IB Schools

Old Sep 26th 2019, 8:27 am
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Default IB Schools

HI All,
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Whilst I understand there are quite big differences between UK and US school systems, a lot of the schools offer the IB program (my son has just completed his IB in UAE)

My daughter will be finishing Gsce's potentially just before the move, and we a re looking to move during next summer 2020. I have already started contacting schools in Orlando area who offer IB and the process looks straightforward enough as long as you move into the correct catchment area. My worry is I have missed something,

Are there any rules regarding length of time of residency, or is it simply move into area, then enrol in the school. What if for some reason there is no space? Obviously it is possibly a catch22 situation, it is possible to reserve a place before we arrive? If I arrive first and rent a place(6 months beforehand, which is looking like what I will be asked todo) could I get her enrolled without her being there?

My daughter is a high achiever so I want her to have the best school possible of course (who doesn't!) which obviously means the schools who places fill up the fastest.

From the research I have done Winter Park in Orlando and Cocoa Beach high school seem to be the most promising, does anyone have any experience of these or a recommendation of a different one (Cocoa would have to be very good as it would be a long commute every day...)

Lastly IB curriculum in USA the only potential problem I have seen so far is lack of choice of language offering (a lot of schools only offer Spanish which my daughter has never learnt) is there anything else I need to think of?

As I mentioned on the immigration thread I an currently being asked by my employer to relocate and this is probably the most important item I need to get sorted.

Thanks
John
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Old Sep 26th 2019, 12:18 pm
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Default Re: IB Schools

If you are in the cachement area, they have to take you. They cannot be "full" if you live in the district. The daughter gets a spot in the school and on the school bus.

It wouldn't be an "IB School" as much as an "IB program within a school." The school cannot decline enrollment if you live in the cachement area but the IB program within the school can decline, and send your child off to the general program. So make sure you understand admissions criteria for the IB program in that school. There would usually be an IB coordinator and that would be the contact person. Make an appointment for a phone conversation and send your child's records before the call so the coordinator can have a look.

No need to "reserve" a place. Renting a house and then making a ghost enrollment for six months would invite all sorts of problems. If you enroll her as a ghost, your daughter is technically truant and the school has legal obligations. Not to mention if she enrolls in classes and doesn't attend, she will fail and that will go on the transcript and wreck the GPA. There are no gentlemen's agreements or off-book enrollments or whatever. Once you have a lease you can enroll for the next year.

I don't see any real reason to commute from Orlando to Cocoa Beach. The IB programs at Florida high schools routinely send their top performers to Ivy League universities.
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Old Sep 26th 2019, 10:42 pm
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Default Re: IB Schools

Definitely contact the designated IB coordinator for your chosen school and start the conversation about entry requirements. Having done GCSEs will probably be fine but you may be asked to provide the full curriculum and also your daughter's attendance records. They may not accept anything until you provide the GCSE results ( this is how the US works- attendance + passing grade of the required curriculum)

Some of the kids find it hardgoing and drop out but usually this is done in the pre-IB year,not during the 2 year diploma program.
However, some of the popular classes get filled so you need to ask about that.
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Old Sep 27th 2019, 11:05 am
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Default Re: IB Schools

Hi. We are in a similar situation to johnb1234.

My son will be taking his GCSEs next summer (2020) and we are weighing up options to move to Florida on an E2 investor visa in July 2020. We have been in touch with the school that we would want to enrol him in but they have told us that if he passes his GCSEs (which we expect he will do, with good grades) he will already have the equivalent of the high school diploma and therefore the school will not enroll him. Our hope was that he would be able to join the IB programme and therefore gain a similar qualification to A levels, leaving his options of coming back to the UK open to go to university if he so wishes.

The school admissions officer suggested that he would be better to go to community college to get his 2 year associates degree, which is a fast track for advanced students that gives them an advantage when transferring to a bachelors course (i think I read that it was about the equivalent of an HNC). Some schools now send advanced students to college on a 'dual enrollment' and it is seen to be better for some than the AP classes or IB programme.

