Which third language?
 

My 11 year old is pretty much bilingual (questionable definition but hey ho) English-Spanish. Definitely totally fluent in Spanish. He now faces the choice of third language between French and German to start in September. Taking all things into consideration: Economics, job prospects, wide spread of English/Spanish, ease of assimilation of either language for a native English speaker, ease of learning of either for a fluent Spanish speaker, which would you suggest? Bizarrely the school has given us three days to decide. OK yes we knew about this long ago by word of mouth, but THREE DAYS for such a decision? Anyway, I'm asking left right and centre to see what views come back!

Re: Which third language?
 

Mandarin

Re: Which third language?
 

Not an option other than as a paid-for add-on. I'm inclined to agree with the sentiment, though;)

Re: Which third language?
 

Yup, deffo chinese is the language of the future. However, failing that and with the limited choices you're given it's got to be german. Even though I know that french is the traditional "foreign" language taught in Spain.

Re: Which third language?
 

Out of those two it's a no brainer. Who would want to learn French - and why?

Re: Which third language?
 

Agreed.

Re: Which third language?
 

Choose the language your son shows an interest in doing, and so will stand a better chance of actually doing well at it.
In the small chance that he becomes a talent at the language, he will then have options (teaching, translation etc.) regardless.
If he doesn't have a preference, then fair enough choose German. But it is a harder language to learn.

Re: Which third language?
 

My old school now teaches it as a compulsory subject from age 3.

Re: Which third language?
 

While agreeing, I've heard the view expressed that for someone familiar with a romance language such as Spanish, French should be easier to learn - and that already being fluent in two of the four most widely used languages in the world, the third (given the limited choice, admittedly) should maybe be one that doesn't affect the main two. But that's just someone's view. Others point out that in theory German is easier to learn for someone with native English .........

Re: Which third language?
 

Agreed. Once you know Spanish, French is much easier - but to what end? Just to add another language to a CV?


Once one knows German, then many other languages become easier. But again, so what?


It really is a question of why do something. It could be enjoyment, it could be self satisfaction or it could be to increase possibility/probability of a job .

Re: Which third language?
 

French would be the easiest as the grammar construction and words are very similar. German would probably be more useful.

Re: Which third language?
 

Despite what the majority on this forum say, I'd go for French.
It's an awful decision to have to make at the age of your child, but having been through it all in my youth, & German was my main language at college, I'd still go for French. Why?
*It's more widely spoken throughout the world, especially in the Middle East.
*Germans on the whole are good at English anyway.
*It's a more natural follow-on to Spanish.
*Other than Germany, Austria & parts of Switzerland, nowhere else really needs German.

Not so sure about the rush to learn Mandarin. It'd be an interesting challenge, but what for? Business Chinese learn English anyway.

Leave it with you!
Good luck.

Re: Which third language?
 

I think so many business people the world over speak English that's an argument against many languages, not just Mandarin.........but as someone (else) said to me, it's not the speaking it's the understanding what people are saying around you. You stand a better chance of not being duped, or sidelined. As to our decision, one other factor occurs to me. The majority, if not all, his classmates seem to be going to opt for (had decided for them) German. If this is true for the other class in his year, I think this makes a good case for doing French on the basis of a likely considerably smaller class size!

Re: Which third language?
 

Chinese,

I realise what a travesty it was to have the option of French and/or German at school. I chose both. Fair does, the Latin roots help you with other European languages but what a waste.

I have yet to meet a German who doesn't speak impeccable English. Not many countries speak French. My Friend's son has just married a Chinese girl and lives and works in Shanghai. I never saw that coming 20 years ago.

Chinese. Not an option. Take it(Mandarin) at night school.

Re: Which third language?
 

I'm asking about my 11 year old son's non-negotiable French-German option.:)

Re: Which third language?
 

to have the courtesy of learning a few simple sentences in their language, even if it is only good morning, please and thank you etc.

also should be noted they have different attitudes in business meetings such as how low you bow and the mandatory presentation of business cards. Or is that Japan ???

Re: Which third language?
 

German - for all the same reasons everyone else has already stated

that said, my girls had the same choice & opted for German - they both hate it with a vengeance as a language, although do manage to pass (it's their 4th language though....)

dd1 & I have been trying to find Italian lessons locally - just for fun....

Re: Which third language?
 

I am fluent in German, and it's been quite handy - if you are in Germany/Austria/Switz.

German is not a nice language to learn or speak. But in the short-term, it could be an advantage, since Germany will likely continue to offer the most employment opportunities in the EU.

