Where not?
 

I've been looking at the Murcia area Cartagena and North. Apart from reading nice reports from the liveaboard sailing community about Cartagena and that I know people on Mar Menor who love it, it seems a good balance for climate and prices. However, apart from time spent visiting many of the areas from Marbella northwards, I know very little. I don't need to be totally immersed in UK hotspots. I would like to try and become part of Spanish community.

I don't expect anyone to criticise areas or towns but some positive guidance would be very helpful. Perhaps particularly nice places to look out for? I've read a bit on these forums, fora?, whatever, today about crime and hadn't thought about it particularly before. Coast is always nice but not absolutely necessary and maybe more for my money inland a bit. I will however be looking to get to coastal marinas easily.

As ever, any & all opinions are very welcome. Thanks

Re: Where not?
 

Just depends what you personally want and can get for your money in that specific area. Like you say, more for your money but what is that for you (house, garden, pool, walks etc.)? There are so many nice parts of Spain but what I also find is that many places also just look the same. I know most people are focused on climate but let's face it, anywhere along the east coast is worst case Mediterranean;). It's only my personal view but I just find that many parts of Murcia are boring in terms of flora. Even along the coast it's always the same and you don't get that excitement you'd find on the Costa Brava or Northern Spain. You come around a corner and suddenly see an amazing cove surrounded by trees, but in Murcia it's just Rocks:lol:. Of course some people just want a beach and a long promenade but I couldn't see myself doing that every day and I can still go on holiday to experience that, while others are just not interested in flora apart from their own garden maybe.

Re: Where not?
 

Looking ar your criteria, I would personally avoid Stalag Camposol with its 'sectors' at all costs. Looked there in our early days search. Although the prices were low, so was the build quality, availability of title deeds and flood plain.

Fair play, some love it and good luck to them, but you won't.

Re: Where not?
 

We have seen this question so many times. It really is impossible to answer without knowing your requirements. One will like this location and another will like that.

You could watch back episodes of A Place in the Sun

Re: Where not?
 

Thanks. Yes I understand.

Like many, I'm thinking that I can get a better lifestyle in Spain. I'm 70 and dislike cold, wet winters in the UK more and more.

I'm reasonable flexible as to a town house or perhaps more rural. Whilst I very much look forward to meeting Expats, I don't need to be in area that it exclusively expat. This is because I would like to try and be part of a Spanish community and of course learn Spanish. Maybe I'm wrong to try that but I'll find out during my trial renting period.

I love to be on the water and plan to buy another yacht, either before arriving in Spain, or during my time there. I need to research the most cost effective place to keep a boat. I don't need to live right on the coast but would like to be within reasonably easy reach by car. Also I'm wondering if I can pick up some part time work with a yacht broker or marina.

The property I prefer would be fairly modern, 2 bedroom up, with up to date bathroom, kitchen etc. Also preferably with a basement garage and workshop. Space for a couple of cars and maybe a small RIB outside.

To sum up, perhaps out of town, even in hills. reasonably warm in winter. (Perhaps that should relatively warm in winter). I'm not expecting 20 plus degrees all year. Easy reach of Med. One hour max from international airport. (EasyJet). I do understand Moses' point about pleasant surroundings. I've seen Costa Brava and more North in my younger days and yes it's beautiful. I even have friends in Barcelona. However, climate is important.

Sorry for the long post but hopefully I can get a bit of guidance. Although I'm a UK resident, I'm planning on coming to Spain when I leave Australia. Possibly during March.

Re: Where not?
 

Yes but even just above Barcelona you get 2500 hours of sunshine and although you do get crisp mornings in winter it still warms up during day and in summer you'll be thankful to have a bit of rain. It's also no problem to take a holiday further South if it gets too cold and even now Almeria is not really much hotter (2 or 3 degrees depending on area). This is a nice video with surrounding areas. Especially for sailing a dream.
https://www.spain-holiday.com/Costa-Brava

Re: Where not?
 

