Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
Nov 2nd 2012, 11:37 am
#76
Banned
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 329
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
Ok, so I'm asking for some advice from fellow British expats, but this time I want to go about it from a different perspective....
My personal and professional life = incredibly shitty right now, but we won't go into that.
I have been here since 2003 and I am *trying* to like it and find some sort of place for myself here, despite the circumstances, trying to make the "best" of it. I miss the UK, but feel that I cannot return due to personal demons and a family of yuppies and narcissists that I can never be a part of.
....but I am failing. I do not like US culture, I don't like the politics, injustices of the poor / working class, lack of healthcare and protection against predatory businesses as an employee and as a consumer. I like history, I like to walk, I like temperate weather and temperate, non-judgmental people and the type of football played with your feet. No matter how much I try to slice it and dice it, I feel like I don't fit in here and never will, on a different wavelength from regular Americans.
With a bit of money and a drive to succeed in the business sense, I do see the appeal of the US over the UK. I respect people who come over here and succeed. I think that takes the kind of balls and ability to adapt that I do not possess. I just think that the US is a lousier place to be alone, not so well off and introverted than say, the UK.
" So what I'm looking for are reasons to stay. I haven't been back to the UK since I left, so tell me that UK society is now just as superficial and fake, or that the Tories are as bad as the Republican Party. One good thing about living in the US is that aside from on the road, no one has ever messed with me, but back home, I was always weary of gangs of youths.
I have no health insurance as it stands, lots of debt from the marriage I was in. There's no CAB over here and I can't go to a therapist. I have no protection at work and I am very tired and jaded, with no friends, family or acquaintances to just shoot the piss with.
Convince me to stay, or tell me that I'd be better off going home and facing the demons.
You decide.
My personal and professional life = incredibly shitty right now, but we won't go into that.
I have been here since 2003 and I am *trying* to like it and find some sort of place for myself here, despite the circumstances, trying to make the "best" of it. I miss the UK, but feel that I cannot return due to personal demons and a family of yuppies and narcissists that I can never be a part of.
....but I am failing. I do not like US culture, I don't like the politics, injustices of the poor / working class, lack of healthcare and protection against predatory businesses as an employee and as a consumer. I like history, I like to walk, I like temperate weather and temperate, non-judgmental people and the type of football played with your feet. No matter how much I try to slice it and dice it, I feel like I don't fit in here and never will, on a different wavelength from regular Americans.
With a bit of money and a drive to succeed in the business sense, I do see the appeal of the US over the UK. I respect people who come over here and succeed. I think that takes the kind of balls and ability to adapt that I do not possess. I just think that the US is a lousier place to be alone, not so well off and introverted than say, the UK.
" So what I'm looking for are reasons to stay. I haven't been back to the UK since I left, so tell me that UK society is now just as superficial and fake, or that the Tories are as bad as the Republican Party. One good thing about living in the US is that aside from on the road, no one has ever messed with me, but back home, I was always weary of gangs of youths.
I have no health insurance as it stands, lots of debt from the marriage I was in. There's no CAB over here and I can't go to a therapist. I have no protection at work and I am very tired and jaded, with no friends, family or acquaintances to just shoot the piss with.
Convince me to stay, or tell me that I'd be better off going home and facing the demons.
You decide.
So, what do you reckon ?
You've asked us to decide and there has been lots of advice.
On balance do you think you'll stay or do you think you'll go ?
I'm intrigued.
Nov 2nd 2012, 1:13 pm
#77
Forum Regular
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 285
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
Oh and I came here alone, as did many people i've met!
Last edited by helpmeplease123; Nov 2nd 2012 at 1:16 pm.
Nov 2nd 2012, 1:32 pm
#78
Homebody
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: HOME
Posts: 23,182
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
Why do some people here find it so difficult to accept that there are people for whom the US is simply not a good fit. I went home and I knew that I am where I belong. I would not trade that sense of belonging and living amongst people who are on the same wavelength for anything in the world.