But in a broader view, German is about the least-spoken language of the majors, and decreasing in importance. For the long-term, I'd recommend French (far more common than German), or as others have suggested, various dialects of Chinese, such as Mandarin.

Re: Which third language?
 

I'm more convinced now that you should choose French - unless your child has expressed an interest in learning German.
Too many potential pitfalls at school age already, without making life even more stressful.

Re: Which third language?
 

I have spent many years abroad and in a lot of different countries and in all the tourist areas the locals speak English and German, I learned French at school and have only ever used it once and that was in France.

Re: Which third language?
 

I learnt French at school, had to use it when in Plymouth and a French frigate visited us - distinct lack of English on their part.
;)

Re: Which third language?
 

Text speak. Very widely followed but not fluent to most under 40.:unsure:

Re: Which third language?
 

French, I did this the other way round as was fluent in French at 18 and then learnt Spanish when my Mum bought a place in Spain when I was 17. It will be easier and is more widely spoken than German.

Its a long time till your 11 year old is 21 and looking for work. If the thought is that Germany is the current place with most economic activity that could change, excellent language skills should never go out of fashion.

Re: Which third language?
 

Does it work the other way, I speak French, daily with my wife, and we need to start on Spanish. Will it be easier for us knowing French?

We do have the problem though of breaking rule 1 - 3 of any language. Practice Practice Practice. When we return home we wont really use it, and I fear I will therefore lose it as well. Its much harder to learn a language as you get older. So I am not sure if the course will be a good investment... but we will give it a go later in the year.

Going back on topic choose the language that your child prefers to learn... I agree with the poster that you will learn much more effectively if you are doing something you enjoy.....

Let us know what you decide


I would go for French as we both like visiting the country and half of Belgium speak it (where we live)... it is also spoken more in the world as well than German. But go for enjoyment of learning first IMHO
Jon

Re: Which third language?
 

I would choose Chinese, not only for the language but also for the culture. The emphasis on self discipline, hard work, wisdom and respect for elders is a useful contrast to the western alternative of three years of partying with a gap year afterwards to get over the stress.

Re: Which third language?
 

Makes sense, but the OP is limited to ONLY 2 choices....

Of those which one do you plump for?

Jon

Re: Which third language?
 

Not an option

:lol: He's probably fluent already....bilingually, of course!!

Not an option

What he said!!

Re: Which third language?
 

French then, it opens up more possibilities worldwide than German, unless your son is keen on engineering, science or manufacturing.

I ask myself whether the language choices offered are for the benefit of the pupils, or for the convenience of the teaching staff.

Re: Which third language?
 

........or the relative expense of importing other language specialists..... it is, after all, a profit-making company (*ahem sorry private school*)
;)

Re: Which third language?
 

Yes, agree to do all that, but it doesn't involve the difficulties of having to learn the language per se.

Re: Which third language?
 

Daft as it might sound, what does your 11 year old think as to which language.
It's got to be a language that is enjoyable, though that can be very subjective, reading some of these posts.
I was no good at French at school; much better at German. But now, at 66, much prefer French!

Re: Which third language?
 

Has your son tried out French and German on the internet to be in a better position to evaluate which one he thinks he might achieve a good understanding and therefore a good usage of his time.

Rosemary

Re: Which third language?
 

Hi from the France forum!
FWIW, my two daughters had the choice between Spanish and German, in addition to English, when they went up to Secondary school. They chose German, mainly because I speak it and encouraged them, but most of their respective class-mates chose Spanish, the "easier" option. They were lucky enough to be in a small class of motivated pupils until the Bac and, xx years later, are both living in Germany now, one working in her three languages and the other finishing a second Degree in a German Uni.
At the end of the day, if you yourself don't speak either French or German, then your son should decide which language he thinks he'd be more comfortable with. French is closer to Spanish, therefore easier and useful for holidays or studying literature or philosophy later; German grammar/syntax is difficult for everyone, but is more "eye-catching" on a future CV and useful for reading technical and scientific works later on....
Good luck with the decision, but whichever language he chooses, if he is talented, he can learn others later....

Re: Which third language?
 

Sorry for the long reply but this is something that has been nagging me as well. Our eldest is 3 and is bilingual Spanish/English. Maybe in a year or two I'd like him to start a third language. However I'm not finding the choice very straight forward. For a start he won't be learning the third language in the same, "natural" way that he learns English and Spanish. In fact it will require a lot more effort on his part, not only to learn it but also to maintain it in the future. This is important as he will have to learn other subjects at school at the same time and also, children's brains are efficient - if they conclude that there is no practical use in spending a lot of time and effort on learning a language, they will reject it. How many English schoolkids did a couple of years of French or German before realising it was far too much effort compared to other subjects?

