Spanish tax

Old Apr 17th 2015, 7:47 pm
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Default Spanish tax

Hi There,
At the moment we are very much in the dreaming stages of a move to sunnier climates.
I currently work offshore abroad, this means I would be in the country less than 180 days a year but my girlfriend and her 11 year old son would be staying the majority of the time. I would only be looking to rent initially but with my girlfriend staying in the country and us not being married does this still make me liable for Spanish tax?
regards
Ross
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Old Apr 17th 2015, 8:51 pm
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Default Re: Spanish tax

Hi and a warm welcome to the Spanish forum on BE. Myself and Fred James are the moderators for the Spanish forums whilst BEVS moderates Europe. Moderators are there to ensure that the site runs smoothly within the rules of BE. This is so that members gain the information that they are looking for and find their experiences on the forums to be friendly and worthwhile.

Problems and complaints should always be addressed to a moderator who will look into the matter and deal with it efficiently and fairly. Our members who post in the Spain Forums are usually friendly and helpful with a wealth of knowledge about the issues of living in Spain. I hope that you enjoy your time participating in the forums.

Please let me know if you need any further help.

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Old Apr 17th 2015, 11:10 pm
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Default Re: Spanish tax

Originally Posted by Alsopr View Post
Hi There,
At the moment we are very much in the dreaming stages of a move to sunnier climates.
I currently work offshore abroad, this means I would be in the country less than 180 days a year but my girlfriend and her 11 year old son would be staying the majority of the time. I would only be looking to rent initially but with my girlfriend staying in the country and us not being married does this still make me liable for Spanish tax?
regards
Ross
I think it's been the case in the past that if your family live full time in Spain, but you personally spend a lot of time outside of Spain, then you will be deemed to be a Spanish resident. Perhaps someone else could be more precise
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Old Apr 18th 2015, 7:15 am
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Default Re: Spanish tax

What the Tax law actually says is that you are deemed tax resident if your principal nucleus or the base of your economic interests, directly or indirectly, is based in Spain. Unless proved to the contrary, the tax payer is deemed to have his residence in Spain when his spouse, not divorced or legally separated and dependant minor children are habitually resident in Spain.

Royal Decree 439/2007 Article 9.1.b

In this case the OP's girlfriend would not enter into the equation, but the children would. That said, I have no idea how often this rule is applied and if you can prove that you are paying tax elsewhere, then tax treaties can change this rule.
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Old Apr 18th 2015, 7:23 am
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Default Re: Spanish tax

Originally Posted by Alsopr View Post
Hi There,
At the moment we are very much in the dreaming stages of a move to sunnier climates.
I currently work offshore abroad, this means I would be in the country less than 180 days a year but my girlfriend and her 11 year old son would be staying the majority of the time. I would only be looking to rent initially but with my girlfriend staying in the country and us not being married does this still make me liable for Spanish tax?
regards
Ross
Is your girlfriend a resident in Spain already? That is, does she have her NIE and certificate of registration.

I see this as a major issue as she would need to prove sufficient income herself and would also need private health care.

As you are not married, I don't think your income can be used to show she has sufficient wealth.
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Old Apr 18th 2015, 7:29 am
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Default Re: Spanish tax

Originally Posted by snikpoh View Post
Is your girlfriend a resident in Spain already? That is, does she have her NIE and certificate of registration.

I see this as a major issue as she would need to prove sufficient income herself and would also need private health care.

As you are not married, I don't think your income can be used to show she has sufficient wealth.
Would not a regular remittance to her from the OP be accepted as income?

On Fred's point about children, the way the original post reads to me is as if the child is the girlfriend's but not the OP's and I wonder if that would be counted as his 'nucleus'. I doubt it.
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Old Apr 18th 2015, 7:58 am
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Default Re: Spanish tax

Regular payments into a bank account are usually acceptable proof of financial stability - I don't think you are obliged to say where they come from.
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Old Apr 18th 2015, 12:09 pm
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Default Re: Spanish tax

A friend recently went through the permanent residency routine and only had to show an amount I think around euro 6000 in the bank at the time of getting paperwork signed. He was told he didn't need to keep that amount or show any on going deposits. This being the case OP could ensure that his girlfriend has this amount in a bank account at time of making residency application. Of course as always I appreciate different areas may interprate the rules differently.
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Old Apr 18th 2015, 2:30 pm
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Default Re: Spanish tax

As always, different offices interpret the rules differently so you will always get conflicting reports of people's experiences.

