British Expats

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-   -   Post EU Referendum (https://britishexpats.com/forum/take-outside-67/post-eu-referendum-879308/)

DaveLovesDee May 27th 2018 9:48 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12505876)
I don't consider the Daily Mail to be any more of a reputable news source than the Daily Sport.

A few weeks ago, a serial killer and multiple rapist from the 70's and 80's was arrested near Sacramento and it turned out he was a former police officer. Obviously this is big news in California atm and the DM make a lot of money from their US arm these days. They printed an article about the case a couple of days ago that they claimed included exclusive photos and evidence but in reality the whole article was fabricated. The pictures were 40 years old and had been in the public domain for decades.

And I'm sure that's the case at many print media sources in the UK. And at Fox (aka Faux) News in the US. I find at every news source, there are journalists whose stories are better researched than others. Those writers are the ones I tend to follow instead of the papers themselves.

DaveLovesDee May 27th 2018 9:58 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12505876)
I don't consider the Daily Mail to be any more of a reputable news source than the Daily Sport.

A few weeks ago, a serial killer and multiple rapist from the 70's and 80's was arrested near Sacramento and it turned out he was a former police officer. Obviously this is big news in California atm and the DM make a lot of money from their US arm these days. They printed an article about the case a couple of days ago that they claimed included exclusive photos and evidence but in reality the whole article was fabricated. The pictures were 40 years old and had been in the public domain for decades.

Just come back to this after reading the DM stories. The whole article was fabricated, you say.

In this instance, they're factually correct that a former Police Officer was arrested as a suspect in this crimes, and legally correct in that though some of the crime scene photos are from the 70's and 80's, I can't find any instances of them being published in the UK media before the DM. Unfortunately, exclusive in the UK media tends to mean a UK exclusive, not worldwide.

So nothing in the article was fabricated.

DigitalGhost May 27th 2018 10:08 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee (Post 12505912)
Just come back to this after reading the DM stories. The whole article was fabricated, you say.

In this instance, they're factually correct that a former Police Officer was arrested as a suspect in this crimes, and legally correct in that though some of the crime scene photos are from the 70's and 80's, I can't find any instances of them being published in the UK media before the DM. Unfortunately, exclusive in the UK media tends to mean a UK exclusive, not worldwide.

So nothing in the article was fabricated.

The pictures in the article they imply are from Joe DeAngelo's bedroom are actually from one of the crime scenes.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-trophies.html

I definitely respect your open mindedness regarding the Daily Mail though. Are there any good DM columnists that you would recommend?

DigitalGhost May 27th 2018 10:21 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
On a slightly more on topic note, although I'd happily discuss the EARONS case on here further if someone wants to start a thread, I watched this last night.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episod...scaping-europe

If it's to be believed then Syrian refugees are leaving Germany in spades and returning to the middle east due to feelings of isolation and racial prejudice as well as difficulties in sponsoring family members to join them. They've also been selling their German ID papers on the black market to fund their path back to Turkey and Syria.

It would be interesting to know proportionally how many asylum claimants voluntarily return home so soon after arrival in the UK. If the UK is as world-renowned for being a racist and bigoted a country as some members on here suggest, then I'd expect the numbers to be higher or question why many of them even went to the trouble of travelling to the UK in the first place. It isn't exactly easy to reach the UK as a clandestine after all.

DigitalGhost May 27th 2018 10:21 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
On a slightly more on topic note, although I'd happily discuss the EARONS case on here further if someone wants to start a thread, I watched this last night.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episod...scaping-europe

If it's to be believed then Syrian refugees are leaving Germany in spades and returning to the middle east due to feelings of isolation and racial prejudice as well as difficulties in sponsoring family members to join them. They've also been selling their German ID papers on the black market to fund their path back to Turkey and Syria.