Anyway, here are my thoughts on French, German and Chinese (I'm aware Chinese isn't an option for you):

1) French - easiest to learn and maintain. It has so much in common with Spanish and English that he should be able to do the grammar very easily, and also it will feel familiar. The main thing is the accent - he'll need to pick it up quite young in order to communicate well in French.

2) German - harder to learn. Probably more useful when it comes to finding a job - especially if the eurozone ends up becoming some kind of federation, with Germany at the heart. Difficult to maintain unless he spends time in Germany.

3) Chinese - let's get one thing straight first. It is NOT the language of the future. It is far too hard to learn this language, let alone maintain it. It simply cannot take off in the same way English has. Why? Because of the Hanzi character system. You have to learn several thousand of these characters in order to be able to read basic Chinese. And it takes years. So you can't learn to speak Chinese from a book or the internet. You have to spend a lot of time in a Chinese speaking environment to really pick up the language. You also have the problem that the characters give no indication of how a word is pronounced. Which is why China is full of regional dialects. So even if my son does master Mandarin there's a very good chance that he won't be able to make himself understood with a large amount of Chinese people anyway. In practical terms it really doesn't seem worth it. But, from an academic and cultural point of view, it may be worthwhile. Even if he never becomes usefully fluent in Chinese, there is still value in having some understanding of such a different and exotic language.

Re: Which third language?
 

Maybe Arabic is the language of the future? (apologies for this, but the other thread was closed because we have this thread!)
Let's be honest - English is the world's language, and likely to remain so. So long as your child keeps a good native standard in English, they've got an advantage in life.

Re: Which third language?
 

:goodpost: from chopera

The Chinese suggestions are surely a red herring.

France will probably be easier but German will almost certainly be more useful, especially considering the number of Spanish and others finding work in Germany ATM.

Having said that, I have worked in many countries and the language used has always been English. Aside from kudos when socialising in the evenings after work (which I suppose might have borne fruit:o) there was not one time when a foreign language would have helped me which was a good thing as I would have needed about ten different ones.

Let the boy choose as in the end it probably won't make much difference.

Re: Which third language?
 

Barring global war or some other cataclysmic occurrence I agree. English is dominant and, crucially and significantly, its use is growing.

It will be more than a generation or two before its importance starts to diminish...

Re: Which third language?
 

My money says Arabic will definitely NOT be the language of the future.

Most of the Germans, Dutch, and Arabs we know both prefer English even though it is not their native language. The Germans, in particular - seem to find English to be easier to speak and understand than any other "2nd" language (and of course, they can't graduate from school without it), and - generally speaking - Germans seem to feel English is a perfectly acceptable "worldwide" language.

English is far from perfect, but it's already the most spoken language in the world. For those who care to dispute this, I'm not referring to "native" or "mother tongue" language - only that more people on the planet are capable of speaking English (1st 2nd or 3rd) than any other language.

Apparently Spanish is the most spoken "native" language (in terms of sheer numbers and geographical diversity), however, that's rather arguable when you compare various dialects of Chinese/Mandarin which have a very large population who speak these dialects natively, but these various dialects are very geographically limited, and can hardly be considered "world" languages.

Re: Which third language?
 

The best niche language to have in Spain (in terms of tourism jobs) is Russian.
The average Russian tourist spends 159 euros daily, as opposed to the 93 euros by the average Brit.

Re: Which third language?
 

Those three words, small and insignificant though they may first appear, are pretty darned important. It's easy to slide in favour of Spanish on the basis that the child 'needs more help' with the non-native language. But without GOOD English of the native variety, you've not much advantage over any other nationality with good spoken and written English. I can speak with some knowledge, having direct experience of the excellent written English skills of an IGCSE student (Spanish) whose language would rival any English 15/16 year old's..... But whose spoken English on the phone to me was faltering at the very most.

Back accurately on topic, though:
I bumped into 11yo's class teacher after football (his, not hers!) and asked likely class sizes if most opt for German. She immediately said her son (a year above) had a good teacher/pupil ratio for French because most had opted for German. I mentioned this to 11 yo but made no more of it than just that's what she had said. A few minutes later, in the car on the way home, I asked him if he took my thoughts/views, his dad's, his teacher's and anyone else's out of the equation and just went on what HE thought, which would he rather take? The answer.......... French.
Why? 'Because (and this is sound 11 year old logic) there would be fewer people and I wouldn't get distracted'.
So - dad's and my debate yet to be had probably this evening as he's still in the UK until after the appointed decision day - there you have it!!!