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It's all getting ridiculous now

It's all getting ridiculous now

Old Jun 13th 2020, 5:01 am
  #31  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by stevenglish1 View Post
I just think we should accept the past for what it was, warts n all, learn from it, don't deny it and move on. Systemic racism resulted in the murder of George Floyd, not a few off the wall comedy shows,


Exactly.
People should be able to view the programmes concerned, knowing that they were made in a different time, when people and popular culture thought differently.
Then move on, and don't make those programmes again.

Otherwise where is the censorship going to end? Once almost all BBC sitcoms have been binned, should they start on films, destroying those which met the needs of their times but now offend someone? And books - let start burning libraries in case anyone finds a book with an offensive word in it, written back in the day when the word was acceptable.
Lets just sanitise everything so that there is no longer any enjoyment in any media. Then next time there is a virus lockdown we can just stare at 4 walls instead of finding a relief in sitcoms and laughter.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 5:44 am
  #32  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Most of the society knows the difference between actual racism and fictional programs - and knows how to put such materials in their proper historical context. We don't need studio executives and media journalists taking a paternalistic attitude, and trying to become cultural Red Guards. As Pollyanna said, where does it stop.

Progressives, and the radical left, have a historical tendency to turn on each other in vicious fashion. Those aggressively virtue signalling in an effort to get out in front of the pitch-fork mob, thinking it will enhance their standing as good progressives . . . or those who do so thinking their standing as good progressives is secure and not in question . . . will invariably find themselves trampled by the same pitch-fork mob they mistakenly egged on, and wishing for the same freedoms they once pushed to chip away and get rolled back.


Last edited by carcajou; Jun 13th 2020 at 5:53 am.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 5:57 am
  #33  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by stevenglish1 View Post
my problem is that I love a good dark, confrontational sense of humour, and can see where this might end up. I'm not a fan of how these streaming services work anyhow, I much prefer to pop down to blockbuster and rent some obscure b movie than make a choice from any top 50 list.

I know this probably makes me sound like one of them all lives matter wankers bit I'm not, I just think we should accept the past for what it was, warts n all, learn from it, don't deny it and move on. Systemic racism resulted in the murder of George Floyd, not a few off the wall comedy shows, i bet that the likes of Noel Fielding are .mortified that their comedy is deemed racist, for me the intent is everything, and his intent was a giggle nothing more.
You don't sound like an "all lives matter wanker" and you don't need to justify yourself to a hysteria mob. There is protesting systemic racism in the police force, and then there is a hysteria mob that starts wanting to burn books and DVDs of comedy programs from 45 years ago like Fawlty Towers.

Last edited by carcajou; Jun 13th 2020 at 6:00 am.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 6:01 am
  #34  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by Pollyana View Post
Its just ridiculous.

We should not be trying to change the past, and attempting to ignore it by changing narratives and removing memorials, statues and even TV programmes is a dangerous step towards forgetting who we are and where we have come from.
Cultural norms change with time, always have and always will, and it is our job to learn from the changes.

I remember at school being taught how some German history books never mentioned the Holocaust, and there were similar situations in China and Russia. Forgetting - or plastering over - issues from the past helps no-one. Accept what happened and move on. History should never be rewritten, it is there to learn from.
Ever imagined that you were taught wrong? Which German history books do not mention the holocaust? Were you fed anti German prejudice in school?
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 6:22 am
  #35  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by Assanah View Post
Were you fed anti German prejudice in school?
Just on this only , the answer for me is a resounding no. I was born 1954. WW1 and WW11 was not a part of our history curriculum. It didn't feature in geography other than as a part of the world map. No teacher made off the cuff comments re Germany or anti German stuff. Neither did my parents. My parents had close friends from Germany that lived and worked alongside them in the UK. So , for me, it is a no. Mind you perhaps they were Prussians. I cannot be sure on that.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 6:27 am
  #36  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by Steve English1
I just think we should accept the past for what it was, warts n all, learn from it, don't deny it and move on. Systemic racism resulted in the murder of George Floyd, not a few off the wall comedy shows,
Originally Posted by carcajou View Post
Most of the society knows the difference between actual racism and fictional programs - and knows how to put such materials in their proper historical context. .
I would go along with this. Satire has its place as do spoofs. I enjoy satire and dark humour but not spoofs mind you.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 6:34 am
  #37  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by carcajou View Post
You don't sound like an "all lives matter wanker" and you don't need to justify yourself to a hysteria mob. There is protesting systemic racism in the police force, and then there is a hysteria mob that starts wanting to burn books and DVDs of comedy programs from 45 years ago like Fawlty Towers.
I'm honestly not trying to be contentious, but I'm not sure I understand your 'you don't need to justify yourself to a hysteria mob'? Steve's not talking to a 'hysteria mob', he's talking to the people who've posted on this thread, all of whom have expressed their views in a considered, thoughtful manner, including himself. You may well have meant something else and I've missed it, and if that's the case you have my apologies.

