petitefrancaise

you don't know my kids. I had no say. I'm kidding myself. My job was to get them out of school and out of the house. Done!!

My comment about boarding school was not directed at you. It was a general observation based on living many years in the EU and now 4 years in the USA.

Do you have kids? Your comments are so employer based and tbh, very old fashioned.. they also show very little knowledge of what actually goes on with kids and colleges.

PetrifiedExPat

I will dodge the last question, as well as the one earlier (not from you), asking for specifics about where I am (other than Boston), simply because I have used BE for some time now and do not want to be too open. That is the truth, you will have to trust my interest in the topic!

I have to be employer based, for one reason, and that is almost every kid now is being told to go to college, or you are a failure. There are simply not enough jobs for everyone to live this lifestyle. The climate is cut-throat and competitive, and having a broad array of subject exposure with no real specialization could (I think would), put you down the pecking order automatically. I will only slightly ceed the importance of languages in todays world, but, at least from my past experience (late 90's, early 00's), they are covered quite well up until the end of high school..

petitefrancaise

I think you are missing the point about college.

The default expected education level is no longer age 14 to work on the farm. I think this is a great thing to happen. Everyone benefits when the nation is better educated overall. Did you go to university? You sound like someone trying to justify their own lack of education by denigrating what others do.

Languages at high school level covered quite well??????? Spoken like a real Brit. Laughable attitude.

I'm off to work now. This subject has been done to death on BE.

PetrifiedExPat

At least let me respond...

My own high school buddies who flourished with the languages, were fluent by 18, that is my only point. We had a few classes available... French, Spanish, German, Italian, Japanese, Latin and Ancient Greek.

If I answer you re: my education, I will come off like a douche, but, you asked..

I have no bachelor's degree. I admit it.

Because, I was accelerated into a 4 year M.Sc. program, followed by a Ph.D. which I completed in the standard 3 years. After that, I completed post-doc training at the best institution in the world for teaching and research (yes, here in the US, where at <mid-20's>, I was 5 years younger than most of my peers). Having obtained approx. $1 million is fed. funds to continue my work as faculty at said institution, I returned most of it to go to the private sector...

Why? Not for more money or anything like that, but, because it was tough to stomach witnessing the lie that is sold to our young people, most of whom were already drowning in debt and being exposed to sub standard education (by my own fortunate standards).

I can't stand the lie that it's better for humanity that we feed students into the college system. I changed my whole career based on that view.

petitefrancaise

yeah. you do sound like a douche.

PetrifiedExPat

I hid that there, on purpose.

PetrifiedExPat

I was half way responding before the above comments were deleted!

..

I largely agreed, although I do have more of a grasp on the US education system than given credit.. But, I guess I also differ in that I prefer more federal, rather than state, regulation... Another topic, and certainly again would put me in the minority. Guess i'm a globalist?

ian-mstm

Ian

PetrifiedExPat

I noticed the discussion, but, have absolutely no clue re: the inner workings of the IT sector!

Plus, trying to avoid the slinging match..

Similarly, though, I can't paint the road with roses if I simply believe it is not true. I will listen to others point of view, but, there are a lot of people coming through the grinder, and I still simply couldn't care less if someone had a passion for art history class when they apply for their quantum physics grad program!

fbf2006

To be fair, I do agree with PetrifiedExpat that the way college is pushed in the US is unnecessary, especially when a lot of people have to go into debt to get the education and then come out with jobs that really don't pay that well. Is it really necessary to need a master's in social work to be a social worker? Is it really necessary to go to a 4 year college and then another 4 years in med school? Is it really necessary for an accountant to need 150 university credits (which typically translates to a bachelors and one year master's) in order to sit for the CPA? Is it really necessary for a bachelor's of pharmacy to have been changed to a PharmD thus requiring more years of education? It's like every profession you want to get into in the US now requires at least a master's level education!


When I worked in London, there were a good number of people at my bank that instead of getting a bachelor's outright were on the ACCA track, which allowed for work and study at the same time. To me it's some type of apprenticeship program, which seems to make more sense.


That being said, most people I know that have experienced both the UK and US university systems, seem to prefer the US one. To them, the US one prepares you more for work and life. it seems study is the UK is more theoretical/more lectures? I could be wrong, but that's the impression I get. I'm originally from Nigeria and we have loads of students in both countries. For some reason, when they go back home I've been told employers tend to prefer the US educated ones.


With all that said, I believe education in both countries is wonderful!

tom169

There has been a trend to send people to university where really they aren't that way inclined.

Perhaps there is a element of keeping up with the Jones and parents feel a failure if their kid doesn't pursue a degree.

The reality is that many professions such as electrical or plumbing can earn fantastic money.

For the record, I don't have a degree and I had a NYSE company waiting for me to get my EAD when I arrived here.

chawkins99

There seems to be a chicken-and-egg situation developing:

The more menial jobs are getting rarer and so attracting more applicants. When you have a 100 or more people applying for a job, the tendency is to pick the better-qualified (even if the qualification is not relevant to the job).

The knock-on effect is that you need a degree for jobs which don't need a degree.

So, kids are pushed into college just to give them a better chance of employment. Now, you have more college graduates going after those same menial jobs. And the vicious circle continues.

I have a nephew in the UK who has a degree (in history ) but is now working as a labourer in a warehouse.

Anian

There are some degrees where the only practical usage is to teach more people who want to get that degree.

I've experienced both UK and US universities and I preferred the UK system. I met a lot of people in the US system who really had no idea what they were going to do and only went to college because it was what people did. In the UK, since students had already been forced to decide on a career track before they even started, it seemed to weed out a lot more of those kinds of people. Or maybe they were all doing Media Studies and I didn't know any of them. Most jobs don't demand one specific major though, so as long as you go for an area you have an interest in you still have a lot of options for what you do after graduating.

Rete

It is not necessary to make remarks about another poster in such a manner as to belittle their stand or opinion.

Can this very interesting and thought provoking thread be kept on course please.

Lagoon Nebula

I would like to thank everyone for their insight into this topic.

It seems that a lot of US university students take part in internships in the summer, so I will have to look into whether it would be possible for me to partake in an internship in the US.

I am however glad to be going to university in the UK as I do have a specific career field in mind, and thus want to focus on relevant classes. A well-rounded education is something that really should be achieved in the 12 or so years of full-time education prior to university.

My perspective is that far too many students in the US, and to some extent in the UK, are encouraged to go to university, hence why many US students go to university before even having a major in mind. For a lot of students apprenticeship programs and work experience would be more beneficial, but these types of people are being pushed into going to university.