We're not completely averse to him doing this, although he will miss out on the high school experience that we hoped he would have and also he will only have just turned 16 so it really seems too soon. However, my question is whether he could enrol in the high school initially to get onto the 'dual enrollment' option based on his mock results and predicted grades (as he won't technically have his GCSEs until the results come out in late August, after the start of semester), because otherwise, the fees to go straight to college as an out-of -state student are pretty steep. Someone at the education department told us that enrolling him it is up to the school but they could technically throw him out when his results came in. And if we didn't inform them and this came out, would we be taking too big a risk re visas (we have a family sponsored GC application going through, which I don't want to jeopodise)?

Has anyone else come across this? Is this true, or did we speak uninformed people?

We were also wondering about the language element of the IB programme too. Does anyone know if you can take a beginner level course to satify the language requirement?

Thanks in advance, I've been looking for answers for a while now.
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Old Sep 27th 2019, 11:52 am
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Default Re: IB Schools

The individual school translates the grades, so one school may think it's the same as the High School Diploma,another may think your child doesn't have enough credits (while it was Georgia, our daughter still had to do the final two years in High School). Saying that, because it's a credit based system, kids do travel through at different a different pace, some quicker, some slower.

Depending on your future plans once here, it might be worth checking with UK Uni's/UCAS on what would be best for the UK system if you returned in a couple of years?
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Old Sep 27th 2019, 1:42 pm
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To clear up any confusion about Community Colleges -

US universities are generally four-year programs.

The first two years of that, are what is called "general studies" where students are expected to take a breadth of courses irregardless of planned program of study.

The last two years are when they specialise, and this is called their "major."

An Associates Degree at a Community College is equivalent to the first two years of the Bachelor's degree. There are some exceptions but generally speaking the first two years at the Community College, and the first two years at the university, are exactly the same from a programming point of view.

A Community College student will either stop there with the Associates, or apply to enroll at the four-year university to get a Bachelor's. They will enter the university at the specialisation or "major" stage.

It varies by state, but often a state university is required by law to accept a certain percentage of community college students who want to transfer in after getting their Associates.. So, in states that have a prestigious flagship university, like Florida, if a student can't get admitted at the end of high school, they go to the community college and then use this as a "back door" way in later on. When you get your Bachelor's Degree, it just says the name of the granting university - no mention of the Community College or that the first two years were done elsewhere.

Community Colleges are often usually cheaper and so some students do that to save money and then transfer to the university after the AA.

Community Colleges generally have to accept anyone who applies for admission. So - no, it is not a prestigious thing, not some kind of Gifted and Talented institution.

Dual-enrollment high school age students will often be with other dual-enrollment high school age students in a sort of program within the Community College and that is an advantageous situation equivalent to IB etc. It knocks off two years of university credits and expenses, so yes it was good advice from the counselor to recommend going this way if being in the regular high school is not an option. Advanced Placement courses in high schools often provide the same advantage, and yes for some dual enrollment is better and for others Advanced Placement is better.

While the child will miss out on the "high school experience," the "university experience" is equally important in the American psyche and the "old tie" is usually formed at the university level and not in high school. Though there will still be the mismatch in socialisation if your child is entering university at 18 but already effectively a junior instead of a freshman, and thus in classes with 20 and 21 year olds.

If the socialisation aspect or languages etc is important to you - there are other options as well.

Good luck.
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Old Sep 27th 2019, 5:11 pm
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Default Re: IB Schools

Originally Posted by tbell100 View Post
Hi. We are in a similar situation to johnb1234.

My son will be taking his GCSEs next summer (2020) and we are weighing up options to move to Florida on an E2 investor visa in July 2020. We have been in touch with the school that we would want to enrol him in but they have told us that if he passes his GCSEs (which we expect he will do, with good grades) he will already have the equivalent of the high school diploma and therefore the school will not enroll him. Our hope was that he would be able to join the IB programme and therefore gain a similar qualification to A levels, leaving his options of coming back to the UK open to go to university if he so wishes.

The school admissions officer suggested that he would be better to go to community college to get his 2 year associates degree, which is a fast track for advanced students that gives them an advantage when transferring to a bachelors course (i think I read that it was about the equivalent of an HNC). Some schools now send advanced students to college on a 'dual enrollment' and it is seen to be better for some than the AP classes or IB programme.