It would be interesting to know proportionally how many asylum claimants voluntarily return home so soon after arrival in the UK. If the UK is as world-renowned for being a racist and bigoted a country as some members on here suggest, then I'd expect the numbers to be higher or question why many of them even went to the trouble of travelling to the UK in the first place. It isn't exactly easy to reach the UK as a clandestine after all.

Annetje May 27th 2018 11:20 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12505917)
On a slightly more on topic note, although I'd happily discuss the EARONS case on here further if someone wants to start a thread, I watched this last night.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episod...scaping-europe

If it's to be believed then Syrian refugees are leaving Germany in spades and returning to the middle east due to feelings of isolation and racial prejudice as well as difficulties in sponsoring family members to join them. They've also been selling their German ID papers on the black market to fund their path back to Turkey and Syria.

It would be interesting to know proportionally how many asylum claimants voluntarily return home so soon after arrival in the UK. If the UK is as world-renowned for being a racist and bigoted a country as some members on here suggest, then I'd expect the numbers to be higher or question why many of them even went to the trouble of travelling to the UK in the first place. It isn't exactly easy to reach the UK as a clandestine after all.

You mean comparing the 600.000 Syrian refugees in Germany to the 9.500 in the UK ? Numbers might have changed a bit because these figures are from 2016 ... (Wikipedia)

.

007Steve May 27th 2018 11:26 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12505828)
In answer to your points, FoM is the only one I have a serious problem with. There are some other aspects of the EU that I don't particularly like such as the EWA for example but they pale in comparison.
I probably would have voted to remain if the UK had an option to fully withdraw from FoM and the EEA permit system. I see no reason not to try to get on with your neighbours and I think the customs union is a great idea. It's just the immigration implications of the EU that I really can't stand.

The four freedoms (goods, capital, services, and labour) aren't an a la carte menu, nor were they picked out in a Woolworth's pik&mix DG. They were and are defined on the foundations of economic reality - i.e. what any of us encounter in our daily lives.
Since you say FOM is the one you have a problem with, the Secessionists' dogma you support about forming new trade deals post 2019 while allowing restricted FOM is patently flawed; - in or out of the EU. Markets for any of the first three pillars only exist & operate by the actions of the fourth. Markets are made and serve people not the other way round.
What you're rather hoping in a :sneaky: argument is that by having restrictions on movement free markets can operate - they can't and won't. What will operate in the UK post 2019 are restrictive markets, controlled by large combines and policed by an elite on the basis of price for access. That basis (even if it could work which it can't) is also the primary symptom of the disease & reason why the UK is in its present state - short termism. According to your view it's about numbers & calibres for FOM - so many NHS staff & waiters one year, and IT experts and strawberry pickers the next. Nothing more than the maximum term of any politico's party and hang the future. You epitomise that argument when you state that 'It's just the immigration implications of the EU that I really can't stand'.
Free markets or restrictive/ controlled markets; - which is it DG?

DigitalGhost May 27th 2018 11:27 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Annetje (Post 12505937)
You mean comparing the 600.000 Syrian refugees in Germany to the 9.500 in the UK ? Numbers might have changed a bit because these figures are from 2016 ... (Wikipedia)

.

Hence my use of the term proportional.

EMR May 27th 2018 11:29 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12505917)
On a slightly more on topic note, although I'd happily discuss the EARONS case on here further if someone wants to start a thread, I watched this last night.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episod...scaping-europe

If it's to be believed then Syrian refugees are leaving Germany in spades and returning to the middle east due to feelings of isolation and racial prejudice as well as difficulties in sponsoring family members to join them. They've also been selling their German ID papers on the black market to fund their path back to Turkey and Syria.

It would be interesting to know proportionally how many asylum claimants voluntarily return home so soon after arrival in the UK. If the UK is as world-renowned for being a racist and bigoted a country as some members on here suggest, then I'd expect the numbers to be higher or question why many of them even went to the trouble of travelling to the UK in the first place. It isn't exactly easy to reach the UK as a clandestine after all.