I'm looking too - I love the Costa Brava having been to L'Escala on many occasions, climate is perfect and it's a short hop from France and not too far from Barcelona. I also like Alicante (City). I'm looking for something where a decent city isn't too far away and there is a good variety of landscape without too many migrants from other EU countries and like the look of the Costa Tropical wher Granada/Malaga are not too far and you have the wonderful area of La Alpujarra and the Sierra Nevada mountains. The latter is probably the area I will eventually choose but not before having a look at other places .... Jerez and Cadiz look like they are worth a look, not too commercialised.

Re: Where not?
 

Indeed and the main thing is to be open to different areas and look for yourself. The good thing is that in Spain you have easy access to other places and it doesn't cost the world to book a holiday. So even if you end up in Alicante, you can still travel to Valencia and so on.

Re: Where not?
 

My last 'viewing' holiday was Alicante/Granada/Lanjaron/Almunecar in Oct - coach from Alicante to Granada was around 20 Euros for BOTH of us. What I like about Alicante is the transport links, El Campello is a nice little resort but only 30 Mins on the Tram to central Alicante. It depends on what you want .... I too would try and avoid the desert like areas or those too overpopulated with Brits. I'm sure areas like Marbella are fantastic and I will visit them, but I'm not sure I would want to live there and not just because of the price of property.

Re: Where not?
 

Newsflash Rob! You're 70 and I'm not too far that myself, so don't get offended. You need to rent and not buy and if you are renting longterm you will get cheaper rental over the whole year (that is if you wish to stay that long or longer). Fair rent for a 2 bedroom apartment would be around €600 (not GB£). You will be paying electricity charges too say circa €75.00 per month.

You enjoy heat so I reckon you need coastal southern Spain. Even a few miles inland can make a great difference to heat/cold in winter/spring. Therefore, my advice is to look along the coast from Alicante to Gibraltar. Find what you think you'll like (and I think you have your mind set on a particular area). Move there for at least five weeks and find a place with an option of extending the rental time, if possible.

Incidentally, the driest and warmest area of Spain is Costa Almeria. You need an airport handy too and a place with good public transport.

Re: Where not?
 

Not sure I'd be thinking, "ah well, climate's not up to much, but at least I can holiday in Spain", while looking for my ideal settling place - in Spain! Also, I for one would never ever be "thankful for a bit of rain" in summer. Quite happy to see some in other seasons, but summer is summer, time for the beach, the early morning walks and late evening outside cooking in reliable, dry, weather.

But, I must admit, the area around the Ebro appeals to me. If I were ever to move that is where I would head to, it's lovely up there.

As much as I like it further up, and I have been around Girona and all the coast between France and Barcelona, and it is lovely, I have to say that these days I would take into account that it's where the frothing-at-the-mouth separatists live. If you plan to integrate, as they say, then that would mean learning Catalan, because permanently-settling foreigners turning up and speaking Spanish, while they are ironing their "Catalonia is NOT SPAIN" flags of an evening, wouldn't be very welcome. All of which would make those essential holidays elsewhere in Spain, sorry, not elsewhere in Spain, I mean, in Spain, a bit of a pain.

On this occasion I agree, Catalonia is NOT Spain, and you want Spain, as you jolly well should.

Re: Where not?
 

Believe it or not, even with a Mediterranean climate you have summer:lol:. The only difference is that you might get enough rain to see a bit of green in between the brown. Well I don't see the difference with your mentioned flags elsewhere. You go to Wales and don't see the British flag too often and when you go to Liverpool, you hardly ever see people waving the Man City flag (unless they are visiting Liverpool/ Away Match:-).

Re: Where not?
 

We've got green too!

https://en.xabia.org/

We should work for our local tourist boards :-)

Re: Where not?
 

Probably well paid too:lol:

Re: Where not?
 

The last time I was in Jalon in Jan/Feb it snowed

Re: Where not?
 

I'm also from the Aussie heat in the summer, very interested where you will go!

Re: Where not?
 

I live north of Brisbane and I have had enough of it.

Re: Where not?
 

