dbj1000

It was a joke, hence the two frikkin' smileys!


that's one there --->

scrubbedexpat099

Depending on your circumstances one with a circa $3000 to $5000 Deductible.

That is each of course.

Celtic_Angel

OMG!!! that's terrible !! I'm so sorry for your family , wondering if your son would need his arm amputated must have been terrible...God to have to worry about money in a situation like this makes my blood boil!!

I live in the constant fear of something dreadful like this happening, how can the American people put up with this? It makes me so mad when others complain about having to pay taxes in the U.k for NHS they obviously don't live in a World like us...other countries assuming the U.S is the all rich and powerful ...yeah we have great health care but how many of us can bloody afford it? and at what cost to ourselves and our families?....to have to worry about cash during a medical crisis is normal for people here...it still scares the daylights outta me .


Taffyles I hope your son recovers quickly..my heart goes out to you all, this must have been terrible for the whole family

dbj1000

What a terrible story Taffyles. My heart goes out to your son.

Big D

Seems to be a lot of confusion going on here - i didn't realise we were talking about govt jobs - and i have no experience here at all. However i have a great deal of experience in the UK job market and have successfully negotiated salaries on a number of occassions. I agree with the point that once you have accepted a salary its difficult to negotiate - i would advise the negotiating BEFORE accepting an offer. I have also negotiated pay rises based on performance.

And while we are getting all bolshy about this i'm not sure i would work somewhere where someone can get promoted over me cos they have more responsibility in terms of family, this should be performance based - but again i have only ever worked in the private sector.

Also I haven't attacked anyone and am very British, and I have never benefitted over anyone else because i am married - never even got the tax breaks.....

Drebin

I'd add a 'me too' to this. I negotiate my wage every time I've had a performance review in my current job in Britain. If a company is full of praise for your work, and not in any financial difficulty (i.e. actively hiring still), then why shouldn't you ask for more money? Plus I'm a single man too, which throws the married with kids argument out the window. I'd certainly be plenty pissed if my employer didn't have a good reason why I shouldn't recieve extra compensation, based on my increased worth to the company.

ScotsmanInTexas

I don't know what your problem is Manc and I don't actually care. I recently started coming around these boards out of boredom and wouldn't care less if I didn't do it anymore. I find your postings generally divisive though. Whatever does it for you I suppose.

You know absolutely nothing about me, but your claim that I got less than a jerk who had a wife and children was because I couldn't negotiate as well as he did and not because the taxman hammers single men? Well really? I'll repeat - do you know ANYTHING about the British workplace?

You obviously left a very different country from the one I did, assuming that some of you actually left the place. The laws in Britain when compared to the USA are quite different as to established salary bandings for various types of work which apply to everyone from Joiners to Journalists, Doctors to Dockers.

I know of no office work or even building work where your pay was not regulated by very strict official union rates. I was an E.O in the Department of Employment and a Union Rep (so ought to know something about it), what you are describing is probably not legal in the UK and certainly could not legally be advertised as a vacancy.

I don't know of anyone who could just go up to his boss as you claim and ask for more money. Who is this boss anyway - do you work for one person? It's just not done. Salary negotiations are a US thing and in my opinion rather nasty. When your employer is trying to get you for less from day one (and otherwise screw you for your 'services') well thanks but I'd rather not work for him. That kind of bargaining sounds more like the type of work and related recompense you'd recieved for an hours work at an Arizona Bunny Ranch.

In the UK you get something within the established pay band - based on experience, service and qualifications. Sounds more like you've been watching old episodes of Bewitched and confusing it with reality.

You are trying to start an argument for whatever reason. I honestly don't care. Maybe you ought to log into Yahoo instead and find some teens to argue with. Thanks but no thanks.

dbj1000

Just bloody amazing! By the way, why the specific problem with Manc? So far he's only one of many of us who have disagreed with you narrow, blinkered view of working in Britain, but apparently you've singled him out for your venom... and yet again you accuse him of not really being from Britain, just because you don't agree with him. What on earth is your problem?

Back on-topic: You seem to be talking 1970s-style union workplace rules, and claiming that they apply to EVERY job in Britain. Surely you're not that dense that you actually think that "everyone from Joiners to Journalists, Doctors to Dockers" has a salary "regulated by very strict official union rates"? It's some kind of wind-up, right?

Certainly you ought to know what you're talking about, being ex-Department of Employment and a Union Rep, but apparently what you actually know is your own narrow experience.