Originally Posted by Annetje (Post 12505937)
You mean comparing the 600.000 Syrian refugees in Germany to the 9.500 in the UK ? Numbers might have changed a bit because these figures are from 2016 ... (Wikipedia)

.


Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12505918)
On a slightly more on topic note, although I'd happily discuss the EARONS case on here further if someone wants to start a thread, I watched this last night.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episod...scaping-europe

If it's to be believed then Syrian refugees are leaving Germany in spades and returning to the middle east due to feelings of isolation and racial prejudice as well as difficulties in sponsoring family members to join them. They've also been selling their German ID papers on the black market to fund their path back to Turkey and Syria.

It would be interesting to know proportionally how many asylum claimants voluntarily return home so soon after arrival in the UK. If the UK is as world-renowned for being a racist and bigoted a country as some members on here suggest, then I'd expect the numbers to be higher or question why many of them even went to the trouble of travelling to the UK in the first place. It isn't exactly easy to reach the UK as a clandestine after all.

By their very definition asylum seekers would only return home when their reason for claiming asylum no longer existed which could be years ..
I am sure that many returned to Iraq or Afghanistan after regime change, Myanmar, Zimbabwe and other countries where semblance of democracy returned.
We will never know the numbers as records are probably not kept.

If the UK did not have a problem with with racism and bigotry why do we have SO many laws to combat them as events this week prove.

Annetje May 27th 2018 11:30 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12505940)
Hence my use of the term proportional.

Why don't you start a thread ''All about refugees'' ? It's got nothing to do with Brexit or even post EU referendum !

Red Eric May 27th 2018 11:32 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12505828)
There are some other aspects of the EU that I don't particularly like such as the EWA for example but they pale in comparison.

The European Waterproofing Association? EWA Europe - Home
The European Women's AudioVisual Network? EWA - european women's audiovisual network
The European Water Association? Home - EWA
The European Waterparks Association? EWA - European Waterpark Association e.V.
The European Welding Association? EWA - European Welding Association

DigitalGhost May 27th 2018 12:03 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Annetje (Post 12505944)
Why don't you start a thread ''All about refugees'' ? It's got nothing to do with Brexit or even post EU referendum !

Ah in other words, I was right then. I thought that might be the case.

Incidentally if this has nothing to do with Brexit then neither do the accusations of rampant xenophobia and racism that have frequently been made towards the UK by some members in this thread.

DigitalGhost May 27th 2018 12:04 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12505945)
The European Waterproofing Association? EWA Europe - Home
The European Women's AudioVisual Network? EWA - european women's audiovisual network
The European Water Association? Home - EWA
The European Waterparks Association? EWA - European Waterpark Association e.V.
The European Welding Association? EWA - European Welding Association

Shit, sorry I meant EAW. Well spotted though. :lol:

DigitalGhost May 27th 2018 12:07 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by EMR (Post 12505943)
By their very definition asylum seekers would only return home when their reason for claiming asylum no longer existed which could be years ..
I am sure that many returned to Iraq or Afghanistan after regime change, Myanmar, Zimbabwe and other countries where semblance of democracy returned.
We will never know the numbers as records are probably not kept.

If the UK did not have a problem with with racism and bigotry why do we have SO many laws to combat them as events this week prove.

But that video proves they're not. The situation in Syria is still ongoing so we're told but those people are taking a backdoor path home by choice. The numbers in the UK should be fairly easy to monitor based on residence visas that weren't renewed and flight records etc.

And pretty much every country has laws against racial prejudice these days. The UK is no exception there. In fact it could be argued more strongly that the UK was a racist country if we didn't have laws against that sort of thing.

Annetje May 27th 2018 12:13 pm

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost (Post 12505955)
Ah in other words, I was right then. I thought that might be the case.

Incidentally if this has nothing to do with Brexit then neither do the accusations of rampant xenophobia and racism that have frequently been made towards the UK by some members in this thread.

It means, I'm not bothered. If you're that interested, find the answer yourself !


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