John

I hope you can give me good news. My fiance has been working with false papers in
this country for about 6 years. After we get married, what will be the consequences
in your experience? Under what circumstances will she be deported? Should we get an
attorney and if so do you know a good one in Denver?

John

Mrtravel

John wrote:
    > I hope you can give me good news. My fiance has been working with false papers in
    > this country for about 6 years. After we get married, what will be the
    > consequences in your experience? Under what circumstances will she be deported?
    > Should we get an attorney and if so do you know a good one in Denver?

Did she enter legally?

If yes, then you can get married and file to adjust status. Using false papers to
work is a problem, but may be overcome. For that, I would recommend a lawyer.

If not, then the stuff below applies. Again, if here illegally, I would still pay a
lawyer for advice in this situation.

Unless there is a new LIFE-type legislation, there will be problems.

She is subject to deportation unless she can get some type of refugee status.
Economics is NOT a reason to get refugee status.

A lawyer will not recommend you do anything illegal. I am not saying to do this, but
INS doesn't know she is here. INS won't know if she leaves.... Then, of course, when
filing the paperwork, you would have to claim she has been in her home country all of
this time.


    > John

Folinskyiinla

[email protected] (John) wrote in message
news:<[email protected]. com>...
    > I hope you can give me good news. My fiance has been working with false papers in
    > this country for about 6 years. After we get married, what will be the
    > consequences in your experience? Under what circumstances will she be deported?
    > Should we get an attorney and if so do you know a good one in Denver?
    > John

I'm an immigration lawyer, but not Matt.

Are you a US Citizen? Did your fiance enter "with inpsection?" Note I didn't say
"legally". What do you mean by "false papers?" What has she been doing.

Maybe you can, maybe you can't. It may be easy, it may be hard. You should consult
with an attorney.

The AILA chapter in Denver is sizable -- call James Bonn, Nancy Elkind, or Robert
Heiserman.

Folinskyiinla

mrtravel <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
    > John wrote:
    > >
    > > I hope you can give me good news. My fiance has been working with false papers
    > > in this country for about 6 years. After we get married, what will be the
    > > consequences in your experience? Under what circumstances will she be deported?
    > > Should we get an attorney and if so do you know a good one in Denver?
    > Did she enter legally?
    > If yes, then you can get married and file to adjust status. Using false papers to
    > work is a problem, but may be overcome. For that, I would recommend a lawyer.
    > If not, then the stuff below applies. Again, if here illegally, I would still pay a
    > lawyer for advice in this situation.
    > Unless there is a new LIFE-type legislation, there will be problems.
    > She is subject to deportation unless she can get some type of refugee status.
    > Economics is NOT a reason to get refugee status.
    > A lawyer will not recommend you do anything illegal. I am not saying to do this,
    > but INS doesn't know she is here. INS won't know if she leaves.... Then, of course,
    > when filing the paperwork, you would have to claim she has been in her home country
    > all of this time.
An immigration lawyer notes:

I don't recommend illegal conduct for two reasons: one, it could mean my license to
pratice law -- and after 3 years of law school and 26 years of practice, you can't
pay me enough to do that. SECOND -- it is STUPID for the client to do that. The
very first ground of deportation is that you were inadmissible at entry. There is no
time limit on this. So the person will then have a POISONED green card. Lets say
they not only get the green card, but later naturalize -- are they home free? No
they are not -- they can be denaturalized and then deported. This can happen DECADES
later. You think this doesn't happen. Look up the names "Yang" and "Demanjuk" in
the Supreme Court cases.

If people want to be stupid -- that their problem -- you shouldn't go around
recommending stupidity. If she is already here illegally, at least preserve the
status quo rather than compounding the matter by criminal acts.

Mrtravel

FolinskyiInLA wrote:

. If she is already here illegally, at
    > least preserve the status quo rather than compounding the matter by criminal acts.

OK.. If she is here illegally, but entered legally, she may not have a big problem.
Of course, there is the illegal working paper issue.

How can someone who entered illegally become legal, if there is no existing LIFE law
that will help them? Without having to leave the country for 10 years or so?

