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-   -   Post EU Referendum (https://britishexpats.com/forum/take-outside-67/post-eu-referendum-879308/)

Dick Dasterdly Mar 19th 2017 11:13 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by EMR (Post 12208401)
British veg will rot in the fields before those who claim they were put out of jobs will get off their arises to pick them in the depths of winter or the rain of a

Usual Bollox

No way will Uk Farmers leave their produce to rot in the fields as long as it's humanly possible to save it.

:cool:

lgm1963 Mar 19th 2017 11:24 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by EMR (Post 12208401)
British veg will rot in the fields before those who claim they were put out of jobs will get off their arises to pick them in the depths of winter or the rain of a

Really?

Even if that were true, it would be cheaper to import veg than import labour. Farmers would be forced to pay a decent wage or grow something they could make money from.

Either way is better than now.

Garbatellamike Mar 19th 2017 11:57 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
Hmm - I see EMR's second brain cell didn't stick around for long......

#How does one get off one's arise as it must be jolly difficult :sneaky:

DaveLovesDee Mar 20th 2017 12:40 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by lgm1963 (Post 12208388)
Paying local agriculture workers a proper working wage instead of importing low skill low pay foreign workers? What's not to like?

VERY happy to pay the going rate for carrots if it means that local people go to work instead of collecting welfare as well as not paying extra welfare to support extra imported cheap labour.


Originally Posted by lgm1963 (Post 12208410)
Even if that were true, it would be cheaper to import veg than import labour. Farmers would be forced to pay a decent wage or grow something they could make money from.

The price of veg in the main supermarket chains (and their purchase price from the farmers) tends to be set by the supermarket chains themselves. If Tesco says to a UK farm 'we'll give you 20p a lettuce for 200,000', that's going to be cheaper to transport to Tesco's distribution centres than 200,000 from Spain. Especially if the Spanish farmers tell Tesco they want a higher price than Tesco want to pay, which is partly the reason for the veg shortages earlier this year.

Remember as well, we're leaving the EU, so costs of imports are likely to rise.

Regarding 'imported labour'. Fruit and veg pickers from other EU countries are used to moving around different areas as the crop seasons change, used to living in bunkhouses or temporary accommodation, and used to working long hours in rain or the heat. Most unemployed Brits aren't.

Foreign agricultural workers also have lots of experience in the picking and packaging of the products, which unemployed Brits would need to learn fast.

As for being low-paid, they're usually paid minimum wage. As would any Brits who replaced the foreign workers. You may be prepared to pay more to give the workers higher wages, but not everyone else is. Many pensioners can barely afford both heating and food these days, they have to choose one or the other. They can't afford to pay more.

EMR Mar 20th 2017 4:10 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Garbatellamike (Post 12208420)
Hmm - I see EMR's second brain cell didn't stick around for long......

#How does one get off one's arise as it must be jolly difficult :sneaky:

Which of the telly tubbies are you.

GeniB Mar 20th 2017 8:22 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Dick Dasterdly (Post 12208406)
Usual Bollox

No way will Uk Farmers leave their produce to rot in the fields as long as it's humanly possible to save it.

:cool:

Well Dick what a surprise.. Ill informed again!!!:o

You obviously didn't watch 'Country File' and it's extensive interviews with soft fruit farmers .Tomato Farmers etc.They were seriously concerned about the Governments lack of action re-immigrant seasonal workers. They claimed in fact that the crops WOULD rot in the fields if the government didn't at least have a temporary visa in place by this summer.

The governments response was to say there would be NO action this year and possible next year.
The farmers already had a 25% decrease in applications for jobs. The immigrants from the EU form over 75% of their workers. Now it doesn't take a maths genius to see where this is going.
These farmers have invested millions in to high tech machinery to do a lot of the work.but as they said repeatedly.'You can only go so far with a machine . it takes a human brain to decide if a piece of fruit is ripe or rotten. And um.. NO there are no queues of local UK workers willing to do this back breaking tedious work. Does the government either understand Industry,or give a rats a**e about it..You decide Dick.

