mikej49

Hello Nun
Another question
I have printed out the W8-BEN form. when should this be submitted to my 401K plan > just before I leave or after I have returned in to the UK, I dont want to be double taxed, sounds like a stupid question but I want to get my ducks in a row by the end of the year when I return and I will be giving up my green card, how do I officially do that also, here in the States or back home in UK
Simcerely
Mike mwj49

nun

The W8-BEN is filed when you take distributions from your 401k so that no tax is withheld. This form is only for non-US persons.

To notify the IRS of your expatriation you should file a 8854 form.

Once back in the UK to abandon your greencard you can file I-407 at the US embassy

http://photos.state.gov/libraries/164203/dhs/I-407.pdf

Once back in the UK you should contact your local tax office and tell them

Here's a basic check list

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Governme...eUK/DG_4000140

JAJ

Note that filing an I-407 is an irreversible abandonment of permanent resident status. In other words, you can only get it back by starting from scratch and if the way you originally got your GC isn't open any more then your chance of returning to live in the USA is about zero.

I wonder how many people file an I-407 and then regret it later on?

For someone to have lived in the USA for a long time, and then to abandon (or lose) permanent resident status in order to move back to a country which will have changed significantly is a very significant risk. What is the chance that such person realises that the USA is really "home" after all and can't get back there?

Those who have held a GC for more than 8 years may be subject to expatriation tax provisions, if assets are significant enough.

nun

These are all good points. If you have a Greencard and move to the UK to live, you'll loose the green card eventually just because you aren't resident in the US anymore. If you are certain that you want to stay in the UK, I'd file the I-407 to make things clear and the 8854 is definitely necessary to make things clear wrt to taxation. The expatriation tax issues have to be considered, so for people with high incomes or networths some planning is required.

JAJ

The question someone who has been in the USA a long time needs to ask themselves is whether it is really such a good idea to leave the USA without becoming a US citizen.

mikej49

Thanks JAJ
I do intend to retire and stay home in the UK, have this feeling in my heart that its where I want to be whatever it takes, feel the need to be close to my immediate family and they want me home too.
I wont mind giving up my green card as I will be retired and maybe visit friends in the US from time to time.
Thanks for the info on the I-407, do I do that before I leave or at the US embassy in London.
How difficult is it to get my 401K money in the UK, is it best to have it taxed and take a lump sum or monthly payments and can all that be doone in the UK
mikej49

mikej49

Thank you JAJ
Yes its a big move after many years but I feel I am ready to return and give up my green card, I wiill be 64 when I return and plan to retire in Yorkshire where I was born and all my family are there.
I have enjoyed my life here in the States but my heart and head tells me thats where I need to be
Appreciate the info on the I -407, do I complete that here before I leave or at the US Embassy in London
mikej49

nun

That's how I feel too. I will miss some things when I move back to the UK, but not enough to cause me any worry or regret that I left the US. Taking US citizenship will greatly complicate your financial and tax situation and if you don't think you'll want to return to the US to live or have any close family connections there I would advise against it.

I'd do it at the US embassy in London

http://london.usembassy.gov/dhs/uscis/abandon.html

Your question relates to tax planning and that will depend on your circumstances. As you are 64 you can take penalty free withdrawals from your 401k. If you give up your LPR status and live in the UK you will not be liable for US tax on your 401k withdrawals, but you will have to pay UK tax on them. The most tax efficient approach will be to take annual withdrawals from the 401k so that you limit your annual income tax bill and allow the 401k to grow tax free; any gains in the 401k are obviously US tax free and they are also UK tax free under Article 18(1) of the US/UK Tax Treaty. You should let your 401k provider know that you are moving to the UK and also look into rolling your 401k into an IRA before you leave the US. The IRA will give you a bit more flexibility. I'd look at rolling it over to someone like Vanguard or Fidelity. They have low fees and will definitely let you make transactions from overseas as long as you set up the account before you leave.


If you take out the 401k as a lump sum you will have a high income tax bill in the UK in that year and you will also loose the tax deferred growth inside the 401k. You could invest in a UK ISA, but there are limits to your annual contribution amounts.

mikej49

Thank you Nun for all your advice, I wil keep my British citizenship and try and talk to someone from my 401K plan.
All my family are in the UK and would only return for a holiday every so often.
Also have an appointment from a UK/US tax man who I got through this site and hopefully he can give me some advice
I want to do it it the right way, pay my taxes but not get doubly taxed if I dont have to but I am very anxious to get home
Mikej49

nun

Good, if you are just a UKC living in the UK then your tax situation will be quite simple. You won't have any US tax withheld from your 401k, but you will have to file a UK self assessment SA100 and SA109 to declare your foreign income to HMRC.

Please tell us how the meeting goes with the US/UK tax man, I will be doing the same in a few years and I'd like to know who you see and if they do a good job.

mikej49

Thank you Nun
Where do I file the UK assessment SA 100 / SA 109, here in the US or when I get back to UK?
I will let you know how much info I get from my tax man on May 3rd
mikej49

nun

You only file the SA100 and SA109 once you are back in the UK and come under the thumb of HMRC once again.

mikej49

Thank you !
mikej49