Jackson Pride

Well, well, well. It becomes apparent that Wim and Jennifer are the same
person. Whoops!

--
Jackson "Jennifer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > "Wim Colgate" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
    > > You don't need a SSN for health insurance. It's just customary to use
the
    > > SSN in the health field.
    > >
    > > As far as I know, a SSN can only be used (legally) for one thing: Taxes.
    > >
    > > Wim
    >
    > Hey Wim...
    >
    > Thanks, but what health insurance company are you speaking of? I've had 3 already
    > tell me that he MUST have a social security number!
    >
    > We have his social now, so it's a moot point. But I'm curious. And for future
    > generations here, that info might be helpful.
    >
    > Thanks
    >
    > Jennifer
    > >
    > > "Jennifer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]...
    > > > Well...I don't know if you could call it a nightmare...but it's pretty scary,
    > > > when you think about it...
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > I haven't posted here in awhile. My love arrived (entered on K-1 visa) on May
    > > > 25, and we were married on June 7. Peter applied for his SSN on June 3rd, and
    > > > we were told it could take 10-20 days to receive the card due to the
    > > > requirement of INS verification. Yes, that sucks...but we've waited 3 weeks,
    > > > and he's been calling the SSA every day to check on his #...and every day he's
    > > > told, "You're not in our system, call back again."
    > > >
    > > > So, on June 24, we decided to visit the SSA again to find out what is going on.
    > > > Peter can't work, or apply for health insurance, or a joint banking
    > > > account...basically everything without a SSN (and for things we need for our
    > > > AOS interview). Should I even bother describing the inefficiency, complacency,
    > > > and ridiculous-ness of our experience going down there a second time? The guy
    > > > had NO CLUE...said Peter wasn't in the system at all...and WHY would INS
    > > > verification be necessary in the first place? He says - if you apply for your
    > > > SSN within 30 days of arriving in the US - INS verification IS NOT REQUIRED.
    > > > Really?...because we've been waiting for almost a month!
    > > >
    > > > SO...because Peter was here last summer (when we met) on a J-1 visa (working)
    > > > he HAD a social security number - this # was re-generated and the guy re-issued
    > > > it to Peter. He apologized - couldn't understand why Peter wasn't in the system
    > > > after his June 3 application....
    > > >
    > > > So, after several hours at the SSA, we left with Peter's newly activated SSN.
    > > > Of course, cursing the Social Security Administration employee who DIDN'T do
    > > > shit on the day he applied on June 3.
    > > >
    > > > We were happy. Felt like the process was moving forward a bit.
    > > >
    > > > We get home, and guess what's in the mailbox??? A F'ING social security card
    > > > with a TOTALLY different number than was JUST issued to him!!! Meaning...he had
    > > > 2 social security #'s and had just applied for a 3rd one! So, he had to go back
    > > > to the SSA today...and they cancelled the one that was issued (and recieved in
    > > > our mailbox); the one he just re-applied for; and re-activated his old J-1 visa
    > > > SSN.
    > > >
    > > > It's no wonder terrorists' can enter our country freely, fly our planes, and
    > > > crash into our buildings....what with 3 social security numbers TEST-you can do
    > > > f'ing anything you want to!!!!
    > > >
    > > > Anyway...that's our experience. If you've entered the US and apply for your SSN
    > > > within 30 days of arrival - INS VERIFICATION IS NOT REQUIRED! So, fight them,
    > > > if they tell you that it is.
    > > >
    > > > Now....onto AOS next week....please wish us luck. And we sincerely hope this
    > > > experience and info helps one of you in the future.
    > > >
    > > > ~jennifer & peter (US/NL)

Cw

Social Security number are ONLY required by Banks/financial institutions ..where
Income Taxes are involved....and certain government departments. It is actually
ILLEGAL for any other person or organisation to demand your social security number
for identification. You should insist that you refuse to give it...one of 2 things
will happen...if its a loan/credit etc...they may refuse it..(in which case you didnt
want it anyway) or 2 they will use another method to verify identification. However
this screws up thier systems so they are very reluctant to do it that way.

Be aware of one thing in the US. your social security number is worth more than your
life...if someone gets it they can wreak all sorts of havok in your life ...usually
long before you are even aware of
it...so guard your number well and only give it to authorised persons/departments.

On Sun, 30 Jun 2002 01:29:18 GMT, "Jackson Pride" <@.net> wrote:

    >Well, well, well. It becomes apparent that Wim and Jennifer are the same
    >person. Whoops!

Telman.8

"CW" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Social Security number are ONLY required by Banks/financial institutions ..where
    > Income Taxes are involved....and certain government departments. It is actually
    > ILLEGAL for any other person or organisation to demand your social security number
    > for identification.

