Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
#46
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jul 2015
Location: Panama City, FL
Posts: 2,071
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
Before we sold our last house, we spent a couple of weeks repainting most of the rooms in a neutral colour. Used a paint sprayer and went through over 20 gallons of paint.
We had an extra-large dog door in the back door (for our 130lb husky). We bought a new door from Lowes and would swap them out whenever a viewing was scheduled and swap back afterwards.
We also did a de-clutter and put loads of stuff in storage. To be honest, I thought the place looked bare afterwards but it makes the place look bigger.
If ever you view a show home/model home, you won't see any interior doors. They leave them out to create the illusion of more space. They will often use under-sized furniture for the same reason.
We had an extra-large dog door in the back door (for our 130lb husky). We bought a new door from Lowes and would swap them out whenever a viewing was scheduled and swap back afterwards.
We also did a de-clutter and put loads of stuff in storage. To be honest, I thought the place looked bare afterwards but it makes the place look bigger.
If ever you view a show home/model home, you won't see any interior doors. They leave them out to create the illusion of more space. They will often use under-sized furniture for the same reason.
#47
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
Before we sold our last house, we spent a couple of weeks repainting most of the rooms in a neutral colour. Used a paint sprayer and went through over 20 gallons of paint.
We had an extra-large dog door in the back door (for our 130lb husky). We bought a new door from Lowes and would swap them out whenever a viewing was scheduled and swap back afterwards.
We also did a de-clutter and put loads of stuff in storage. To be honest, I thought the place looked bare afterwards but it makes the place look bigger.
If ever you view a show home/model home, you won't see any interior doors. They leave them out to create the illusion of more space. They will often use under-sized furniture for the same reason.
We had an extra-large dog door in the back door (for our 130lb husky). We bought a new door from Lowes and would swap them out whenever a viewing was scheduled and swap back afterwards.
We also did a de-clutter and put loads of stuff in storage. To be honest, I thought the place looked bare afterwards but it makes the place look bigger.
If ever you view a show home/model home, you won't see any interior doors. They leave them out to create the illusion of more space. They will often use under-sized furniture for the same reason.
100% agree with that
#48
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
.... More generally, what do folks think of the prices suggested by Zillow? In my opinion, Zillow is probably quite a good guide to price if your house is similar in condition and configuration (bed/bath count, etc) to other houses of similar size in the 'hood. I presume they place a lot of emphasis on price per sq. ft. in the vicinity, and make assumptions about condition. Having a unique home probably makes Zillow a lot less useful/accurate.
My house is currently showing at $1.34m on Zillow ... which is nucking futs.
My house is currently showing at $1.34m on Zillow ... which is nucking futs.
I think the values can be pretty meaningless if the area is going through a "tear-down and replace with McMansion" transformation, which I presume is what you are alluding to.
Last edited by Pulaski; Jan 19th 2017 at 9:47 pm.
#51
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
If the appliances are that bad you might consider offering an "allowance" for appliances, meaning the buyer can choose them, and you pay up to $x towards the cost.
Ditto carpet, which would be the LAST thing I would pay good money for unless it is threadbare or has been chewed by a dog, .... but a good steam clean (I have seen both good and not-so-good, and there is a huge difference - my prefered cleaner left a carpet spotless that had been declared irreversibly stained by two other steam cleaners) can work miracles for all but the most worn carpets.
If the kitchen isn't large, a granite counter can be remarkably cheap and has a huge "wow" factor. A neighbour paid $100/linear foot for granite counters, installed (owner removed the old counter), from Lowes. Mrs P has been on at me ever since to get granite counters for our kitchen!
Ditto carpet, which would be the LAST thing I would pay good money for unless it is threadbare or has been chewed by a dog, .... but a good steam clean (I have seen both good and not-so-good, and there is a huge difference - my prefered cleaner left a carpet spotless that had been declared irreversibly stained by two other steam cleaners) can work miracles for all but the most worn carpets.
If the kitchen isn't large, a granite counter can be remarkably cheap and has a huge "wow" factor. A neighbour paid $100/linear foot for granite counters, installed (owner removed the old counter), from Lowes. Mrs P has been on at me ever since to get granite counters for our kitchen!
So your alternative of carpet cleaning does sound intriguing. How does it work, in terms of dealing with hard to move stuff - can they get right up to the edge of furniture, without any impact on the furniture? We also have some heavy discoloration (darkening) at the edges of the carpet, where it meets the baseboard. My understanding is, this is caused by the fact we have forced air heating, and over the years the air has found its way through gaps between wall and floor, and the carpet acts as a filter, retaining dust, causing a dark edge over the years.
I had a big fight with the g/f over the kitchen ... she's insisting we do the kitchen before sale. It seems like we have a compromise of just doing the counter tops, and as you say, should be a big bang for the buck. We prefer quartz and Corian types, rather than Granite, but pricing is all about the same.