John

[email protected] (FolinskyiInLA) wrote in message
news:<[email protected]. com>...
    > [email protected] (John) wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]. com>...
    > > I hope you can give me good news. My fiance has been working with false papers
    > > in this country for about 6 years. After we get married, what will be the
    > > consequences in your experience? Under what circumstances will she be deported?
    > > Should we get an attorney and if so do you know a good one in Denver?
    > >
    > > John
    > I'm an immigration lawyer, but not Matt.
    > Are you a US Citizen? Did your fiance enter "with inpsection?" Note I didn't say
    > "legally". What do you mean by "false papers?" What has she been doing.
    > Maybe you can, maybe you can't. It may be easy, it may be hard. You should
    > consult with an attorney.
    > The AILA chapter in Denver is sizable -- call James Bonn, Nancy Elkind, or Robert
    > Heiserman.

I am a citizen. She did enter with inspection (tourist visa 6 years ago). False
papers = fake SS card. Working as a secretary.

Folinskyiinla

[email protected] (John) wrote in message
news:<[email protected] om>...
    > [email protected] (FolinskyiInLA) wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]. com>...
    > > [email protected] (John) wrote in message
    > > news:<[email protected]. com>...
    > > > I hope you can give me good news. My fiance has been working with false papers
    > > > in this country for about 6 years. After we get married, what will be the
    > > > consequences in your experience? Under what circumstances will she be
    > > > deported? Should we get an attorney and if so do you know a good one in
    > > > Denver?
    > > >
    > > > John
    > >
    > > I'm an immigration lawyer, but not Matt.
    > >
    > > Are you a US Citizen? Did your fiance enter "with inpsection?" Note I didn't
    > > say "legally". What do you mean by "false papers?" What has she been doing.
    > >
    > > Maybe you can, maybe you can't. It may be easy, it may be hard. You should
    > > consult with an attorney.
    > >
    > > The AILA chapter in Denver is sizable -- call James Bonn, Nancy Elkind, or Robert
    > > Heiserman.
    > I am a citizen. She did enter with inspection (tourist visa 6 years ago). False
    > papers = fake SS card. Working as a secretary.

Hi:

Do consult with an immigration lawyer. As an INITIAL reaction, my feeling is that
the important fact will be whether or not she did any I-9 forms, and if so, what did
she claim? Do not take this as legal advise -- I don't know your case at all and I'm
NOT your lawyer. But depending on the answers, there IS hope.

Good luck.

Mrtravel

John wrote:
    > I am a citizen. She did enter with inspection (tourist visa 6 years ago). False
    > papers = fake SS card. Working as a secretary.

I believe this is much better than if she had entered uninspected. However, I would
also talk to an immigration lawyer.

Using false papers to obtain employment is illegal. Making false statements on I-9 is
illegal. I-9 is the form you give your employer when you are hired. If your employer
doesn't have one for you, then they are in violation of the law and can be fined.

Paulgani

"mrtravel" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > > I am a citizen. She did enter with inspection (tourist visa 6 years ago). False
    > > papers = fake SS card. Working as a secretary.
    > I believe this is much better than if she had entered uninspected. However, I would
    > also talk to an immigration lawyer.
    > Using false papers to obtain employment is illegal. Making false statements on I-9
    > is illegal. I-9 is the form you give your employer when you are hired. If your
    > employer doesn't have one for you, then they are in violation of the law and can
    > be fined.

What you are looking for on the I-9 is whether the alien falsely claimed to be a U.S.
Citizen. Such a claim invokes a permanent ban with no waiver available.

Employers are required to keep I-9s for 3 years. If she started work 6 years ago,
there is no requirement that the I-9 should still exist.

Paulgani

Mrtravel

paulgani wrote:
    > Employers are required to keep I-9s for 3 years. If she started work 6 years ago,
    > there is no requirement that the I-9 should still exist.

I assumed there was no limit on the time if the person was still employed.

