 31st 2025 | 5:18 am
#16
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Posts: 297
From: New York
Re: State Tax Withholding NY/NJ
Jan 31st 2025 | 7:17 am
#17
DE-UK-NZ-IE-US... the TYP
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 3,018
Re: State Tax Withholding NY/NJ
I understand that W-4s are submitted by me to my employer. They are asking me to complete an NJ W-4. However, if I do so then they will start withholding NJ taxes which I will not owe, in addition to NY taxes (which I will). I don't want this unnecessary withholding.
I could provide a W-4 as they ask and indicate that I am exempt, however, according to the rules on the form I do not qualify as "exempt". I agree there is information elsewhere that says they do not need to withhold tax for me as you quote. However, taking the form at face value, it would be incorrect to indicate I am exempt. I could do that (option 2), many people probably do, but it's not correct based on the explicit rules on the form. The form is not well designed to reflect what the actual rules are.
Option 1 is to refuse my employers request and do not submit an NJ W-4 at all. This is my current position and thus far and meant correctly that NJ tax has not been withheld. That's what I meant by convincing them that they don't need an NJ W-4 from me.
I could provide a W-4 as they ask and indicate that I am exempt, however, according to the rules on the form I do not qualify as "exempt". I agree there is information elsewhere that says they do not need to withhold tax for me as you quote. However, taking the form at face value, it would be incorrect to indicate I am exempt. I could do that (option 2), many people probably do, but it's not correct based on the explicit rules on the form. The form is not well designed to reflect what the actual rules are.
Option 1 is to refuse my employers request and do not submit an NJ W-4 at all. This is my current position and thus far and meant correctly that NJ tax has not been withheld. That's what I meant by convincing them that they don't need an NJ W-4 from me.
Again I do t think you understand how payroll works.
Your payroll provider will withhold for NJ if you are resident there. The W4 is what you use to claim the exemption/allowance or whatever you state calls it. So filling a W4 is not what starts withholding, it’s what is used to reduce/ adjust / stop it. So not filling it should mean you get full / double withholding.
What did the NJ Division of Taxation say when you contacted them to clarify any concerns you have with the form?
Jan 31st 2025 | 7:26 am
#18
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Posts: 297
From: New York
Re: State Tax Withholding NY/NJ
I don't think you are reading what I am saying or understanding how payroll works.
I moved there in 2024 and never completed an NJ W-4.
I have not had any NJ tax withheld since then, so you are wrong in your assertion that without an NJ W-4 there will be full withholding, in fact there has been 0 withholding without an NJ W-4. (You might be right Federally or even for other states, but not NJ).
It's only an issue now as my employer has asked me to submit an NJ W-4.
"Your payroll provider will withhold for NJ if you are resident there." <- Incorrect
"filling a W4 is not what starts withholding" <- Incorrect
"not filling it should mean you get full / double withholding." <- Incorrect
I can't get anyone on the phone from the state but will keep trying.
If anyone else is feeling gaslit, here's an AI summary of this thread.
If you don't know you can leave it to others who may have experience in the area.
I moved there in 2024 and never completed an NJ W-4.
I have not had any NJ tax withheld since then, so you are wrong in your assertion that without an NJ W-4 there will be full withholding, in fact there has been 0 withholding without an NJ W-4. (You might be right Federally or even for other states, but not NJ).
It's only an issue now as my employer has asked me to submit an NJ W-4.
"Your payroll provider will withhold for NJ if you are resident there." <- Incorrect
"filling a W4 is not what starts withholding" <- Incorrect
"not filling it should mean you get full / double withholding." <- Incorrect
I can't get anyone on the phone from the state but will keep trying.
If anyone else is feeling gaslit, here's an AI summary of this thread.
Based on the thread, it appears that tht is not fully understanding the specific situation and concern that the original poster (porkedpie) is expressing. Here's why:
1. Misunderstanding the core issue: tht seems to focus on general tax liability and filing, while porkedpie's main concern is specifically about withholding and how to properly complete (or avoid completing) the NJ W-4 form.