Both countries have 'issues' but I for one know where I need to be. Living in the US was interesting, rewarding, fun even, for a while, but at the end of the day it was not for me.
Both countries have 'issues' but I for one know where I need to be. Living in the US was interesting, rewarding, fun even, for a while, but at the end of the day it was not for me.
Nov 2nd 2012, 2:14 pm
#79
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: East Seaxe
Posts: 73,242
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
Why do some people here find it so difficult to accept that there are people for whom the US is simply not a good fit. I went home and I knew that I am where I belong. I would not trade that sense of belonging and living amongst people who are on the same wavelength for anything in the world.
Both countries have 'issues' but I for one know where I need to be. Living in the US was interesting, rewarding, fun even, for a while, but at the end of the day it was not for me.
Both countries have 'issues' but I for one know where I need to be. Living in the US was interesting, rewarding, fun even, for a while, but at the end of the day it was not for me.
If you moved from Brighton to Leeds and decided that you didn't like it and wanted to go back, no one would think twice about it. There wouldn't be all these bizarre accusations of personal weakness and psychological infirmities. Weird.
Nov 2nd 2012, 2:39 pm
#80
Democracy advocate
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 12,552
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
You arrived here 3 months ago with a college course (& therefore friends) already organized and paid for - that's a very different situation than the OP who has been here 9 years, had what sounds like a failed marriage and has to work just to get-by.
Why don't you try and book yourself on empathy 101 as an additional unit.
Why don't you try and book yourself on empathy 101 as an additional unit.
Nov 2nd 2012, 3:10 pm
#82
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Purgatory (PU, USA)
Posts: 860
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
I'm not sure about that... it seems I waited too long to revisit and all the good posts got deleted
Why can't you go to college here? It's actually a great way to meet people, which would solve one of your main problems. Sorry but i find it impossible to believe that you have nothing in common with anyone in the US... that's absurd. Why do you think the jobs market is any better in England? In fact it will probably be harder for you as i'm guessing you've developed a network of contacts here and will be starting fresh there.
Oh and I came here alone, as did many people i've met!
Why can't you go to college here? It's actually a great way to meet people, which would solve one of your main problems. Sorry but i find it impossible to believe that you have nothing in common with anyone in the US... that's absurd. Why do you think the jobs market is any better in England? In fact it will probably be harder for you as i'm guessing you've developed a network of contacts here and will be starting fresh there.
Oh and I came here alone, as did many people i've met!
Co-signed ex-wife's student loans, meaning that Sallie Mae are on my ass and will not lend me additional money to study a course myself.
Why is it absurd? The US and UK are extremely different. As much as some of us may want to admit, we have a billion times more in common with our European neighbours than the US....culturally, politically, socially and economically.
I came here alone too, but to be with my ex wife. I would never have just moved to the US off the bat. I actually planned to try elsewhere in the EU before I met my wife.
Hope that answers your questions. You missed the "kick me when I'm down" parade by 12 hours or so. Their posts seem to have been deleted, meaning that at least some people here have a conscience.
Nov 2nd 2012, 3:11 pm
#83
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Purgatory (PU, USA)
Posts: 860
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
You arrived here 3 months ago with a college course (& therefore friends) already organized and paid for - that's a very different situation than the OP who has been here 9 years, had what sounds like a failed marriage and has to work just to get-by.
Why don't you try and book yourself on empathy 101 as an additional unit.
Why don't you try and book yourself on empathy 101 as an additional unit.
Nov 2nd 2012, 3:13 pm
#84
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: East Seaxe
Posts: 73,242
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
Most people here are normal, helpful people. A few get weird when behind a computer screen and say things that they probably wouldn't in real life. I would just ignore them and move on.
Get thee to the UK - I think that's what you really want in your heart of hearts.
Get thee to the UK - I think that's what you really want in your heart of hearts.
Nov 2nd 2012, 3:19 pm
#85
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Purgatory (PU, USA)
Posts: 860
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
Most people here are normal, helpful people. A few get weird when behind a computer screen and say things that they probably wouldn't in real life. I would just ignore them and move on.