John

[email protected] (FolinskyiInLA) wrote in message
news:<[email protected]. com>...
    > [email protected] (John) wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected] om>...
    > > [email protected] (FolinskyiInLA) wrote in message
    > > news:<[email protected]. com>...
    > > > [email protected] (John) wrote in message
    > > > news:<[email protected]. com>...
    > > > > I hope you can give me good news. My fiance has been working with false
    > > > > papers in this country for about 6 years. After we get married, what will be
    > > > > the consequences in your experience? Under what circumstances will she be
    > > > > deported? Should we get an attorney and if so do you know a good one in
    > > > > Denver?
    > > > >
    > > > > John
    > > >
    > > > I'm an immigration lawyer, but not Matt.
    > > >
    > > > Are you a US Citizen? Did your fiance enter "with inpsection?" Note I didn't
    > > > say "legally". What do you mean by "false papers?" What has she been doing.
    > > >
    > > > Maybe you can, maybe you can't. It may be easy, it may be hard. You should
    > > > consult with an attorney.
    > > >
    > > > The AILA chapter in Denver is sizable -- call James Bonn, Nancy Elkind, or
    > > > Robert Heiserman.
    > >
    > > I am a citizen. She did enter with inspection (tourist visa 6 years ago). False
    > > papers = fake SS card. Working as a secretary.
    > Hi:
    > Do consult with an immigration lawyer. As an INITIAL reaction, my feeling is that
    > the important fact will be whether or not she did any I-9 forms, and if so, what
    > did she claim? Do not take this as legal advise -- I don't know your case at all
    > and I'm NOT your lawyer. But depending on the answers, there IS hope.
    > Good luck.

Well, she did fill out an I-9. She probably said she was a citizen. Don't worry, I
am not consitering this legal advice (except the part that says get legal advice).
In your experience, is she going to stay?

Chris Parker

    > The very first ground of deportation is that you were inadmissible at entry. There
    > is no time limit on this. So the person will then have a POISONED green card. Lets
    > say they not only get the green card, but later naturalize -- are they home free?
    > No they are not -- they can be denaturalized and then deported. This can happen
    > DECADES later. You think this doesn't happen. Look up the names "Yang" and
    > "Demanjuk" in the Supreme Court cases.

The approval of an adjustment of status application is admission. BIA: Matter of Sara
Ofelia ROSAS-Ramirez - April 7, 1999

The only way you can be found inadmissible after receiving a green card is if you
obtained it through fraud, misrepresentation, or concealment of a material fact
(i.e., your admission is revoked).


CP

Chris Parker

    > The very first ground of deportation is that you were inadmissible at entry. There
    > is no time limit on this. So the person will then have a POISONED green card. Lets
    > say they not only get the green card, but later naturalize -- are they home free?
    > No they are not -- they can be denaturalized and then deported.

BIA: Matter of Sara Ofelia ROSAS-Ramirez - April 7, 1999 http://www.usdoj.gov/eoir/efoia/bia-
/Decisions/Revdec/pdfDEC/3384.pdf

I disagree unless false documents are used to apply for and obtain adjustment
of status.


CP

Chris Parker

    > I am a citizen. She did enter with inspection (tourist visa 6 years ago). False
    > papers = fake SS card. Working as a secretary.

She should stop working under illegal documents once she is work authorized.

When she gets a work permit based on the adjustment application following marriage,
submit it to the employer with a new, corrected Form I-9.

Employer could fire hire for willful misrepresentation on her employment application
and the committing of document fraud in conjunction with the Form I9 she originally
submitted, but they are not required to do so by the law. If they do, this could
hurt her business reference from this employer also. On the other hand, it may not
matter to them also so long as she is now, indeed, work authorized. You know the
employer, so that's a decision you'll have to make.

She could also change jobs once wokr authorized to avoid exposing her wrongdoing to
an employer, and that might be another alternative to consider.


CP

Chris Parker

    > Well, she did fill out an I-9. She probably said she was a citizen. Don't worry, I
    > am not consitering this legal advice (except the part that says get legal advice).
    > In your experience, is she going to stay?

False claim of U.S. citizenship is a ground of inadmissibility. False claim of
Permanent Residence is not as far as I can tell, however.

Let's hope that document is gone if that is the case, and in any case, you do have a
skeleton in the closet if that is so!


CP