The reality of the matter is that a minority of workplaces in SMBs are unionised nowadays in the UK, and if you're not in a Union-ruled workplace then guess what? You're free to negotiate your salary.

You say with some shock that "I don't know of anyone who could just go up to his boss as you claim and ask for more money", yet that is exactly what I've done in each of my jobs, both in the UK and over here. When my performance has been excellent I have asked for more money. If a pay review is imminent I waited for that. If not, I went and negotiated anyway. Unlike in a Union job, I did not wait to see what was granted me by my bosses through the questionable and confrontational "bargaining" skills of my union representatives.

And accusing others of working in an "Arizona Bunny House" because they're not in total agreement with you is real playground tactics. No surprise there, I guess, given the tone of your other posts.

Lastly you say "In the UK you get something within the established pay band - based on experience, service and qualifications. Sounds more like you've been watching old episodes of Bewitched and confusing it with reality."... which is odd, given that your reality appears to stop around 1979.

ScotsmanInTexas

Whatever you say idiot. You seem to have your opinions and are very extreme about them. Your opinions are not only pre 1979 but they don't even matter in the UK workplace. Anyway why am I bothering to respond to you. Manci is very divisive and cannot acceptbeing put straight by someone who actually knows. Odd thing is you claim she's a man - she claims shes a woman. Couldn't care less what she is, but neither of you will not draw me into an argument.

RE "And accusing others of working in an "Arizona Bunny House" because they're not in total agreement with you is real playground tactics. No surprise there, I guess, given the tone of your other posts." Do what? No one accused anyone of such a thing, can't you read?

You clearly can't when you mistake what I said about established paybands for each profession and trade as regulated by the government and trade unions as the same as saying that doctors and dockers earn the same thing?

Really though why am I even debating it with you. You sound like an idiot. Pointless anserwing me since I won't be reading any more rubbish straight from your brain.

anotherlimey

Did you read mine or anyone else's posts?

I managed to negotiate my salary in the UK. Now I can't ask for an unreasonable amount in which case you could say it was 'capped' but only with respect to reason.

dbj1000

Nice argument there Scotsman. "You're an idiot because I don't like what you say".

I smell a troll.

edit: but his last line is a real corker! Effectively "I am going to shout my answer at you and then stick my fingers in my ears and say "la-la-la-la" until you go away."

elfman

Really? When did that happen? Anything else you want to tell us Manc?
It's alright, you're among friends.

dbj1000

Now let's go through this line-by-line, shall we Scotsman? I know you're still sitting with your fingers in your ears, but I'll do it anyway.

Firstly, I regret editing out my over-rude initial response to your first post in this thread. I thought I over-reacted, but my post had nothing on your torrent of incoherent abuse.

And on that note, here goes:

I'm many things, but an idiot is not one of them. Calling people stupid because they don't agree with you is never very polite and doesn't reflect well on your own intelligence.

This line I honestly don't understand. My views are very mild, and basically factual. I have negotiated my salary in my jobs in the UK. You claim this doesn't happen. I know from experience it does. Extreme views are usually the ones that people hold which contradict common experience and evidence.

Again, very confusing. My experiences and opinions are very much post-1990, and I can't really see how anything I have said pre-dates 1979. I'd love you to explain why you said this. As for not mattering in the UK workplace, I assume this is because I am non-union? I can't think of any other reason why my perfectly common experience of salary negotiation doesn't "matter".

Again, back to Manc. I'll let Manc deal with Manc-related dross.

Oh, I can read alright. When you say "That kind of bargaining sounds more like the type of work and related recompense you'd recieved for an hours work at an Arizona Bunny Ranch." you are comparing their work to a whore's in a whorehouse, are you not? I didn't actually think that you were suggesting that Manc worked in a whorehouse (sorry Manc, but the image just is too disturbing!).

No, I'm afraid it's your mistake. Go back and read what I wrote and you'll see that I didn't misunderstand what you said at all.

Well it looks most likely that you're debating with me because you're bored, and possibly drunk. I'm just providing a fun way for you to vent all your little angry thoughts.

I'm still waiting for you to explain how it is that so many of us here have negotiated our salaries in the UK, when you maintain that it either can't be done, or is illegal!

anotherlimey

If Matt is indeed a she, then she has rather a lot of facial hair and rather large hairy hands.

dbj1000

Oi, leave 'er alone, poor dear. It's not her fault that she's rather shaggy!