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Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Old Oct 20th 2018, 4:02 pm
  #1621  
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Steerpike View Post
Taking a step back a little, I spent time with my niece in UK when I was back there this month. She's an economics grad, and seems to be fairly smart (hard to be objective when family is concerned). While several Brexiters I've met are clearly bigots, I was surprised to hear she voted for Brexit, and proceeded to explain why. The essence of what she told me was that the EU is fundamentally flawed due to the way the economy is managed and controlled, something that was a problem from the start but greatly exacerbated by the inclusion of 'poorer' countries such as Greece.

Not being an economics nerd, I didn't understand all she said but I did do a fair amount of reading about the subject and I think I can see the problem. In my wanderings, I came across this article which seems to explain what my niece was saying. To extract key components:


The full article is here: https://qz.com/721089/the-case-for-brexit/

I have no opinion on the quality of the site in general (never seen it before), but I felt this article was pretty level-headed. Do those who chose 'remain' agree with this analysis?
I'm remain and largely agree with the analysis. There are certainly arguments to be made in relation to how best to structure monetary and fiscal Europe. Greece was a test case, at the time I thought a two speed Eurocurrency made sense, but have been frankly surprised at the austerity imposed and borne by Greece. The fact that it remains in the EU underscores the will of Europeans to try to make it work.

I wonder what your economics grad niece thinks on the trade prospects for Britain outside the EU. Apart from some highly vocal quacks, the economic consensus is that trade and FDI will suffer and the UK will be unable to substitute sufficient new global trade for lost European trade. It's not Doomsday, we will still have significant trade with Europe and have some new global opportunities, but the expectation is less not more.
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Old Oct 20th 2018, 4:15 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc



Couldn't put it any better. A mere 670,000 people say so. Anyone in Tory HQ listening???
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Old Oct 20th 2018, 4:41 pm
  #1623  
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by 007Steve View Post


Couldn't put it any better. A mere 670,000 people say so. Anyone in Tory HQ listening???
The quiet majority are stepping up. Will have to join in next time.
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Old Oct 20th 2018, 8:08 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
The quiet majority are stepping up. Will have to join in next time.
... Would be worth a flight back Shard.
As most remainers are young to late middle-age there won't be zimmer frames or walking sticks tp trip over like the other lot.
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Old Oct 20th 2018, 8:36 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

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Old Oct 20th 2018, 8:44 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by DigitalGhost View Post
Varoufakis didn't exactly work wonders for the Greek economy during his short tenure in power. His macro-ecomomics theories didn't even pan out back when he worked at Valve as I recall.

He's an entertaining and likable guy but shouldn't really be lecturing the British establishment on anything.
You're funny when you try to use long words - you get all self-contradictory.

I expect he'd be the first to agree with you, though. For starters, he's probably got quite a full diary (although I'm sure he'd do his best to squeeze them in if the invite were thrust upon him).

Aside from that, though, by the account of you ardent Brexiters, the establishment is all pro remain, so he'd be preaching to the converted. I'm sure he's got far better things to do with his time than that.

Anyway, enough of that - I was merely pointing out a flip side to the coin, since we'd had "how rotten the euro currency is for some member states" and "how the EU is totally unreasonable when it comes to negotiating, signed Y. Varoufakis" on the thread. All I was saying is that despite that, the predominant feeling in the EU, even by those states that have borne the very worst of the brunt of things (and even by those who have seen things close up and had it impressed upon them in no uncertain terms how uncompromising the EU can be), is that both the euro currency and the EU are well worth sticking with, at least for now.

I wouldn't expect you to post a positive appraisal of Varoufakis, occasional darling of the Eurosceptics though he is but I expect you're probably one of those I referred to above, who would fully approve of and subscribe to exactly the sort of economic dogma promoted within the EU when it comes to the UK's finances
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Old Oct 21st 2018, 10:20 am
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Amanda Patel predicting Tory leadership challenge this week.
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Old Oct 21st 2018, 10:43 am
  #1628  
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
Amanda Patel predicting Tory leadership challenge this week.
Dead cert I would say.
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Old Oct 21st 2018, 10:43 am
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by jimenato View Post
Dead cert I would say.
Exciting!
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Old Oct 21st 2018, 10:53 am
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
Exciting!
The question remains : Who's next ?
One would argue, it can't get worse ... but can it ?
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Old Oct 21st 2018, 10:59 am
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Annetje View Post
The question remains : Who's next ?
One would argue, it can't get worse ... but can it ?
I don't think it can get worse than her.

I think a challenge would be Boris and/or possibly Jacob.

What would be interesting is if a moderate Tory came out of nowhere as a kind of white knight, but I can't think of who...
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Old Oct 21st 2018, 11:08 am
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
I don't think it can get worse than her.

I think a challenge would be Boris and/or possibly Jacob.

What would be interesting is if a moderate Tory came out of nowhere as a kind of white knight, but I can't think of who...
There is a rumour David Davis has ambition, not the moderate one you have in mind.
How about Philip Hammond ?

Last edited by Annetje; Oct 21st 2018 at 11:09 am. Reason: spelling
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Old Oct 21st 2018, 11:23 am
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Annetje View Post
There is a rumour David Davis has ambition, not the moderate one you have in mind.
How about Philip Hammond ?
I think DD ran once before. He probably still has the ambition, but I think he would be a disaster like May. Phil doesn't have the charisma to pull it off. Good names though. If Dominic Raab were a bit older he might be able to make a cheeky bid.
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Old Oct 21st 2018, 11:50 am
  #1634  
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by 007Steve View Post


Couldn't put it any better. A mere 670,000 people say so. Anyone in Tory HQ listening???
Only 15.75 million to go to compare to the country's opinion of 17,410,742
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Old Oct 21st 2018, 11:51 am
  #1635  
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
The quiet majority are stepping up. Will have to join in next time.
Amd when you say "majority" you mean "minority" right?

And hardly silent, they haven't stopped their petulant crying and whinging since losing the vote.
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