Do you really mean "illegal" - which means that is against the law, that anyone
demanding it who is not entitled to have it is actually breaking the law; or do you
mean that is not a legal requirement - that the person/institution asking for it
cannot point to some section of a statute or regulation which says they are
entitled to it?

This is not semantics. It makes a big difference. Saying something is illegal (it is
against the law) is quite different to saying it is not lawful (it does not have the
support of law).

In the example you gave of a loan company wanting the information, if the demand for
the number is illegal (against the law) then the person seeking the loan has some
form of redress at law if the loan is denied for that reason (not giving the number).
On the other hand, if the actual situation is that they (the loan company, etc.) are
not entitled to demand the number, but it is not against the law to request that
information, then there is no redress - the giving of the number is a condition
precedent to assessing the individual's eligibility for a loan (contract).

Telman

Michael D. Youn

CW wrote:

    > Social Security number are ONLY required by Banks/financial institutions ..where
    > Income Taxes are involved....and certain government departments. It is actually
    > ILLEGAL for any other person or organisation to demand your social security number
    > for identification. You should insist that you refuse to give it...one of 2 things
    > will happen...if its a loan/credit etc...they may refuse it..(in which case you
    > didnt want it anyway) or 2 they will use another method to verify identification.
    > However this screws up thier systems so they are very reluctant to do it that way.

Hi All!

I'm sorry but the Privacy Act only covers government agencies use of your SSN. Any
business can request your SSN and you are free to refuse, but they are free to deny
you their service. Nothing covers what they do with it after you give your SSN to
them as long as it's not use for an illegal purpose, i.e. identity theft.

http://policy.ssa.gov/poms.nsf/36f3b...26be69a188525-
6a4e005083c3?OpenDocument

GN 03325.001 Use of the Social Security Number (SSN)

B. POLICY - USE OF THE SSN

Government agencies and private businesses use the SSN in the following ways.

1. SSA

SSA uses the SSN in the administration of the social security program, the purpose
for which the SSN originally was developed. SSA does not encourage the use of the SSN
as a universal identifier.

2. Government Agencies

Some government agencies are using the SSN for identification and administration
purposes. The Privacy Act (PA) (5 USC. 552a) places some limits on the use of the SSN
by governmental agencies; however, SSA cannot tell other agencies how to use the SSN.
Other statutes specifically permit or require use of the SSN by government agencies.

3. Private Sector

The private sector may refuse service or credit, deny admission or membership, etc,
to anyone unwilling to furnish his/her SSN.

There is no provision in any Federal law governing or limiting the use, or the
disclosure, of the SSN by the private sector (businesses, organizations,
etc.), except for fraudulent use, e.g., violation of Section 208(g),(h) of the
Social Security Act. SSA, therefore, cannot tell the private sector how they
may use the SSN.

4. Authorized Uses

The SSN has specific uses/nonuses permitted by various Federal statutes, Executive
Orders and a Commissioner's Decision. (See GN 03325.005).

C. POLICY - MISUSE OF SSN

Section 208 (g),(h) of the Social Security Act makes the misuse of the SSN a felony.
Some examples include:

-- The misuse, by one individual, of the SSN belonging to another individual, --
Using false documents to obtain an SSN under an assumed identity, or -- Buying,
selling, or counterfeiting Social Security cards.

http://policy.ssa.gov/poms.nsf/lnx/0203325005

GN 03325.005 Use of SSN by Government Agencies

1. Executive Order 9397 (1943)

Executive Order 9397 mandates that whenever a Federal agency establishes a system of
numerical personal identifiers, the agency should use the SSN.

2. Section 7 of the Privacy Act (1974)

Section 7 of the Privacy Act states that it is unlawful for any Federal, State or
local government agency to deny to any individual any right, benefit or privilege
provided by law because the individual refuses to disclose his/her SSN, unless
disclosure was required by statute or regulation prior to January 1, 1975, or is
required by Federal statute.

Any government agency that asks an individual to furnish his/her SSN must inform the
individual:

-- Whether furnishing the information is mandatory or voluntary, -- By what law or
other authority the agency is requesting the number, and -- The uses that will be
made of the information.

SSA complies with this statement by including a "Privacy Act Statement" on all SSA
standard forms. Other government agencies and States who question how the Privacy Act
affects their use of the SSN should be referred to the U.S. Department of Justice or
the appropriate State's Attorney General's office.

3. Social Security Act, Section 1137 (1984)

Social Security Act, Section 1137, requires that certain federally funded welfare
programs must request and use the SSN to administer their programs. These
programs include:

-- Aid to Families with Dependent Children -- Medicaid -- Unemployment compensation
-- Food stamps -- State adult assistance programs (Social Security titles I, X, XIV,
and XVI which apply to Puerto Rico, Virgin Islands, Guam and American Samoa).