We're not completely averse to him doing this, although he will miss out on the high school experience that we hoped he would have and also he will only have just turned 16 so it really seems too soon. However, my question is whether he could enrol in the high school initially to get onto the 'dual enrollment' option based on his mock results and predicted grades (as he won't technically have his GCSEs until the results come out in late August, after the start of semester), because otherwise, the fees to go straight to college as an out-of -state student are pretty steep. Someone at the education department told us that enrolling him it is up to the school but they could technically throw him out when his results came in. And if we didn't inform them and this came out, would we be taking too big a risk re visas (we have a family sponsored GC application going through, which I don't want to jeopodise)?

Has anyone else come across this? Is this true, or did we speak uninformed people?

We were also wondering about the language element of the IB programme too. Does anyone know if you can take a beginner level course to satify the language requirement?

Thanks in advance, I've been looking for answers for a while now.
So, the first thing I always ask about this kind of situation is "Is it true" and then research it.
Florida HS graduation requirements for 2019 are here
Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

so go through it and decide for yourself. I would say that the maths element may be the one area where it doesn't work out - since US system separates out Algebra and Geometry.
Also find an IB forum and start asking there.
Personally, I would not want to send my 16yr old to community college as they will miss out so much on the fun side of HS. The accelerated program kids are ones not known for their socialising ( I generalise but so many of my daughter's friends say they wish they had spent more time having fun in HS).
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Old Sep 28th 2019, 6:16 am
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I concur with petitefrancaise about not sending a 16 year old to Community College. I know plenty who have done it, and they do become social fish out of water and that sticks. It doesn't "reset" at uni for the reasons I mentioned in my above post.

If enrolling in the high school isn't an option - there are other character- and gap year-type options available. All of which will assist in US university entries, where "fit," "life experience at early ages," and personal essays all contribute heavily to the process.
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Old Sep 30th 2019, 6:30 am
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Default Re: IB Schools

Originally Posted by tbell100 View Post
Hi. We are in a similar situation to johnb1234.

My son will be taking his GCSEs next summer (2020) and we are weighing up options to move to Florida on an E2 investor visa in July 2020. We have been in touch with the school that we would want to enrol him in but they have told us that if he passes his GCSEs (which we expect he will do, with good grades) he will already have the equivalent of the high school diploma and therefore the school will not enroll him. Our hope was that he would be able to join the IB programme and therefore gain a similar qualification to A levels, leaving his options of coming back to the UK open to go to university if he so wishes.

The school admissions officer suggested that he would be better to go to community college to get his 2 year associates degree, which is a fast track for advanced students that gives them an advantage when transferring to a bachelors course (i think I read that it was about the equivalent of an HNC). Some schools now send advanced students to college on a 'dual enrollment' and it is seen to be better for some than the AP classes or IB programme.

We're not completely averse to him doing this, although he will miss out on the high school experience that we hoped he would have and also he will only have just turned 16 so it really seems too soon. However, my question is whether he could enrol in the high school initially to get onto the 'dual enrollment' option based on his mock results and predicted grades (as he won't technically have his GCSEs until the results come out in late August, after the start of semester), because otherwise, the fees to go straight to college as an out-of -state student are pretty steep. Someone at the education department told us that enrolling him it is up to the school but they could technically throw him out when his results came in. And if we didn't inform them and this came out, would we be taking too big a risk re visas (we have a family sponsored GC application going through, which I don't want to jeopodise)?

Has anyone else come across this? Is this true, or did we speak uninformed people?

We were also wondering about the language element of the IB programme too. Does anyone know if you can take a beginner level course to satify the language requirement?

Thanks in advance, I've been looking for answers for a while now.
Wow, I had never even considered this, thankyou for sharing. I have mailed a couple of IB coordinators and this didn't come up.

So next question, could someone recommend an information site about expat transfers (schooling focussed) or relocation expert. Its not what I have thought of that bothers me, it is what I haven't even considered that really worries me.....

