gardnma

Why not? There is nothing wrong with the US health care system. It is fair and even and everyone can have care taken of them if they really need it.

Have you heard this argument? I am STILL trying to figure out the mentality that can actually believe it........

Tolos

Let me give you a true story. Two weeks ago, my wife had an accident that required stitches to her face. We rushed to the emergency room at 11:30pm at night. We were seen at 7:30am due to the small number of doctors on duty. We spent the whole night sitting in a plastic chair in a waiting room, before eventually being seen by a doctor in a tiny corner office. A couple of stitches and a pat on the back later, we were signing papers to co-pay $100. Then I literally went home, hopped in the shower and headed back into work with zero sleep.

All the while I'm thinking that I pretty much just received NHS-style service, with the added insult of being CHARGED for the honor. I pay for medical insurance and picked up the co-pay, and I could accept this if I was provided with fast service, etc. I believe in "getting what you pay for". But to hand over the money and be no better off than NHS-land is disgusting. And this ain't Smallville, folks - I live in Houston, TX supposedly one of the US's largest and advanced cities.

The one thing Americans don't understand is this: in the UK we pay income & SS taxes and get several services in return. In the US, they pay approximately the same taxes and then pay additional money for theservices.

For example, in the US many neighborhoods have to pay extra for garbage collection. Many beaches charge fees. And despite the huge volumes of taxes paid in, America still has mediocre welfare, healthcare and education.

What a joke. Still, at least all the tax money is being well spent on a useless war effort.

gardnma

I recently saw a WWW thingy which compared the income taxes of EU nations and the US. Point of which was to bring attention to the fact that in the US we pay the least in income taxes.
The US tax rate is about 19% according to this and the Uk at around 30% (cant remember the exact #'s as its on my office wall right now).
I thought about this and then added the other deductions and also the % of health premium which I pick up through work. Now, I happen to work for a company which offers lower salary but pay only 6% in health premium (at the mo).
My pay check sees around a 33% deduction in total widtholdings
(no 401k yet)
which at least seems to match that of the income tax in the UK.

Now, its been a long time since I had a UK paycheck, granted......
Did I miss something here ?????

Tolos

Well that ties in with what I'm saying. Give or take a feq quid, the US taxes are not all that much different to the UK. The way I look at it is like this. If the UK and the USA were bowling alleys, then the UK charges you a tenner to bowl one game. The US also charges you a tenner for one game, but they also expect you to pay a fee to use the lane, a fee to use the balls, a fee to borrow the shoes, etc.

Basically, the taxes may be a little lower, but at least in England I can go on the beach for free without a $7 maintenance charge, as happened to me in Galvestone recently (the fee goes towards cleaning the beach and removing garbage. When I asked the guy why my taxes didn't cover this, he looked at me like I was deranged). Also, I may wait 8hrs to be seen by the NHS, but like I already explained, I also had to wait 8hrs here...and be charged $100 for my troubles. And how about toll roads and road charges?!

Pretty sucky system.

gardnma

I'm not convinced that the UK is cheaper to live in than the US.....yet!
Why would so many people move over here in the first place?
What appears is that, over recent history, the US has become more expensive to live in to a given standard.
As to the UK, I really don't the whole picture with which to compare. The only way to be really sure would be to look at each and every aspect of everyday life for which you would expect to pay.
I think that would be a very difficult thing to do.
Unless you:
a) Had two individuals in the same opposite boats.
or
b) Have a ridiculous amount of spare time.

It really would be nice to know though.....

jen_andreson

Interesting question about why people move over...may I ask...why did you?

We are so much better off! Half-price mortgage as we made the choice to go from London to the midwest, lower taxes (for us-I just posted all the rates to the guy asking about Canada or US so I'm well aware of the rates), even with health care increase we save twice what we did in the UK and will retire at a much earlier age. It's fab!