4. Social Security Act, Section 205 (c)(2)(B)(i) Auxiliary/Survivor Claims

The Social Security Act, Section 205 (c)(2)(B)(i) requires each Social Security
auxiliary/survivor beneficiary to have an SSN beginning June 1989.

5. Social Security Act, Section 205 (c)(2)(C)(i)(I) State Uses of SSNs

The Social Security Act, Section 205 (c)(2)(C)(i)(I) provides that State agencies may
use the SSN to verify the identification of an individual, and require any individual
to furnish their SSN for identification purposes for:

-- Administration of taxes, -- General public assistance, -- Driver's license, or --
Motor vehicle registration laws within their jurisdiction.

NOTE: Even though the Social Security Act permits State agencies to require the use
of the SSN for the above purposes, with the exception of the administration of
public assistance programs, SSA can verify SSN's for the other agencies only
with the consent of the individual.

There is more to this section, but I didn't feel like typing it. LOL Go to the URL
for 6 through 10.

Take care,

Mike

Jennifer

"Jackson Pride" <@.net> wrote in message
news:<[email protected] anews.com>...
    > Well, well, well. It becomes apparent that Wim and Jennifer are the same
    > person. Whoops!

No Jackson, I can assure you that we are not the same person.

Jennifer
    >
    > --
    > Jackson "Jennifer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > "Wim Colgate" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]>...
    > > > You don't need a SSN for health insurance. It's just customary to use
    > the
    > > > SSN in the health field.
    > > >
    > > > As far as I know, a SSN can only be used (legally) for one thing: Taxes.
    > > >
    > > > Wim
    > >
    > > Hey Wim...
    > >
    > > Thanks, but what health insurance company are you speaking of? I've had 3 already
    > > tell me that he MUST have a social security number!
    > >
    > > We have his social now, so it's a moot point. But I'm curious. And for future
    > > generations here, that info might be helpful.
    > >
    > > Thanks
    > >
    > > Jennifer
    > > >
    > > > "Jennifer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > news:[email protected]...
    > > > > Well...I don't know if you could call it a nightmare...but it's pretty scary,
    > > > > when you think about it...
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > > I haven't posted here in awhile. My love arrived (entered on K-1 visa) on May
    > > > > 25, and we were married on June 7. Peter applied for his SSN on June 3rd, and
    > > > > we were told it could take 10-20 days to receive the card due to the
    > > > > requirement of INS verification. Yes, that sucks...but we've waited 3 weeks,
    > > > > and he's been calling the SSA every day to check on his #...and every day
    > > > > he's told, "You're not in our system, call back again."
    > > > >
    > > > > So, on June 24, we decided to visit the SSA again to find out what is going
    > > > > on. Peter can't work, or apply for health insurance, or a joint banking
    > > > > account...basically everything without a SSN (and for things we need for our
    > > > > AOS interview). Should I even bother describing the inefficiency,
    > > > > complacency, and ridiculous-ness of our experience going down there a second
    > > > > time? The guy had NO CLUE...said Peter wasn't in the system at all...and WHY
    > > > > would INS verification be necessary in the first place? He says - if you
    > > > > apply for your SSN within 30 days of arriving in the US - INS verification IS
    > > > > NOT REQUIRED. Really?...because we've been waiting for almost a month!
    > > > >
    > > > > SO...because Peter was here last summer (when we met) on a J-1 visa (working)
    > > > > he HAD a social security number - this # was re-generated and the guy
    > > > > re-issued it to Peter. He apologized - couldn't understand why Peter wasn't
    > > > > in the system after his June 3 application....
    > > > >
    > > > > So, after several hours at the SSA, we left with Peter's newly activated SSN.
    > > > > Of course, cursing the Social Security Administration employee who DIDN'T do
    > > > > shit on the day he applied on June 3.
    > > > >
    > > > > We were happy. Felt like the process was moving forward a bit.
    > > > >
    > > > > We get home, and guess what's in the mailbox??? A F'ING social security card
    > > > > with a TOTALLY different number than was JUST issued to him!!! Meaning...he
    > > > > had 2 social security #'s and had just applied for a 3rd one! So, he had to
    > > > > go back to the SSA today...and they cancelled the one that was issued (and
    > > > > recieved in our mailbox); the one he just re-applied for; and re-activated
    > > > > his old J-1 visa SSN.
    > > > >
    > > > > It's no wonder terrorists' can enter our country freely, fly our planes, and
    > > > > crash into our buildings....what with 3 social security numbers TEST-you can
    > > > > do f'ing anything you want to!!!!
    > > > >
    > > > > Anyway...that's our experience. If you've entered the US and apply for your
    > > > > SSN within 30 days of arrival - INS VERIFICATION IS NOT REQUIRED! So, fight
    > > > > them, if they tell you that it is.
    > > > >
    > > > > Now....onto AOS next week....please wish us luck. And we sincerely hope this
    > > > > experience and info helps one of you in the future.
    > > > >
    > > > > ~jennifer & peter (US/NL)

Wim Colgate

Very true - we are not the same person; but I dated a Jennifer once....

