Jerseygirl

No NI contributions do not pay for the NHS....NI pays for pensions and social services. The NHS is paid for by taxes.

robin1234

Another thought - the uninsured are not cost-free for the nation now. They pay upfront for their medical care. If they fail to pay, their tab is picked up by the Government, the Provider, charity, etc. As Steerpike says in a post here about 5 minutes ago, they likely incur higher costs for not getting preventive care.

Giantaxe

The fact that the US spends more of its GDP on healthcare, still has 45 million uninsured and doesn't have better health outcomes than other western nations should clue you into something...

And some of those 40 million, btw, often turn up at hospital emergency rooms to get their "primary" care.

scrubbedexpat091

est. 86 million people are already covered under some type of government health care plan.

The 45.8 million uninsured are more likely to be poor and low income than higher income. Figure 2 shows that over half of the uninsured are below 200% of poverty, with 25% below the poverty line and 28% between 100% and 199% of poverty

While the income distribution of the uninsured is skewed toward those with lower incomes, Figure 2 shows 27% of the uninsured have incomes above 300% of poverty, with one-in-ten (11%) uninsured above 500% FPL.(4)

38% of those uninsured make 300% or more of the poverty level.

That the uninsured comprise non-trivial percentages of middle and upper income individuals is surprising.

Those with incomes above 300% of poverty should generally find employer insurance affordable.

Data from employers shows that average single coverage premiums for employer sponsored insurance represent 2.0% of income at 300% FPL, and average family coverage premiums represent 4.7% of income for a family of four at 300% FPL (with a higher percentage for smaller families).

More here.

http://aspe.hhs.gov/health/reports/0...dex.htm#income

The poverty guidelines for the lower 48 are:

10,400 family of 1
14,000 for 2
17,600 for 3
21,200 for 4

exvj

absolutely nothing I agree - that's the nice thing about the ethos of the NHS - it's all about 'need' and not about whether you have enough money, or paid enough contributions to turn yourself from 'tough luck bud' into a human with a medical problem who deserves to be helped simply because --- they are human

I don't know how many Americans are able to make this leap of concept - I reckon a lot more than I original thought when I first came here

I reckon they have figured it out all on their own - hence Obama

A person will dive into a burning building to rescue you, but then agree that your unmortgaged house is taken from you and your life savings taken, if you don't have insurance to pay the burns unit at the hospital

Seems harsh; is harsh; it won't continue much longer

Giantaxe

If they are employed in a job that provides health insurance - many don't. Plus employer-provided insurance doesn't help the self-employed, or those that cannot work.

Jerseygirl

In your dreams maybe.

exvj

Excellent stats and mainly shows me wrong on that one.

However, these people earning 300% of poverty would be financially wiped out by a big health problem (350k ?) and therefore not much of the health cost would be recoverable from them, and a big part must fall on the public purse anyway at the moment with the patient being made bankrupt if necessary (a high number)

When a person is bankrupted, there are consequences for society beyond the medical bill write off

I wonder how much of the total costs are actually paid by the individual when it comes right down to it

chartreuse

Strictly speaking, NI goes directly to pay the pensions of existing pensioners. Like Social Security, it would be an illegal ponzi scheme if anybody but the government was running it.

exvj

I dont know anyone in the Uk who gets a regular catflapometricaloscopy costing 3k check up offered by their doctor when they are not reporting a problem

Never

praps they dont talk about it either

Nope I am surrounded by old geezers in my social circle and nobody ever gets offered one as a routine thing

It doesnt happen - it doesnt - really

I had to insist they did my blood once per year - that was my idea and not the doctors and they thought i was a nuisance to ask for that

the birds get their annual peek a boo but us guys are ignored until we get something

scrubbedexpat091

Those who cannot work are generally on disability and qualify for other programs the government offers.

surly

Those figures indicate to me, less of a Health care problem, but more of an income distribution problem.
Something of greater concern, the gap between the rich and the poor.

Steerpike

I wonder how many of those are self-employed, or otherwise don't have access to group coverage? Private Insurance will be denied based on pre-existing conditions, and that can include a history of depression, alcoholism, even smoking in some cases. I personally have some possibly serious 'memory' problems - maybe an early indication of Alzheimers, who knows. I talked to my doc, he offered to send me to a specialist. In the end, I declined, because this would put 'on record' a potential 'condition' that could be used to deny me private insurance in the future. Hell, a few years ago, I THOUGHT I may be out of work, and started scouting for private insurance. I was shocked to hear from the broker that even my Hernia repair was going to be a factor (at that time, it was only a year after the surgery). He said, they typically want to see a couple of years of 'good health' following any surgery before they will cover you. No kidding!
WOW. Those are scarily low figures for 'poverty'. So - for a single person, 300% of poverty level would be 3 times 10,400 - $31,200. A single person making $31,200 per year may well choose to go without insurance if they have to pay for housing /etc out of that; at least around these parts! And a family of four - 300% of poverty level would be 3 times 21,200 - $63k. That's not a lot ... in a country where you have to take care of your own retirement, and your kids higher education ...

snowbunny

Yes - but military or national guard is almost always used in rescue situations (Coast Guard here). These twins weren't exactly in need of "rescue" like the guys on Deadliest Catch (or guys out on oil rigs etc).

I still shake my head over the absolute hypocrisy of a political movement that is "pro-life" and yet doesn't even want to pay to cover all children's healthcare.

Giantaxe

There is a two-year waiting period for eligibility for medicare coverage due to a disability.