fatbrit

And Mr Lincoln would be upset with you...

"If by the mere force of numbers a majority should deprive a minority of any clearly written constitutional right, it might, in a moral point of view, justify revolution"

NJ_Dave

What do the destruction of private citizen's cars and the petrol bombing of trains have to do with the French Revolution?

dbj1000

John Simpson wrote what I feel is an excellent opinion piece for the BBC earlier this week. In it he discusses many of the complex issues surrounding the rioting.

One of the major points he makes is that the French not only had their revolution, but nearly had another in 1968 when there was widespread rioting across the country. However, the French talk of the 1968 riots with reverence, as an example of the way in which they have responded to political failure and deadlock with civil disobedience and violence.

Apparently a significant proportion of the population is proud of the 1968 riots, but not of rioting by French citizens of immigrant descent... which is probably an example of the racism that the rioters are objecting to in the first place.

Philgr

Modern equivalent of sacking the upper classes homes/palaces, barricading the streets, (with overturned carriages?), burning down the Bastille, beheading the aristos etc. I'm not saying the current cause is equivalent but the method of protest is remarkably similar considering the time lapse.

scrubbedexpat099

I think you will find that 1968 and the late 18th Century mainly involved French, the issue here is deporting guests who seem to have overstayed their welcolme.

Philgr

Actually, if you read back over my comments you'll see I was questioning the following comment unrelated to nationality or deportation....

I don't disagree at all with the idea of deporting those who break a nation's law when they are staying there illegally - I was disagreeing with the notion that forceful protest is always pointless.

Elvira

But most of them were born in France!

scrubbedexpat099

Then they would be French Citizens and not at risk of deportation, just gaol time.

The thread was about those who are not.

elfman

Is "moving out of New Jersey" not an option then?

NJ_Dave

I'm confused. Is 'forceful protest' a politically correct term for 'riot' or something? These people are not demonstrating or 'forcefully protesting'. They are rioting. I see no banners asking for fairer treatment for minority groups in France. In fact I have not heard one rioter, sorry protester, go on TV and try to justify what they are doing. All I see is mindless violence with no motive other than what the media speculates about.

gruffbrown

They're just having fun Dave

Philgr

No - you are confusing the specific events you are seeing on TV with the general statement you made saying "destruction of property is wrong and illegal (and pointless)". I don't know the motives of the people rioting in France right now - luckily it's immaterial to my point. I am disagreeing with your general statement that destruction of property is wrong and pointless - sometimes it isn't - the example I chose to give where destruction was not pointless, because of the subject of this thread, was the French Revolution. Any violent overthrow of an oppresive regime would also suit my point. As would bombing in WWII if you want to extend it.

fatbrit

Dave's happy to sit there passively while his wife is raped and people who don't want freedom shoot AK47s off at him. He's a real flower-power, make-love-not-war, pacifist in my book! And I can certainly respect his beliefs. Don't think you're going to get very far with persuading him, though.

NJ_Dave

What on earth are you babbling on about now? I swear you talk all day without actually saying anything.

fatbrit

http://britishexpats.com/forum/showp...9&postcount=13