We're going to meet with a local realtor that we encountered at an open home, and get her input on how best to sell. We aren't in any hurry, so we can check out a few options.
Meanwhile - the smaller bathroom is getting a complete makeover; that's the worst room in the house so should end up looking good. Looks like about $8k should do it.
Last edited by Steerpike; Jan 29th 2017 at 4:33 pm.
#52
Bloody Yank
Joined: Oct 2005
Location: USA! USA!
Posts: 4,186
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
Market it without the upgrades. If that doesn't work, wait six months, upgrade it, then try again.
#53
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
Maybe you didn't see the part about 'big fight with g/f' She is not too keen on the move in the first place, so I need to keep her cooperation. This is a compromise.
#54
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
I've been thinking about carpet. While relatively cheap to purchase and install, the 'impact' for us would be large since every room would need to be emptied for the process. I am guessing the installers are pretty much used to going room-to-room, shifting/juggling contents from each room as they go (beds, cabinets, etc). We have one room with semi-custom fitted 'office' furniture (my home office - I have wall-to-wall desk space, sitting on the carpet). Getting that out could be a real challenge, probably requiring disassembly.
#55
Banned
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 22
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
You could always list the house with price including a "remodel allowance". Which would be less than half the cost you would actually spend and without the inconvenience
As far as flooring goes, its a personal preference. I see many people update with either laminate or tile in the whole house, some do it for allergy reasons. Personally my 20 year home has slightly off white 13 inch tile in a checker board style tiles and light carpet. Now apparently the style/colour is what I call nicotine yellow/brown 21 inch tiles installed at a 45 degree angle. I am reluctant to upgrade because my concrete slab foundation has cracked and the existing tiles just crack or come loose every so often.
I have tile in the kitchen bathrooms dinning room and high traffic walkways. The bedroom, family room and formal areas are all carpet. I like the combination of both because it maintains a cozy feel without feeling like you're living in a mall.
People talk about a 40-50k kitchen upgrades but for the purpose of selling then a light sanding of wood cabinets, a coat of minwax gel stain along with new counter tops with a sink for less than $10k for a 14x14 kitchen can work wonders.
The most painful part of selling a home is paying an MLS relator 6%
As far as flooring goes, its a personal preference. I see many people update with either laminate or tile in the whole house, some do it for allergy reasons. Personally my 20 year home has slightly off white 13 inch tile in a checker board style tiles and light carpet. Now apparently the style/colour is what I call nicotine yellow/brown 21 inch tiles installed at a 45 degree angle. I am reluctant to upgrade because my concrete slab foundation has cracked and the existing tiles just crack or come loose every so often.
I have tile in the kitchen bathrooms dinning room and high traffic walkways. The bedroom, family room and formal areas are all carpet. I like the combination of both because it maintains a cozy feel without feeling like you're living in a mall.
People talk about a 40-50k kitchen upgrades but for the purpose of selling then a light sanding of wood cabinets, a coat of minwax gel stain along with new counter tops with a sink for less than $10k for a 14x14 kitchen can work wonders.
The most painful part of selling a home is paying an MLS relator 6%
#56
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
I've lost track of whether this is the AZ or CA place you are talking about, but I'm kind of surprised to see you talking about fully carpeted rooms in a warm weather state -- is carpet really desirable there? Even in chilly wintered CT the first thing most people would do to a house with carpet would be rip it out and get the floors finished.
Wood floors are all the rage now but for a long time, even in hot-ass Texas, wall-to-wall carpet was the fashion. I agree though, if he's going to rip out the carpet (which I don't necessarily think he needs to do), then going back with original wood, new wood, or even laminate would be more of and update/upgrade.
#57
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
So your alternative of carpet cleaning does sound intriguing. How does it work, in terms of dealing with hard to move stuff - can they get right up to the edge of furniture, without any impact on the furniture? We also have some heavy discoloration (darkening) at the edges of the carpet, where it meets the baseboard.
You can let them know what you want (it's a good idea to come across as fussy and nitpicky --- that way they'll be less cavalier) and that it's okay with you if they don't move the desk/office, as long as they clean right up to it without damaging the wood. They might surprise you, they have ways of getting things up off the floor without actually having to be completely moved to another room. Then, stay there and hover around on the day they come to do the work --- they'll hate it, but they'll do a better job.
Remember, you're not trying to make it look like brand new carpet. You're trying to make it look like you've lovingly cared for the home overall ... basically, theater.
#58
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
I've lost track of whether this is the AZ or CA place you are talking about, but I'm kind of surprised to see you talking about fully carpeted rooms in a warm weather state -- is carpet really desirable there? Even in chilly wintered CT the first thing most people would do to a house with carpet would be rip it out and get the floors finished.