Red Eric Mar 20th 2017 9:02 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by lgm1963 (Post 12208410)
Even if that were true, it would be cheaper to import veg than import labour. Farmers would be forced to pay a decent wage or grow something they could make money from.

Either way is better than now.

Would it be worth pointing out to you that the more the UK imports, the worse its already dire trade deficit gets?

Any sector which is currently able to function within the UK and would be shrunk or lost as a result of anything to do with Brexit will represent a potential drop in GDP, which would affect all sorts of things including the country's creditworthiness and the cost of borrowing.

I wouldn't be too glib about thinking it's quite so easy or free of consequences for the UK to get its hands on everything it needs from elsewhere. If money is to circulate in the UK, it has to produce stuff both for its own and for external consumers and if the outflow of money isn't at least matched by the inflow, you've got a serious problem.

A few carrots is just the tip of the iceberg.

amideislas Mar 20th 2017 9:20 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
UK GDP by sector
  • Agriculture: 0.6%
  • Construction: 6.4%
  • Production: 14.6%
  • Services: 78.4%
Clearly, agriculture isn't amongst Britain's largest industries.

Red Eric Mar 20th 2017 9:33 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
Clearly, whingeing about foreign agricultural workers, real or imagined, is one of Brexiters' biggest pastimes though.

Bipat Mar 20th 2017 9:40 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12208549)
Clearly, whingeing about foreign agricultural workers, real or imagined, is one of Brexiters' biggest pastimes though.

How do you know that?
Foreign 'agricultural workers' were coming to the UK long before the EEC!!

Lion in Winter Mar 20th 2017 9:47 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by lgm1963 (Post 12208388)
Yup

Bring it on.

Paying local agriculture workers a proper working wage instead of importing low skill low pay foreign workers? What's not to like?

VERY happy to pay the going rate for carrots if it means that local people go to work instead of collecting welfare as well as not paying extra welfare to support extra imported cheap labour.

win win.

Well that might be very nice if it were true. But it doesn't appear to be. These "local agricultural workers" don't exactly appear to be lining up for work. It's a lovely simple idea that British workers are being pushed aside by cheap foreign labour, but it seems that it's a too simple idea.

Red Eric Mar 20th 2017 10:36 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12208552)
How do you know that?
Foreign 'agricultural workers' were coming to the UK long before the EEC!!

It's OK Bipat, you'll be able to relax shortly.

Once they're called "seasonal agricultural workers" and there's no longer any danger whatsoever of them being confounded with immigrants it'll all be all right again.

DaveLovesDee Mar 20th 2017 11:13 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Bipat (Post 12208552)
How do you know that?
Foreign 'agricultural workers' were coming to the UK long before the EEC!!

Yes they were.

But farming has changed greatly since then.

Who picked British fruit and veg before migrant workers?

Bipat Mar 20th 2017 11:38 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12208566)
It's OK Bipat, you'll be able to relax shortly.

Once they're called "seasonal agricultural workers" and there's no longer any danger whatsoever of them being confounded with immigrants it'll all be all right again.

Obviously seasonal workers never were thought of as the same as those coming to the UK to settle long term.
Seasonal workers will come from nearby countries for ease of travel, EU migrants intending to settle and non-EU migrants coming from half way across the world will not come with the aim of seasonal work (even if opportunities don't turn out the way they hoped!).

Bipat Mar 20th 2017 11:44 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee (Post 12208586)
Yes they were.

But farming has changed greatly since then.

Who picked British fruit and veg before migrant workers?

Aware of that---my origins in Norfolk-- potato/ beet picking yearly activities before the war for country people.
Seem to remember farming relatives/friends complaining about not being able to get workers long before the present controversies. They seemed to grudge decent pay, and accommodation!


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