2. Confusion about "Uncle Sam": tht misinterprets porkedpie's use of "Uncle Sam" as referring only to federal taxes, when porkedpie was using it more generally to refer to lending money to the government through overwithholding.
3. Suggesting solutions that don't address the problem: tht advises adjusting withholding in line with tax liability, but doesn't address the specific issue with the NJ W-4 form that porkedpie is facing.
4. Misunderstanding porkedpie's level of knowledge: tht suggests that porkedpie doesn't understand how payroll works, when porkedpie actually demonstrates a clear understanding of the withholding process and their specific situation.
5. Missing the nuance of the form issue: tht doesn't seem to recognize porkedpie's dilemma regarding the discrepancy between the NJ W-4 form instructions and the actual tax situation for NY/NJ commuters.
Overall, while tht provides some general tax information, they don't seem to fully grasp the specific withholding issue that porkedpie is trying to resolve regarding the NJ W-4 form.
1. Misunderstanding the core issue: tht seems to focus on general tax liability and filing, while porkedpie's main concern is specifically about withholding and how to properly complete (or avoid completing) the NJ W-4 form.
2. Confusion about "Uncle Sam": tht misinterprets porkedpie's use of "Uncle Sam" as referring only to federal taxes, when porkedpie was using it more generally to refer to lending money to the government through overwithholding.
3. Suggesting solutions that don't address the problem: tht advises adjusting withholding in line with tax liability, but doesn't address the specific issue with the NJ W-4 form that porkedpie is facing.
4. Misunderstanding porkedpie's level of knowledge: tht suggests that porkedpie doesn't understand how payroll works, when porkedpie actually demonstrates a clear understanding of the withholding process and their specific situation.
5. Missing the nuance of the form issue: tht doesn't seem to recognize porkedpie's dilemma regarding the discrepancy between the NJ W-4 form instructions and the actual tax situation for NY/NJ commuters.
Overall, while tht provides some general tax information, they don't seem to fully grasp the specific withholding issue that porkedpie is trying to resolve regarding the NJ W-4 form.
Last edited by porkedpie; Jan 31st 2025 at 7:36 am.
Jan 31st 2025 | 8:41 am
#19
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 574
From: New Jersey, USA
Re: State Tax Withholding NY/NJ
You're overthinking this - submit the NJ W-4 as normal (without making crazy adjustments) and I am 99.999% sure that your employer's payroll software will correctly withhold taxes. As NYS tax rates are higher than NJ you'll basically have nothing withheld for NJ (you might have a few dollars here and there because NJ taxes certain income that NYS doesn't, like HSA contributions).
You're not going to have NYS and NJ taxes withheld as if you had to pay the full amount of tax to both!
I have experience with this, I live in NJ and my husband works in NY. His home office used to be in NYS and he would have basically nothing withheld for NJ.
He later moved home office to NJ but works in NYS about 50% of the time and based on his timesheet his employer withholds some NJ and some NYS taxes. We still make estimated tax payments to NYS though because they sometimes under-withhold for NYS.
You're not going to have NYS and NJ taxes withheld as if you had to pay the full amount of tax to both!
I have experience with this, I live in NJ and my husband works in NY. His home office used to be in NYS and he would have basically nothing withheld for NJ.
He later moved home office to NJ but works in NYS about 50% of the time and based on his timesheet his employer withholds some NJ and some NYS taxes. We still make estimated tax payments to NYS though because they sometimes under-withhold for NYS.
Jan 31st 2025 | 8:50 am
#20
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Joined: Mar 2022
Posts: 297
From: New York
Re: State Tax Withholding NY/NJ
Thanks Olly, that would make sense! Appreciate the insights.
My colleagues who did submit a normal NJ W-4 have been having double withholdings. It's possible they did something else wrong, or that our payroll sucks (but we are a multinational and using ADP).
That's why I'm wary
My colleagues who did submit a normal NJ W-4 have been having double withholdings. It's possible they did something else wrong, or that our payroll sucks (but we are a multinational and using ADP).
That's why I'm wary