"Jennifer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > "Jackson Pride" <@.net> wrote in message
news:<[email protected] anews.com>...
    > > Well, well, well. It becomes apparent that Wim and Jennifer are the
same
    > > person. Whoops!
    >
    > No Jackson, I can assure you that we are not the same person.
    >
    > Jennifer
    > >
    > > --
    > > Jackson "Jennifer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]...
    > > > "Wim Colgate" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:<[email protected]>...
    > > > > You don't need a SSN for health insurance. It's just customary to
use
    > > the
    > > > > SSN in the health field.
    > > > >
    > > > > As far as I know, a SSN can only be used (legally) for one thing:
Taxes.
    > > > >
    > > > > Wim
    > > >
    > > > Hey Wim...
    > > >
    > > > Thanks, but what health insurance company are you speaking of? I've had 3
    > > > already tell me that he MUST have a social security number!
    > > >
    > > > We have his social now, so it's a moot point. But I'm curious. And for future
    > > > generations here, that info might be helpful.
    > > >
    > > > Thanks
    > > >
    > > > Jennifer
    > > > >
    > > > > "Jennifer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > news:[email protected]...
    > > > > > Well...I don't know if you could call it a nightmare...but it's
pretty
    > > > > > scary, when you think about it...
    > > > > >
    > > > > >
    > > > > > I haven't posted here in awhile. My love arrived (entered on K-1 visa) on
    > > > > > May 25, and we were married on June 7. Peter applied for
his
    > > > > > SSN on June 3rd, and we were told it could take 10-20 days to
receive
    > > > > > the card due to the requirement of INS verification. Yes, that sucks...but
    > > > > > we've waited 3 weeks, and he's been calling the SSA
every
    > > > > > day to check on his #...and every day he's told, "You're not in
our
    > > > > > system, call back again."
    > > > > >
    > > > > > So, on June 24, we decided to visit the SSA again to find out what
is
    > > > > > going on. Peter can't work, or apply for health insurance, or a
joint
    > > > > > banking account...basically everything without a SSN (and for
things
    > > > > > we need for our AOS interview). Should I even bother describing
the
    > > > > > inefficiency, complacency, and ridiculous-ness of our experience
going
    > > > > > down there a second time? The guy had NO CLUE...said Peter wasn't
in
    > > > > > the system at all...and WHY would INS verification be necessary in
the
    > > > > > first place? He says - if you apply for your SSN within 30 days
of
    > > > > > arriving in the US - INS verification IS NOT REQUIRED. Really?...because
    > > > > > we've been waiting for almost a month!
    > > > > >
    > > > > > SO...because Peter was here last summer (when we met) on a J-1
visa
    > > > > > (working) he HAD a social security number - this # was
re-generated
    > > > > > and the guy re-issued it to Peter. He apologized - couldn't understand why
    > > > > > Peter wasn't in the system after his June 3 application....
    > > > > >
    > > > > > So, after several hours at the SSA, we left with Peter's newly activated
    > > > > > SSN. Of course, cursing the Social Security
Administration
    > > > > > employee who DIDN'T do shit on the day he applied on June 3.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > We were happy. Felt like the process was moving forward a bit.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > We get home, and guess what's in the mailbox??? A F'ING social security
    > > > > > card with a TOTALLY different number than was JUST issued
to
    > > > > > him!!! Meaning...he had 2 social security #'s and had just applied
for
    > > > > > a 3rd one! So, he had to go back to the SSA today...and they
cancelled
    > > > > > the one that was issued (and recieved in our mailbox); the one he
just
    > > > > > re-applied for; and re-activated his old J-1 visa SSN.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > It's no wonder terrorists' can enter our country freely, fly our planes,
    > > > > > and crash into our buildings....what with 3 social
security
    > > > > > numbers TEST-you can do f'ing anything you want to!!!!
    > > > > >
    > > > > > Anyway...that's our experience. If you've entered the US and
apply
    > > > > > for your SSN within 30 days of arrival - INS VERIFICATION IS NOT REQUIRED!
    > > > > > So, fight them, if they tell you that it is.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > Now....onto AOS next week....please wish us luck. And we
sincerely
    > > > > > hope this experience and info helps one of you in the future.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > ~jennifer & peter (US/NL)