California - departures and arrivals
#17
Re: California - departures and arrivals
I believe you are correct - I was remembering the demographics incorrectly. According to this very detailed site - https://www.janepoppelreiterrealesta...-demographics/ - second chart - we had 42% white, 34% Asian as of 2014, and this page - https://www.sfchronicle.com/projects...an-population/ - suggests that has changed to being 37% White, 34% Asian by 2020. So it's still very slightly majority white - by 3%.
I think what I was remembering was that whites are less than 50% (that is - San Francisco is majority non-white), which is pretty unsual for US cities.
Edit to add - Santa Clara County in the Bay Area (the center of 'Silicon Valley') is now majority Asian - https://www.sanjoseinside.com/news/a...ensus-reports/ - "In Santa Clara County, people who identify as Asian are now the largest racial group or ethnic group for the first time, representing 38.9% of the county’s 2020 population of 1,936,239, according to census numbers released today." - https://www.sanjoseinside.com/news/a...ensus-reports/ (whites represent 28.7%).
I think what I was remembering was that whites are less than 50% (that is - San Francisco is majority non-white), which is pretty unsual for US cities.
Edit to add - Santa Clara County in the Bay Area (the center of 'Silicon Valley') is now majority Asian - https://www.sanjoseinside.com/news/a...ensus-reports/ - "In Santa Clara County, people who identify as Asian are now the largest racial group or ethnic group for the first time, representing 38.9% of the county’s 2020 population of 1,936,239, according to census numbers released today." - https://www.sanjoseinside.com/news/a...ensus-reports/ (whites represent 28.7%).
Last edited by Steerpike; May 24th 2022 at 5:40 am.
#18
Forum Regular
Joined: Jul 2018
Location: California
Posts: 254
Re: California - departures and arrivals
#19
Re: California - departures and arrivals
Yeah exactly. The US used to be like Germany, or Central Europe in general - a high proportion of people lived in cramped conditions in city apartment buildings. In England, the development of expansive suburbs, garden cities etc., started in the late nineteenth century and was very well developed by the 1930s. In the USA, the same thing didn’t really get going till after WWII. I know when I first visited America, early 1970s, I was amazed what cramped, tiny apartments all my wife’s family lived in - and thought was completely normal. (I was a child of the pre-war, expansive London suburbs.) I think the US, including California, has to some extent caught up with the UK in this regard. This is what we see in the inexorable residential development all over the US.
My first rental in the US (in SF) was a cavernous 1,500 sq ft 2 bed, 2 bath apartment built in 1932. My first condo (also in San Francisco) was a spacious 1,400 sq ft place with only 2 bedrooms, built in 1925.
I was so surprised by this contrast, when I was back there in 2019 my brother and I measured the rooms to double-check, as it seemed so wrong!
#20
Heading for Poppyland
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: North Norfolk and northern New York State
Posts: 14,544
Re: California - departures and arrivals
This may be a 'west coast' thing, but my observation is that houses are much bigger in the US than UK. My brother raised a family of 4 (2 parents, 2 kids) in a house that was only 1,000 sq ft., and that was a very typical post-war 'housing estate' type of place - detached home with 4 bedrooms upstairs (only 1 bathroom for everyone upstairs, no 'en-suite', tiny toilet downstairs 'under the stairs', "4th bedroom" only big enough for a desk).
My first rental in the US (in SF) was a cavernous 1,500 sq ft 2 bed, 2 bath apartment built in 1932. My first condo (also in San Francisco) was a spacious 1,400 sq ft place with only 2 bedrooms, built in 1925.
I was so surprised by this contrast, when I was back there in 2019 my brother and I measured the rooms to double-check, as it seemed so wrong!
My first rental in the US (in SF) was a cavernous 1,500 sq ft 2 bed, 2 bath apartment built in 1932. My first condo (also in San Francisco) was a spacious 1,400 sq ft place with only 2 bedrooms, built in 1925.
I was so surprised by this contrast, when I was back there in 2019 my brother and I measured the rooms to double-check, as it seemed so wrong!
#21
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 12,865
Re: California - departures and arrivals
So the state's growth has been sustained by international immigration, which makes sense - I am one of them.
The reason I enjoy living in the Bay Area is precisely because it is not full of typical 'Americans'. San Francisco has been majority Asian for as long as I can remember, which suits me fine - we have some of the very best Asian food (Thai, Chinese, Vietnamese, Japanese, etc) and my girlfriend is also an Asian immigrant, and she feels very comfortable here.
So it's true that people are leaving the state, but the perception that they are jumping from a sinking ship is rather odd; they simply can't afford to stay. The skyrocketing real-estate prices would not be happening if the state were 'undesirable'.
