Re: Post EU Referendum
 

I'm not suggesting that you did mean that.

It's quite possible to 'apply oneself diligently' - especially on something that one is highly interested in or even passionate about. This may not however translate into a decent work ethic or a sense of personal responsibility. Someone that has enough pride to be diligent in a boring often low paid job is the best definition in my book - especially when there's an easier option.

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

From the occasional periods I spent out of gainful employment - which were mercifully brief, although they didn't seem so at the time - I would say it a great deal less of an easier option relying on welfare than being in the happy position of being supplied with a job and a salary.

And I'd say that governments have done a great deal since then to make it less likely that people are idling about and not trying to find work if they're able.

One has to take account of the fact that not everybody has an equal capacity to cope with their various misfortunes, though, as well as the fact that not all work is suitable for all the possible candidates or suitably within their reach.

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

All true but I would add the caveat that work not suitably within reach for a UK citizen is patently not suitably within reach of a Latvian. Or Hungarian. For example.

If the excuse for not working and staying on welfare is distance to work of course :)

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Which is where we differ, since work that is generally contracted to gangs, for example, is done so for various reasons, including that it is not permanent or reliable or well-paid and therefore not necessarily suitable for someone wishing to maintain a base or a stable home and a family life if they have to up sticks to go and work in 3 different counties in as many months.

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

There's another place we differ.

My background is civil engineering, necessitating travel all over the uk to build bridges and roads, usually for set periods of 6 months to two years.

Should I have sat at home and waited for the government of the day to find me a job within a mile of my house and secure for life?

I think I might still be waiting for that.

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

I agree not just about the money, but at some point if wages high enough UK workers will be found- or if not, then perhaps better the economic is re-focused on higher growth productive sectors, and pay people to get trained.

I agree with you many don't want to start at the bottom.

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Clearly not, if the work you did was sufficiently well-paid to compensate, in your opinion, for the inconvenience of being away from your permanent home so much.

Not all work is, though and nor, in my opinion, should we expect everybody to accept a life permanently on the move.

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Well that's all fine and dandy.

But if someone chooses NOT to work I reserve the right to object to paying them to sit on their arse.

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

I do think any one who has employed people, in different countries and over sufficient length of time, will notice a difference in the work ethic-on average-, between and within countries, cultures and people, and age groups.

But I think you are spot on, using that to blame people doesn't serve any purpose and doesn't help solve the problem, and often used to "justify callous indifference" as you write. The idea of cutting benefits will make someone with a poor work ethic suddenly develop a new work ethic I am not sure can be substantiated for all or even most who suffer such benefit cuts.( perhaps some study shows it can be. In USA there were welfare cutbacks in the 1990's from Clinton and Gingrich working together- I don't see any evidence that addressed the "work ethic" issue. Just saved a few dollars).

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

One can't really tell, by looking at someone who's sitting on their arse, whether they're doing so through choice or for some other reason.

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

I have the same emotional feeling, but what is alternative ?

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

I was only going by your hypothetical scenario of there being people who are reluctant to actually travel away from home to work.

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Meanwhile...

Carney can't win - Bloomberg

Sterling then extended its losses as Carney said tighter monetary policy would depend on the “smooth” Brexit that his institution is predicting. That was a signal that investors don’t share his optimism for the U.K.’s withdrawal, and thus the path for rates.

“The BOE are basing their forecasts on a smooth Brexit process,” said John Wraith, head of U.K. macro rates and strategy at UBS. “If that happens, their optimistic view on growth might prove accurate and they will indeed need to tighten faster than the curve implies. The problem here is we don’t think at all that Brexit will be so smooth.”

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

That was your hypothetical scenario. Mine was a little more nuanced ;)

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Street party for you tonight then. Better still delay it 'til tomorrow when you celebrate the UK coming bottom in Eurovision.