grumble

Hello all,
Last week my 13 year old son was brought home by the police for stealing a low item value from a local shop. Fortunately he was NOT arrested. However, the officer is due to return next week to issue my son with a formal reprimand (juvenile caution).
This is first offence (hopefully his last). My understanding that a youth caution is not a conviction but will be held on the Police National Computer. We have ESTA's authorised already for our Florida Holiday next April but I am aware that we have to notify any changes.
The ESTA form asked if he has been arrested or convicted of an offence. I believe he has neither. However, I am a little concerned in case the American authorities interpret a youth caution as a conviction.
Should I apply for a Visa for him or will the ESTA I already have for him suffice?

crg

Hi,

You stated that he wasn't arrested. A youth caution is not considered a conviction for immigration purposes. That may help you decide if your answer to the ESTA question is still accurate.

ian-mstm

That's not actually what ESTA asks... but, that aside, a juvenile caution is not considered a conviction for US immigration purposes as CRG correctly indicated. So, no need to do anything... enjoy your trip.

Ian

grumble

Thanks both.
I have also been looking on the US Embassy London Website and there appears to be so much conflicting advice:
Below is an extract from someone who posed a simmilar question.

http://www.usembassy.org.uk/visaserv...=1529#comments

alex says:
5 October 2010 at 10:39
hello

my girlfriend and i would like to visit New York on the 18th of november, but it has been bought to my attention that a 3 year police caution i got when i was 16 (i am now 29) might course problems in entering the U.S.

I would be very greatful for some clarification on this issue

Many thanks

Alex

Reply
visaservices4 says:
8 October 2010 at 12:06
alex – if you have been arrested, cautioned or convicted of a crime, you should apply for a visa. More information on applying for a visa is available here.

Reply

Hope it is correct what you say as this reprimand has already caused a lot of family strife without the added burden of having to apply for a visa or fear of getting turned away at Orlando airport.

crg

The response posted included the term "cautioned". That word isn't in the ESTA questions.

Keep in mind that the consulate does not manage the Visa Waiver Program, the ESTA, or decide who is admitted under the VWP.

It all comes down to if there was an arrest, or a conviction. Did the police officer consider it to be an arrest?

The exact question is:

"Have you ever been arrested or convicted for an offense or crime involving moral turpitude or a violation related to a controlled substance; or have been arrested or convicted for two or more offenses for which the aggregate sentence to confinement was five years or more; or have been a controlled substance trafficker; or are you seeking entry to engage in criminal or immoral activities?"

grumble

I know my son was definatley not arrested but will probably receive a formal caution next week. I am just concerned though, that this will show up on the Police National Computer (PNC) as a caution administered. I just hope no one on the American side have sight of this and interpret it as an arrest or conviction even though it will be neither.

Thanks again for your replies.

ian-mstm

Perhaps you're just not twigging to the relevant part of the question.

ESTA doesn't simply ask about an arrest or conviction... it is MUCH more specific than that and it tells you exactly what the nature is, of that arrest or conviction:

"Have you ever been arrested or convicted for an offense or crime involving moral turpitude or a violation related to a controlled substance; or have been arrested or convicted for two or more offenses for which the aggregate sentence to confinement was five years or more; or have been a controlled substance trafficker; or are you seeking entry to engage in criminal or immoral activities?"

I don't know how much clearer I can make it. If you don't fit into those very narrowly defined parameters, then it's a non-issue.

Ian

crg

Theft is almost always a CIMT, but a 13 year old is generally not held accountable for convictions unless they are for things such as trafficking drugs and even that would often only be applied if the care was adjudicated in an adult court.

Generally, until a child reaches the age of 15, they can practically get away with murder.... literally. Arrests/Convictions for a CIMT would have to be disclosed on the ESTA regardless of the age regardless of whether or not it would lead to a finding of inadmissibility. CIMT convictions for children aged 15, 16, and 17 would trigger a 5 year bar from the end of incarceration if the conviction even counted for immigration purposes.

I would bet a lot of money they would not send a 13 year old back across the pond for this. I could only imagine the negative publicity and they have bigger fish to fry.