Get thee to the UK - I think that's what you really want in your heart of hearts.
Get thee to the UK - I think that's what you really want in your heart of hearts.
Nov 2nd 2012, 5:18 pm
#86
The Kwisatz Haderach
Joined: Aug 2008
Location: North Wales
Posts: 8,080
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
Most people here are normal, helpful people. A few get weird when behind a computer screen and say things that they probably wouldn't in real life. I would just ignore them and move on.
Get thee to the UK - I think that's what you really want in your heart of hearts.
Get thee to the UK - I think that's what you really want in your heart of hearts.
Nov 2nd 2012, 5:50 pm
#87
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,847
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
Hi Ethelred,
Some others have observed that it looks like you are looking for the good bits of being in the UK 10 years ago. You've pointed out that you currently don't have the money to head back to the UK or anywhere else just now.
My sense is that you're looking to get a little bit of direction for the immediate future, as well as more obviously, the longer term.
A couple of things spring to mind, and I'll just present them as simple statements as a base to anchor yourself to...
Often times a simple reframe (not always simple to do) can help you break through something that up until now had been a block against you... A bit like the scene in "Dead Poets Society" where the Robin Williams character encourages his student to stand on his desk and survey the classroom, and notice how different it looks, what new opportunities become available... even though it is the same classroom as before...
I'm just giving a glimpse here in to a way of looking at things that is not so conventional. I'd be happy to answer specific questions via PM, just to be a safe sounding board. My best friend is bipolar, and whilst I am in no way suggesting you are, I share this to indicate that I have some experience of helping people who see the,selves as being a little bit stuck in a rut...
Either way, travel safely...
Harry
Some others have observed that it looks like you are looking for the good bits of being in the UK 10 years ago. You've pointed out that you currently don't have the money to head back to the UK or anywhere else just now.
My sense is that you're looking to get a little bit of direction for the immediate future, as well as more obviously, the longer term.
A couple of things spring to mind, and I'll just present them as simple statements as a base to anchor yourself to...
- The future does not have to become the past. For many of us it is almost automatic to project the unwanted aspects of the past on to the future, and act as if that unwanted, unattractive future was inevitable...
- The future is yours to make, so why not make it good? The trick here is NOT to create a vision of where you want to get to... Instead the trick is to create a compelling vision that can act as your compass... This takes away any pressure you may create for yourself about achieving your vision, which might be out of your control anyway. Instead,you focus on what you can do, what you do have control,over, that gets you closer each day, each week, to your compelling vision that is your compass.
- In heading towards the future, know that you don't have to get there in just a few large steps, but will find it easier to get there in smaller, more numerous steps.
- Think in terms of next small actions you can take right now, in the next 15 minutes, in the next 24-48 hours... And then take more next small steps... And keep repeating this cycle.
- These small steps don't have to head exactly in the direction of your compelling vision... Only in the general direction, because even if that step takes you 6 feet forward, and only 1 inch of that is in the direction of your vision, it's still inching you closer... And very soon you can see that you will have made some real progress, and that brings its own momentum, it's own hope... It begins to snowball.
Often times a simple reframe (not always simple to do) can help you break through something that up until now had been a block against you... A bit like the scene in "Dead Poets Society" where the Robin Williams character encourages his student to stand on his desk and survey the classroom, and notice how different it looks, what new opportunities become available... even though it is the same classroom as before...
I'm just giving a glimpse here in to a way of looking at things that is not so conventional. I'd be happy to answer specific questions via PM, just to be a safe sounding board. My best friend is bipolar, and whilst I am in no way suggesting you are, I share this to indicate that I have some experience of helping people who see the,selves as being a little bit stuck in a rut...
Either way, travel safely...
Harry
Nov 2nd 2012, 6:26 pm
#88
Forum Regular
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 285
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
What did I say that lacks common sense? It is ridiculous for you to say there is no one in the US you have anything in common with, for a start, there are a lot of English people here and over 300 million others - since I imagine you've met a tiny fraction of that so far, why not get out and try and meet new people in different ways rather than just concluding there's no way you'll want to be friends with any of them.