I have had a mooch around but obviously I can't say as I don't live there, my friend thinks Murcia is the place to go, but I'm not convinced.

Re: Where not?
 

At the end of the day we're all different and just depends what makes you happy. Might be the place to go for your friend but could be the worst place for you personally. I don't know if your friend means the actual City or the region?

Re: Where not?
 

Torrievieja, please forgive my spelling.

Re: Where not?
 

Torrevieja's ok climate-wise (not extreme heat) but then it's in Alacant not Murcia. It's also littered with densely packed housing estates that don't look great, but there are exceptions.

Re: Where not?
 

Thanks Horlics, not my thing.

Re: Where not?
 

Torrevieja is one of the places where around 50+% of population aren't Spanish. There are many areas in Spain that are like that and while some love it, I don't think I could see myself living in a place like that permanently.


One place I didn't really think about before is the Costa Dorada. After a recent holiday around there, I found some really nice places too and there seemed to be a good balance between normal life and tourism.
Obviously budget usually plays the biggest part but it looked like there is something to find on all budgets.

Re: Where not?
 

I think this Costa is overlooked by a lot of Brits in a similar way that the Costa Tropical is. I want an area that is not too expensive property wise (willing to go inland a little) and has a good mix of nationalities but which is predominantly Spanish. I am also not too bothered about a pool or a roof terrace and would consider a traditional Spanish City apartment or a Cortillo within walking distance of amenities.

Re: Where not?
 

Indeed and apart from Salou directly, there are many nicer places along the coast and a bit further inland that have a lot to offer. What would be not too expensive for you;)?

Re: Where not?
 

If we decide to keep a property in the UK as well as SP (which I don't want) then Max will probably be £130k if we move out completely (my preferred option) then maybe up to £250k,

Re: Where not?
 

For that money you should have no problem. Not Costa Dorada but not far from where we bought, something like this is around £130K.
https://www.idealista.com/inmueble/34427492/
You shouldn't have a problem. Just had a look around Costa Dorada and one area I forgot to say was Vilafortuny. That looked very nice and directly on coast

Re: Where not?
 

Thanks - that is the kind of thing. My main problem is getting agreement with my partner - I've always intended to move to SP and have been learning the language now for over 3 years, my partner likes England. I am prepared to let her choose the area and the type of property but as far as I'm concerned buying a place (or not) is not open to debate. Things could get a bit lively in my house over the next year or two :lol:

Re: Where not?
 

They don't speak Spanish up there and won't appreciate your efforts to do so. It's the land of nationalists and separatists. Do yourself a favour and move to Spain, not Catalunya.

Re: Where not?
 

If Costa Dorada appeals climate wise, then a little further south is the Costa Azahar, another area often overlooked by the British.


Horlics - not disagreeing with you in any way, but is it really that bad, language wise, in Catalunya? We live not far from the Catalunyan border and often visit, especially to the Ebre Delta, but inland towns as well. We have not experienced any animosity when speaking Spanish. Even the "border towns" (the ones we visit) had riots during the recent referendum troubles, but they're always OK with us.


Valenciano is the first language for many people where we live, a lot of signs are in both languages, the locals are bi-lingual, and they have been without exception so patient and helpful when I struggle sometimes with Spanish (or perhaps I should say Castellano). I appreciate though that Valencia is not looking for independence !!


Like I say, not disagreeing, just interested in your experiences.

Re: Where not?
 

Even hardcore Catalunyans would appreciate that for foreign visitors Spanish is the most likely language that they would use simply to make themselves understood IMO. For someone who hasn't decided yet where to live Spanish has to be the language to learn.

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Some people just want to find any reason and because they can't really find any faults they bring up language. We bought in area, went on holiday many times and never had any problems. If it was so bad why do people who don't speak Catalan from other European countries move there? Then nobody would go to Ibiza or Mallorca and as long as you try and make an effort friendly people will be friendly people. Sometimes I end up speaking a mix of English, German because locals want to practice their language skills and then it goes back to Spanish and Catalan. My Spanish is basic and so far don't understand a word of Catalan but I survive. The scenery, culture and food is amazing and believe it or not, I even manage to survive in Ireland without Gaelic:lol:.