#59
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
I've been thinking about carpet. While relatively cheap to purchase and install, the 'impact' for us would be large since every room would need to be emptied for the process. I am guessing the installers are pretty much used to going room-to-room, shifting/juggling contents from each room as they go (beds, cabinets, etc). We have one room with semi-custom fitted 'office' furniture (my home office - I have wall-to-wall desk space, sitting on the carpet). Getting that out could be a real challenge, probably requiring disassembly. ....
..... So your alternative of carpet cleaning does sound intriguing. How does it work, in terms of dealing with hard to move stuff - can they get right up to the edge of furniture, without any impact on the furniture? We also have some heavy discoloration (darkening) at the edges of the carpet, where it meets the baseboard. My understanding is, this is caused by the fact we have forced air heating, and over the years the air has found its way through gaps between wall and floor, and the carpet acts as a filter, retaining dust, causing a dark edge over the years. ....
It is possible that some very old carpet may be stained beyond what steam cleaning can fix - an elderly neighbour had her pale blue carpets for 15 years and there was staining that even my "steam-cleaning wizard" couldn't fix. Older carpets are likely nylon, which can be harder to clean but wears very well, whereas newer carpet, especially the cheaper stuff, is usually polypropylene, which is more resistant to staining, but more susceptible to wear and compression damage by furniture. Incidentally, polypropylene is the same stuff that "fleece" is made from, and is also #5 recyclable plastic, so your fleece jacket or new carpet may be made from recycled yoghurt pots.
The two companies we have used have been "Steamway" franchises, perhaps not as well known as Stanley Steamer, but their equipment seems to be capable of extremely thorough cleaning.
..... I had a big fight with the g/f over the kitchen ... she's insisting we do the kitchen before sale. It seems like we have a compromise of just doing the counter tops, and as you say, should be a big bang for the buck. We prefer quartz and Corian types, rather than Granite, but pricing is all about the same. ....
The choice is very personal - some people prefer one over another, and just like hardwood flooring v laminate there are people who want one and not the other (personally I think most laminate is junk, and would only install it where solid hardwood cannot be installed, and these days on a concrete slab floor, I think I would install a faux-wood tile rather than laminate). My impression is that granite is seen as more fancy, but some people seem to think it needs "maintenance" but our neighbours have granite, and in four years have done nothing by way of "resealing", and IMO still looks as good as new. .... Try asking your realtor if they think "granite", as opposed to other counters, would be a selling point.
.... We're going to meet with a local realtor that we encountered at an open home, and get her input on how best to sell. We aren't in any hurry, so we can check out a few options.
Meanwhile - the smaller bathroom is getting a complete makeover; that's the worst room in the house so should end up looking good. Looks like about $8k should do it.
Meanwhile - the smaller bathroom is getting a complete makeover; that's the worst room in the house so should end up looking good. Looks like about $8k should do it.
Last edited by Pulaski; Jan 30th 2017 at 1:10 pm.
#60
Re: Selling a home - update kitchen first or not?
Here are pics of the darkening of the carpet at the edges. It took me ages to figure this out - some folks suggested it was mold, but this house just doesn't have any opportunity for mold. I'm strongly of the opinion it is just filtered dust, caused by the positive pressure created by the forced air heat/cooling system, and the presence of small air-gaps between walls and floor. This is confirmed, to me, by the presence of the same darkening along the bottom of one particular door that leads to a crawl-space under the house - there's always a bit of an air current felt at that gap.
She's a very smart lady but when it comes to things like this, she is just very stubborn and insists that the house will sell easier/better with it done. The argument about relative rate of return just doesn't seem to register with her. She's an avid viewer of House Hunters, and she also listens to those realtors who what a 'clean sale'. When I told her 'my realtor' (who's also a contractor) said don't do it, she said that's because he has no clue . For better or worse, I ain't gonna win. I don't actually mind spending $10k to get a $9k return, as long as she agrees to the actual sale, compared to her stonewalling the entire sale activity - I need her cooperation in getting the place ready (as in, cleaned up, with us out of the way ... we both work from home, we are both messy, and our furniture isn't exactly fancy, so reality suggests we simply need to get out, stay out, and stash a whole lot of our stuff in storage).
She's a very smart lady but when it comes to things like this, she is just very stubborn and insists that the house will sell easier/better with it done. The argument about relative rate of return just doesn't seem to register with her. She's an avid viewer of House Hunters, and she also listens to those realtors who what a 'clean sale'. When I told her 'my realtor' (who's also a contractor) said don't do it, she said that's because he has no clue . For better or worse, I ain't gonna win. I don't actually mind spending $10k to get a $9k return, as long as she agrees to the actual sale, compared to her stonewalling the entire sale activity - I need her cooperation in getting the place ready (as in, cleaned up, with us out of the way ... we both work from home, we are both messy, and our furniture isn't exactly fancy, so reality suggests we simply need to get out, stay out, and stash a whole lot of our stuff in storage).