And...before we moved we did do a like for like spend of everyday life so that we were sure we'd be better off. Didn't you do the same? Took about 20 minute of filling in our UK budget and asking friends to benchmark the US costs. Knew exactly what we were in for...

This is all much better than the £15000 we paid for my husbands op, to jump the 11 month NHS queue...and it is certainly much better than being turned away from a doctor when my then 7mth old had an asthma attack.

However, I do feel that the US needs improvement...as I posted earlier we need to learn from those who make it work (which isn't the UK).

How many letters have you written to your local officials asking for change and offering suggestions? I've noticed that people here are far too happy to share their sob stories and heartache, but what action do you take on it?

Anything? You're the ones who have seen something that you feel is better, or that was better to you...action it!

gardnma

Sounds like America is working well for you. Glad to hear it.

I think people moan and complain here because Americans dont like to hear moaning and complaining.
I also like to moan and complain. I have tried out a fair bit of America,
(been on the skids, got a degree, making money now) and now simply question - is there anything else here other than the pursuit of stuff.
Not a silly question really, I dont think.

Again, glad the dream is working for you.

Bob

Aye, around here, beaches aren't free that i've seen..and the rubbish collection, part of it is included in tax, but you also have to pay for special rubbish bags that are produced by the town, as a pay as you use rubbish collection service, bags aren't cheap either....bit cheeky really...

Bob

well to be honest, they wouldn't give a flying toss unless you were a citizen because lets face it, you can't vote and they don't think far enough in the future that you might become a citizen.

and why here, like most, spouse is a yank, and figured it would be a good adventure to experience while we can.

Jerseygirl

Good for you....I am going for screening too. We often say when we were kids you hadn't had a good day out in summer unless you were sunburnt...scary thought. :scared:

NC Penguin

I can't believe your statement that I highlighted. Do you think people living in the US become bankrupts deliberately because they can't pay medical bills? Employers are increasing employee health insurance contributions by a greater percentage annually. The reason isn't pure greed on behalf of the health providers.

You must live with your head in the sand or something...


NC Penguin

Lord Lionheart

One of my customers has been working at the same place for 30 years, he was planning to retire and travel with his wife in their golden years. She got Alzheimer's so his retirement dreams have turned into him re-mortgaging the house to pay for home help and medical care for his wife, quite sad. I'm sure there are lots of stories like this in the US

TouristTrap

Only those who can pay deserve healthcare. It is survival of the fittest here, no doubt about it.

I wonder how many of those who are happy with the healthcare system would be, if god forbid they are faced with a debilitating disease and find themselves on the street because after paying 1k/month premiums (including the employer's share here) for years, their insurance company cancels their coverage and they can't afford to live. They'd be on the first plane back home to the good old NHS.

This is happening to THOUSANDS of people every month. Every month there are employers who are dropping healthcare coverage for their employees as the companies just can't afford it.

Fast forward 10 years from now.

snowbunny

I know now why you're cranky. (Just got back from a night's stay in Houston.)

The person in your avatar reminds me of the guy on the Cure's Standing On A Beach album.

jen_andreson

Bob, thanks, that is a good point. I guess what I was trying to get it is that there are many proposed plans in the US. Has anyone looked at them? Are they potentially good ideas? I see that most will be state or even city specific and to me that could lead to trouble...and inequality.

I'm not a citizen either, but I do volunteer for campaigns and I have written more than one letter...and from the letter no one knows if I am a citizen or not.

What I am researching is things like this...the San Fran plan:

Associated Press Writer: Officials unveiled a plan Tuesday to make the city the first in the nation to provide health care to all its residents through contributions from the municipal government and private employers. The proposal, aimed at 82,000 uninsured San Franciscans who earn too much to qualify for federally subsidized insurance, would offer access to a doctor and hospital network to any adult who lives in the city regardless of their immigration or employment status, said Mayor Gavin Newsom. The city already provides universal health care for children

Anyone know if this is a good thing? Or, an idea that looks good on paper and will never work? I'm just curious really.