Re: Where not?
 

I love the area of the Ebro and spent quite a lot of time in Tortosa. Certainly no issues with Castellano there. But that's where the vote to leave Spain was a minority. Further up, it's different. While they tolerate you bumbling around in basic Spanish and think, aww how sweet, he's made an effort, after a while there they start to question why you can't be arsed with Catalan and insist on continuing with Spanish.

So no, you won't notice this pressure on a visit or if you never really try to integrate and stick at basic Spanish, but otherwise, in time it will come.

I'm talking about dealing with people in social situations after integrating. Of course bar owners, waiters, shop keepers are going to let you speak whatever you want, you're a customer.

As for Valenciano.... I live in an area where Valenciano is spoken by the locals. I socialise with them quite often and have some good friends amongst them. I only speak Castellano and they're fine about it. As an example, when we're at a long table for a big dinner, the ones either side of me will hold conversations in Spanish and those further away will be nattering in Valenciano. They are kind enough to stick to Castellano if I am in earshot.

Re: Where not?
 

On good form as always Moses.

I seem to remember the Op saying "I don't expect anyone to criticise areas or towns but some positive guidance would be very helpful"

And the very first reply, which was from you said, "many parts of Murcia are boring in terms of flora" and "...in Murcia it's just Rocks".

And now here you are saying, So after bringing up faults about Murcia you get all touchy about someone else bringing up a possibly negative aspect of your neck of the woods. Grow a thicker skin mate, it'll help you in those cold winters and not-so-hot summers you have up there.

Re: Where not?
 

Not touchy and just back from a swim in the Atlantic, so you need sealskin for that. Your point about language is pointless, as nearly all Catalans are bilingual and even if you move to your so called Spain the OP is still a foreigner. So you are saying that just Rocks are negative unless you work for a quarry:lol:. Not saying Murcia is bad but for someone sailing, the coast around the Balearics all the way to the Cote d'Azur is much more spectacular.

Re: Where not?
 

Moses - on all of my previous viewing trips I've pre-booked accommodation (usually cheap SP hotels or TripA apartments) and flown down though I have driven to L'Escala twice. To get a real feel for the Spanish Coast and maybe look at the Atlantic side too (I really like the look of Jerez and want to see San Sebastian) I'm thinking of pre-booking some accommodation and driving all the way down. Off season (May,Early June/Sept, Oct) is it easy just to arrive at Hostels and get a room for a couple of nights?

Re: Where not?
 

We've driven down a few times now but unfortunately we never really made it to San Sebastian, as so far we had to take ferry to France from Ireland but from UK there's one directly to San Sebastian. We drove down through Toulouse past Perpignan and then into Roses a few times, which I can really recommend for a visit. From there, you have the whole Costa Brava to explore all the way down. These are the kind of walks you get along the coast (check out street view) https://www.google.ie/maps/@41.88045...7i13312!8i6656


The thing is that you are better off booking beforehand and actually May, June even September are still very busy times. We've been to Roses early October and weather was still great but in general the bay of Roses is wetter and colder than the likes of Platja d'Aro, Lloret or Tossa for example. Of course budget is also another point to consider should you decide to buy but luckily there are still some affordable parts if you know where to look;).

Re: Where not?
 

Do you have information about the ferry direct from the UK to San Sebastian please?

Re: Where not?
 

Whether Catalans are bilingual has no relevance to the point I was making, but if you can't work that out i'll leave that one there. I've explained what I meant re the Catalans' view on integration with Spanish speakers. When you move beyond "basic" Spanish you might get some insight yourself.

Re: Where not?
 

Not sure why you appear to be getting on your high horse over this particularly as the language discussion is totally off topic.

This is a decent guide written by people with a good understanding of the issue:

https://www.barcelona-university.es/Barcelona-catalan-vs-castilian.htm