It's a great discussion isn't it? It had the potential to turn nasty but with everyone posting in good faith it's very interesting and engaging.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 6:37 am
  #38  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by Assanah View Post
Ever imagined that you were taught wrong? Which German history books do not mention the holocaust? Were you fed anti German prejudice in school?
That made me think and I've realised something. In sleepy Western Australia we had very, very little exposure to the history of any nation except the UK. The vast majority of what I know about the world, I've learned since my school days. I'm a bit indignant now that we were taught so little.
I should add a caveat to that. The majority of my school days were in the 60s/70s, the curriculum has changed beyond recognition now, for the better.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 6:43 am
  #39  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by spouse of scouse View Post
I'm honestly not trying to be contentious, but I'm not sure I understand your 'you don't need to justify yourself to a hysteria mob'? Steve's not talking to a 'hysteria mob', he's talking to the people who've posted on this thread, all of whom have expressed their views in a considered, thoughtful manner, including himself. You may well have meant something else and I've missed it, and if that's the case you have my apologies.

It's a great discussion isn't it? It had the potential to turn nasty but with everyone posting in good faith it's very interesting and engaging.
Steve's comment was defensive in nature, as though he was afraid he was going to get attacked. I agree with your sentiments and as you have seen I have been quote vocal about that in the past few weeks.

The attacks need to be binned.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 6:47 am
  #40  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-53020335

I knew the great man wouldn't let me down. He's a good, honest to god progressive, and he's right about the BBC. When challenged about getting rid of the sculpture by Eric Gill because he was an incestuous paedophile and zoophilist, they come back with something about separating the man from his art. The world's going mad.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 6:49 am
  #41  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by carcajou View Post
Steve's comment was defensive in nature, as though he was afraid he was going to get attacked. I agree with your sentiments and as you have seen I have been quote vocal about that in the past few weeks.

The attacks need to be binned.
I suppose we all have a different perspective on what constitutes defensive, and that's understandable. Yes, totally agree with you that no one should be attacked for expressing their views, a robust rebuttal is good but personal attacks are not good. Hope you're enjoying our glorious weather today, there's nothing like a sunny Perth winter day.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 6:50 am
  #42  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by spouse of scouse View Post
That made me think and I've realised something. In sleepy Western Australia we had very, very little exposure to the history of any nation except the UK. The vast majority of what I know about the world, I've learned since my school days. I'm a bit indignant now that we were taught so little.
I should add a caveat to that. The majority of my school days were in the 60s/70s, the curriculum has changed beyond recognition now, for the better.
There is little Australian history in the current curriculum, and next to nothing about Western Australia. There is a lot on contemporary history (World War 1 and forwards). Students do not do an entire year of history - it shares a broad social sciences curriculum with several other subjects like geography and economics. To the extent that any one nation is highlighted - there is still quite a bit on the UK (contemporary rather than distant history) though some other coverage is starting to come up, like China and India.

Agree that the world needs to be opened up more for the students; not sure how it can be done.

Last edited by carcajou; Jun 13th 2020 at 6:53 am.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 6:51 am
  #43  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by spouse of scouse View Post
I suppose we all have a different perspective on what constitutes defensive, and that's understandable. Yes, totally agree with you that no one should be attacked for expressing their views, a robust rebuttal is good but personal attacks are not good. Hope you're enjoying our glorious weather today, there's nothing like a sunny Perth winter day.
Thank you. I am not in Perth. Regrettably it is far from glorious today in my part of the state.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 7:07 am
  #44  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by Assanah View Post
Ever imagined that you were taught wrong? Which German history books do not mention the holocaust? Were you fed anti German prejudice in school?
There were differences in how West Germany and East Germany approached it.

East Germany, for instance, did not accept any blame until 1990:

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-...205-story.html

I think pollyanna's overall point was not to harp on Germany for any perceived slight of the Holocaust as much as her point was to discuss the impact of differing perspectives, potential whitewashing of history and so on.
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Old Jun 13th 2020, 7:12 am
  #45  
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Default Re: It's all getting ridiculous now

Originally Posted by carcajou View Post
Thank you. I am not in Perth. Regrettably it is far from glorious today in my part of the state.
Whoops, there goes my Perthcentrism again! Sorry
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