Call it "bullying" if you want but from your posts you look at everything in that sense and you can call it mean, whatever you want but telling you what you want to hear is not the kind thing to do. It is the cowardly thing. If you want to move back to England great, don't use the cover of a family rift to not do it and if you want to stay here fine great, don't use the cover of your ex-wife and healthcare not to do it. The college question was genuine, fine you don't have the money for loans but why not try and get a scholarship - there are always possibilites and options, my point is was to think like that instead of trying to talk yourself out of everything.
Ok stalker...
No I haven't had a failed marriage NOR did I have the security of a wife and her family and friends when I got here. How were my friends organised? I had to find a flatmate who i'd never met before, go to classes, get car etc. etc. etc. by myself, nothing was organised - it's no different to someone moving here for any other reason. Yes I got a scholarship for school fees but how do you think i'm paying for rent, bills etc. the same as someone working... I worked damn hard to save up before leaving England and i'm certainly not living an extravagant lifestyle until i'm able to get a job here next semester.
Call it "bullying" if you want but from your posts you look at everything in that sense and you can call it mean, whatever you want but telling you what you want to hear is not the kind thing to do. It is the cowardly thing. If you want to move back to England great, don't use the cover of a family rift to not do it and if you want to stay here fine great, don't use the cover of your ex-wife and healthcare not to do it. The college question was genuine, fine you don't have the money for loans but why not try and get a scholarship - there are always possibilites and options, my point is was to think like that instead of trying to talk yourself out of everything.
You arrived here 3 months ago with a college course (& therefore friends) already organized and paid for - that's a very different situation than the OP who has been here 9 years, had what sounds like a failed marriage and has to work just to get-by.
Why don't you try and book yourself on empathy 101 as an additional unit.
Why don't you try and book yourself on empathy 101 as an additional unit.
No I haven't had a failed marriage NOR did I have the security of a wife and her family and friends when I got here. How were my friends organised? I had to find a flatmate who i'd never met before, go to classes, get car etc. etc. etc. by myself, nothing was organised - it's no different to someone moving here for any other reason. Yes I got a scholarship for school fees but how do you think i'm paying for rent, bills etc. the same as someone working... I worked damn hard to save up before leaving England and i'm certainly not living an extravagant lifestyle until i'm able to get a job here next semester.
Nov 2nd 2012, 6:56 pm
#90
Democracy advocate
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 12,552
Re: Convince me NOT to go back to the UK
Ok stalker...
No I haven't had a failed marriage NOR did I have the security of a wife and her family and friends when I got here. How were my friends organised? I had to find a flatmate who i'd never met before, go to classes, get car etc. etc. etc. by myself, nothing was organised - it's no different to someone moving here for any other reason. Yes I got a scholarship for school fees but how do you think i'm paying for rent, bills etc. the same as someone working... I worked damn hard to save up before leaving England and i'm certainly not living an extravagant lifestyle until i'm able to get a job here next semester.
No I haven't had a failed marriage NOR did I have the security of a wife and her family and friends when I got here. How were my friends organised? I had to find a flatmate who i'd never met before, go to classes, get car etc. etc. etc. by myself, nothing was organised - it's no different to someone moving here for any other reason. Yes I got a scholarship for school fees but how do you think i'm paying for rent, bills etc. the same as someone working... I worked damn hard to save up before leaving England and i'm certainly not living an extravagant lifestyle until i'm able to get a job here next semester.
"I worked damn hard for...." - one of the most boring and dreary statements ever. I suspect the OP has worked hard as well, but things haven't gone as planned for him and he doesn't have the money or motivation that you currently do.
You've been here 3 months FFS - in a student arena that's more like a long holiday, damn, I've had backpacking trips longer than 3 months!
I'm sure you feel you are telling the OP "how it is", but in reality you have the experience, empathy and understanding of a twig.