Incidentally, possession of a credit card with an adequate credit limit and the availability of that credit is now also acceptable.
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Old Apr 19th 2015, 3:26 am
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Default Re: Spanish tax

Hi and thanks for the response, No my girlfriend currently stays with myself in the UK but if we make the move it would be together just meaning she would spend a lot more time in the country than I. Yes the child is my girlfriends and no blood relation to myself.
I would be looking for my girlfriend and her son to apply for NIE and residency as he will be going to school. I personally would not be as I would not be in the country over 6 months due to work and other commitments but would generally stay there. I would look to open a joint Spanish bank account with adequate amount rent bills etc and wandering how this affects my overall tax situation as I am not married or a permanent resident in the country.

Last edited by Alsopr; Apr 19th 2015 at 3:44 am.
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Old Apr 19th 2015, 7:00 am
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Default Re: Spanish tax

Originally Posted by Alsopr View Post
Hi and thanks for the response, No my girlfriend currently stays with myself in the UK but if we make the move it would be together just meaning she would spend a lot more time in the country than I. Yes the child is my girlfriends and no blood relation to myself.
I would be looking for my girlfriend and her son to apply for NIE and residency as he will be going to school. I personally would not be as I would not be in the country over 6 months due to work and other commitments but would generally stay there. I would look to open a joint Spanish bank account with adequate amount rent bills etc and wandering how this affects my overall tax situation as I am not married or a permanent resident in the country.
As your centre of economic interest is in Spain, I suspect you will be considered tax resident in Spain. No big deal, just means you pay tax here instead of UK.
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Old Apr 19th 2015, 7:31 am
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Default Re: Spanish tax

How to you work that out? If he doesn't have any financial interests in Spain and no family in Spain and doesn't own a house in Spain it would be very unlikely that he would be deemed tax resident.

Since he works offshore it is quite likely that he pays no tax at all - many offshore workers are in this situation.
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Old Apr 19th 2015, 7:38 am
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Default Re: Spanish tax

Originally Posted by Alsopr View Post
[ I would be looking for my girlfriend and her son to apply for NIE and residency as he will be going to school. I personally would not be as I would not be in the country over 6 months due to work and other commitments but would generally stay there. I would look to open a joint Spanish bank account with adequate amount rent bills etc and wandering how this affects my overall tax situation as I am not married or a permanent resident in the country.
Having a joint bank account when one holder is non resident and the other is resident might be a bit complicated. I have not come across this before. It might be better to have two separate accounts. You can easily transfer money online between accounts.

As Snikpoh pointed out, she will need private health cover unless she works in Spain and pays social security. Private cover is cheaper than in the UK.
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Old Apr 19th 2015, 8:40 am
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Smile Re: Spanish tax

Originally Posted by Fred James View Post
Having a joint bank account when one holder is non resident and the other is resident might be a bit complicated. I have not come across this before. It might be better to have two separate accounts. You can easily transfer money online between accounts.

As Snikpoh pointed out, she will need private health cover unless she works in Spain and pays social security. Private cover is cheaper than in the UK.
I can assure you that if the holders of an account in a Spanish bank are mixed between between Resident and Non-Resident it is certainly to complicated for Sabadel to cope with. As a legacy of a long slow move over from UK we opened a joint account between five of us as non-residents. When two of us became Residents two years ago and I refused to pay the outrageous non-resident charge for the two of us the bank just cannot solve the problem this presents. It has been tossed back and forth between the branch, head office in Madrid, the legal department and the mortgage department and is still unresolved.

I would definitely recommend your partner has an account in her name as a resident and you have a separate account in your name as a non resident. If you don't own a property then you will not be liable for the imputed rental tax but your partner would become tax resident after her first 183 days in Spain. She may not actually pay tax since that would depend on the amount payed into her account each month. If it was set at the minimum to gain residency then I think that is below the Spanish personal allowance so neither of you would pay tax in Spain. You might wish to be generous with gifts and cash when you visit but that is entirely down to you!
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Old Apr 19th 2015, 7:02 pm
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Default Re: Spanish tax

This is a massive help and greatly appreciated, thanks everyone
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