Janek66

Absolutely, they always do, especially now they don't have elections to rattle on about endlessly

Giantaxe

The fundamental problem is lack of credit - for businesses, consumers etc. Both the UK and the US have overwhelmingly credit driven economies. You can hardly blame the media for the fact that the banks are in such a mess from past lax lending that they are now unwilling to lend. That's the reason, for example, GM car sales are the lowest per-capita since '45: most people buy cars with a loan and they simply can't get one at the moment.

From the Federal Reserve today:

In other words "please, please lend".

englishinfl

Of course, now GM and Ford are jumping on the bailout bandwagon and asking for help for their own mismanagement. Some might say that a company that keeps full size truck production running at capacity when gas prices are accelerating, doesn't deserve help for it's stupidity.
I heard a local GM and Ford dealer yesterday, he was whining on tv that if everyone bought American they wouldn't have a credit lending problem because all the jobs would be safe and people would have more money to spend. Of course that's nonsense, and in reality, one would have to say that if the makers like GM had not been so complacent over the last 3 years, and had produced better spec'd, better looking and more fuel efficient cars, like the japanese makers have, then maybe they wouldn't be so deeply in the trouble that they're in now.

Tracym

Wonder what will happen now that gas is 1/2 price?

englishinfl

Hope so.

englishinfl

You know what? I wondered that too.

Giantaxe

All car makers are seeing their sales plummet. Having said that I have no sympathy for GM for all the reasons you outline. They've been compalcent for 30 years, not 3 years, hiding behind congressional lobbyists in resisting the move towards more fuel efficient vehicles. Personally I would be happy to see them go bust. This is a little tangential, but I have always said that it will take the bankruptcy of a major American company for the country to realize that tying healthcare to employment is a bad idea for both employees and employers. Maybe GM's bankruptcy would be that watershed moment.

englishinfl

According to the nightly business report yesterday, GM could be bankrupt by the middle of next year. The way the big 3 are hemorrhaging money like they are, it would be pretty surprising if one of them didn't go bust.
I'd feel sorry for the workers, and the towns they live in would suffer too, I suppose that's what the bailout is going to try and help. I'm not in favour of the people running the show getting a helping hand, when they should really be getting a kick up the ass for their crap management, but the ordinary workers... that's a different story.

meauxna

Ed Shultz had some compelling arguments yesterday for why the US can NOT afford to lose the auto industry.

It's about the last bastion of manufacturing here for one thing.

Ash UK/US

I would have thought that was self evident

The point of my reply was in response to Janek66, I am not surpised they are in trouble and closing stores. If you are not competitive you can't really expect the business.

Ash UK/US

Maybe they are all that way? I have 2 local to me and they always seem expensive.

Tracym

I'm in Illinois, and I never find anything I want at Macy's. Seems over-priced and under-good. I used to go to Fields once in a while, but after Macy's bought them, they really seemed to go downhill.

Rete

I've been shopping there almost exclusively for the last 7 months and find their clothing to be well priced and love their many sales where I can walk away with a $50 item for $15.99.

englishinfl

I understand his argument, but my point was that if someone goes bust through not reading market conditions, and general bad management, then the directors of those businesses deserve nothing from it.
Whether people agree, or don't agree with bailing them out, is personal opinion.
I'd hate to see workers diss'd for spending 30 years in a plant and not even getting retirement that they paid into, but sometimes that's life. Wrong as it is.
If people in charge make bad business decisions in a small business, then they go down the pan, and don't get a government bailout, if a big enough company makes a bad decision for years on end, they get government help, at the tax payers expense? Seems wrong somehow.

Ok, I'm off my soapbox now, somebody else get up here and have a go

englishinfl

Maybe that's because nobody sensible would ever pay 50 bucks for them to start with?

Sounds like you're a bargain hunting cost cutter, you sure you don't want a job with GM?