This is the biggest factor that will decide whether we take the proposed move or not....
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Old Oct 1st 2019, 3:41 am
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I posted the link which gives in-depth details of what the student must achieve to get a Florida HS diploma. Knowing a little bit about Texas requirements, I went through the list of requirements and saw this:
in section 3
Three credits in social studies.—A student must earn one credit in United States History; one credit in World History; one-half credit in economics; and one-half credit in United States Government. The United States History EOC assessment constitutes 30 percent of the student’s final course grade.
I doubt that your kids have done this. I would go back to the registrar on this. I would also check the algebra/geometry requirements too.
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Old Oct 1st 2019, 6:05 am
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Default Re: IB Schools

[color=left=#000080](a) [/color][color=justify=#000080]Beginning with students entering grade 9 in the 2013-2014 school year, receipt of a standard high school diploma requires successful completion of 24 credits, an International Baccalaureate curriculum, or an Advanced International Certificate of Education curriculum.[/color]
So reading through the requirements, if I am reading this correctly, to get a HS diploma my Daughter would need the 24 credits and an IB diploma.

I'm guessing the answer is no, but do you think it would be acceptable to just do the IB diploma bit at school (if they even allow this) without doing any of the 'standard' USA high school bits (Having just seen my son go through IB here, it is intense enough as it is without any more classes to do)

I realise not completing High School would have implications down the line if she stayed in USA, but she is firmly set on University in UK

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Old Oct 1st 2019, 3:32 pm
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Default Re: IB Schools

so, it looks like your school district is saying that your daughter has reached the minimum credit level required for a Florida High School diploma and is using this to deny her a place at high school. In truth, you wouldn't expect a bright child to leave high school with only the absolute minimum needed to graduate. That's why schools offer AP and IB diploma courses. The AP/IB classes would probably satisfy some of the requirements needed.

Your choices are
1. to prove she hasn't actually got the minimum qualifications ( as in US History or maybe Algebra/Geometry). In which case, you download the course catalog with the details of what she would have studied in High School, then compare that with the work she has done for GCSE. I would also see if you can get some help from the IB coordinator at the school ( probably not, they are not usually allowed to help until the child is registered) and there is also https://flibs.org/ - the florida IB school support organisation. Their role is to assist the teachers/schools but I bet this is an issue they've come across before.
2. Forget the IB diploma and get straight onto AP classes at community college. AP exams are accepted by UK universities and well known about, so that shouldn't be any issue. Try calling the international admissions office for the UK universities she might be interested in and ask what they'd like. Just as a heads up - have you verified that your daughter will qualify for UK domestic student rates? One more small point, IB Diploma students will often take the AP exam as well since there is a good bit of overlap - with some exceptions ( eg.Physics).
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Old Oct 1st 2019, 4:01 pm
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Default Re: IB Schools

Really appreciating the comments/ advice so far. Thanks.

Good idea for us to contact ib support directly. As you say, it can't be that uncommon a scenario. I've emailed an ib coordinator at a different school today, so I'll update when I've had a reply, then try that option.

Still think I'd prefer the ib route (for exactly the reasons mentioned) than community college atm...

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Old Oct 2nd 2019, 5:39 am
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Default Re: IB Schools

re-domestic rates for UK universities

Having just gone through it with my son, it depends on the University to make the decision. As long as you are a temporary resident (i.e. in UAE no permanent residency is offered) then you are usually ok, it just depends on how you word the form.

We have been out of UK for 5 years and all 5 Universities offered home status, only one asking for more information.

However it is a grey area, I know a set of twins who both applied to one university different courses, one got offered home status the other didn't...…

I haev reached out to Flibs, and also the state education office, will update once I have any answers
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Old Oct 2nd 2019, 6:37 am
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What concerns me is that deputy principals aren't in the habit of telling 16 year olds with foreign transcripts, that they have an equivalent high school diploma and can't be enrolled, without a very good reason (such as they really do have an equivalent diploma). Administrators usually err on the side of extreme caution.

Besides that there are huge legal liabilities for wrongly declining an enrollment from someone who lives in the cachement area.
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