The reason I enjoy living in the Bay Area is precisely because it is not full of typical 'Americans'. San Francisco has been majority Asian for as long as I can remember, which suits me fine - we have some of the very best Asian food (Thai, Chinese, Vietnamese, Japanese, etc) and my girlfriend is also an Asian immigrant, and she feels very comfortable here.
So it's true that people are leaving the state, but the perception that they are jumping from a sinking ship is rather odd; they simply can't afford to stay. The skyrocketing real-estate prices would not be happening if the state were 'undesirable'.
Personally, I'm quite happy to see an end of the crazy growth there's been in the 30+ years I've been in California. The US West is in a historic drought and that causes two huge problems. Firstly, supplying water to 40m people. Secondly, the wildfire situation which is only going to get worse. I just spent a week hiking in the Sierra Nevada. Quite wonderful, but there are so many burn areas that I doubt will recover and so many dead or dying trees that are fuel for further catastrophic fires. This is actually the one thing that would make me leave the American West. Well, aside from things like crazy gun violence and access to healthcare... but those things make me question whether the US is where I want to live in general and are for a different thread anyway...
#22
Re: California - departures and arrivals
There's a general perception out there that people are leaving California in droves. Based on everything I'm seeing (as a resident) in terms of real-estate sales and housing starts, it seems inconceivable that there is a net loss of people.
I just read this post - Moving from UK to LA - should we go for it? in which it was said: "...Why are twice as many native born Californians fleeing the place as incoming replacement population? When my cousin moved from California to Florida last year, She had to fly to Dallas Texas to rent a moving truck and drive it to Southern California. There are almost none available to rent."
Maybe 'native born' Californians are leaving, but 'others' are certainly coming in to replace them, and whoever they are, they have money - lots of money. As a resident of the Bay Area, I can tell you that house prices are soaring, and apartment/condo buildings are being constructed at an amazing rate; it seems like every former gas station or parking lot is now a medium-rise building selling million-dollar units...
I just read this post - Moving from UK to LA - should we go for it? in which it was said: "...Why are twice as many native born Californians fleeing the place as incoming replacement population? When my cousin moved from California to Florida last year, She had to fly to Dallas Texas to rent a moving truck and drive it to Southern California. There are almost none available to rent."
Maybe 'native born' Californians are leaving, but 'others' are certainly coming in to replace them, and whoever they are, they have money - lots of money. As a resident of the Bay Area, I can tell you that house prices are soaring, and apartment/condo buildings are being constructed at an amazing rate; it seems like every former gas station or parking lot is now a medium-rise building selling million-dollar units...
On the flip side, a lot of people are also simply chasing in and capitalizing on their amazing Californian investment (house), I've watched a few neighbors put their houses on the market with a "retirement" number on it. Eighteen months ago I would have scoffed a little and rolled my eyes. None of these houses dropped in price and the numbers they are getting are absolutely astronomical. These folks are simply moving to cheaper area, they will quit their jobs, buy a place and enjoy a long retirement on a mountain of California cash.
#23
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 10,009
Re: California - departures and arrivals
I believe you are correct - I was remembering the demographics incorrectly. According to this very detailed site - https://www.janepoppelreiterrealesta...-demographics/ - second chart - we had 42% white, 34% Asian as of 2014, and this page - https://www.sfchronicle.com/projects...an-population/ - suggests that has changed to being 37% White, 34% Asian by 2020. So it's still very slightly majority white - by 3%.
I think what I was remembering was that whites are less than 50% (that is - San Francisco is majority non-white), which is pretty unsual for US cities.
Edit to add - Santa Clara County in the Bay Area (the center of 'Silicon Valley') is now majority Asian - https://www.sanjoseinside.com/news/a...ensus-reports/ - "In Santa Clara County, people who identify as Asian are now the largest racial group or ethnic group for the first time, representing 38.9% of the county’s 2020 population of 1,936,239, according to census numbers released today." - https://www.sanjoseinside.com/news/a...ensus-reports/ (whites represent 28.7%).
I think what I was remembering was that whites are less than 50% (that is - San Francisco is majority non-white), which is pretty unsual for US cities.
Edit to add - Santa Clara County in the Bay Area (the center of 'Silicon Valley') is now majority Asian - https://www.sanjoseinside.com/news/a...ensus-reports/ - "In Santa Clara County, people who identify as Asian are now the largest racial group or ethnic group for the first time, representing 38.9% of the county’s 2020 population of 1,936,239, according to census numbers released today." - https://www.sanjoseinside.com/news/a...ensus-reports/ (whites represent 28.7%).
#24
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 12,865
Re: California - departures and arrivals
Purportedly a much larger undercount is of Hispanics.
#25
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 10,009