The kind lady in the scooter shop told me that it is cheaper to insure a 125cc in Spain opposed to a 50cc as all the young kids have 50's and cause all the accidents via being stupid.

So it seems to me that the Spanish law on this matter boils down to common sense and maturity over skill and training.

Because to be quite honest if I had to pay to take "compulsory basic training" just to drive a 125cc twist and go in Spain and iv already got a full car licence I just wouldn't bother and they would then be losing out on road tax.

Millions of scooters on the roads in Spain They must take millions in tax off them.

Out of curiosity, what are your plans? And have you ridden a bike before (not including twist and go)?

Plans with this scooter ?

Just to get around locally on as I don't have a car here and don't want to pay the second hand car prices here also a lot easier to park where I am as it is really busy.

Yes I have!! Started off with a kx65 when I was 12 all up until my last bike which was a klx-r 450 about 7 years ago all off road bikes but I did have a go on my mates Yamaha R1 once not that I would ever go on one again but I lived to tell the tale haha scary to say the least.

I have no interest in driving a geared bike in spain.

I intend doing a lot of touring on my bike so I need much more than a scooter.

If you only want to do a bit of local commuting I think a scooter is the wisest choice. Is the scooter second hand (not sure if you mentioned that before) and, if so, what sort of price do they go for?

I would certainly use one as a runaround but the car is a necessity for shopping trips.

Iv bought a sym sport 125cc brand new with 5 year guarantee 2,000€. Not the best of makes but they were english who owned the place where I bought it and they have been working with sym for 12 years now and have never had to send one back plus I have the 5 year guarantee so if anything goes wrong within 5 years it will be fixed for nothing and then after parts are cheap and easy to get hold of anyway.

I see a lot of sym scooters about I ain't even googled to see where they are from yet probably Chinese or something but I don't mind can't moan for 2,000€ and my insurance was only 140€ for the year oh and I got my helmet for free aswell.

Not as good as your piaggio, gilera, honda, yamaha etc but overall I'm chuffed with it.

Would have needed to spend at least 8k on a car as I will only buy German when it comes to cars.

Would love to go touring a friend of my fathers toured the whole of Europe on a bike always wondered how do they carry there clothes etc with them haha ?

We seen the Honda goldwing tour pass through albir a few weeks ago some of them were stunning was good to see plates from all over the place aswell.

That might need a rethink.

Sym is a Taiwan outfit and partner to Hyundai so it could be worse. As you say, it's not a top brand but their scoots are quite popular so it should easily reach the end of a 5 yr warranty if you look after it.

I haven't got the space available to a Goldwing. Mine is a Pan European ST1300 and touring means you live most of the time in your bike gear. Jeans, shorts and tshirts the rest of the time - so no posh hotels and restaurants

Can't agree with this.
Most of the kids that fly around on T&G 50s were almost born on them. They're very experienced in that they've been riding them since they learned to walk. The high accident rate is probably down to the fact that they are so reckless with them, speeding, in and out of traffic, ignoring traffic lights, one-way streets, smoking on them and chatting to their friends on them. Certainly not from not being able to ride them.

And as for geared bikes, I don't think people would just hop on one and expect to be able to ride it. They're more likely to try it out in a car park or field first and get used to changing gears. Self preservation. People have had push bikes since they were kids so the balance thing is rubbish. Most experienced car drivers could ride a geared bike perfectly safely, or at least as well as some of the "licenced" idiots that ride them. They don't call bikers "Organ Doners" for nothing.

To be honest, those clamouring for licencing bikes are probably speaking from an elitist point of view. They had to take a test so they don't want everyone else to be able to ride a bike unless they take one as well and join the club. One-up-manship (or whatever the expression is).

Whys that then lol ?

Volkswagen board gathers for crisis meeting - BBC News

Let's not go down that route - it's way off topic.

It's worthy of a thread in its own right, so please feel free to start one if you want to discuss it.

You don't have to.

I left out the rest of your post because it was mostly nonsense.

Which bit?

Maybe things are different for you in Lincolnshire, but here in Spain....

Which bit? OK, let's break it down.

My post (quoted here for easy reference) doesn't mention kids being "reckless with them, speeding, in and out of traffic, ignoring traffic lights, one-way streets, smoking on them and chatting to their friends on them."

My post was talking about experienced (likely to be considered 'adult') car drivers choosing to jump on TnG scooters in the (probably correct) assumption that they are easier to ride than a geared bike would be - and without any additional training.

So your first paragraph is nonsense as it doesn't refer to my post in the slightest.

Your second point tends to agree with a point I made earlier (that being the idea of people jumping on a geared bike without training or supervision is a recipe for disaster). I'm pleased you think people would have a little more sense and I'm assuming you agree that the Spanish concession that allows the untrained to do that is a potentially dangerous one.

The balance thing is rubbish? Why do you think a motorcycle driving test includes riding at a walking pace? That's right! Because balance and slow speed riding control have to be learned and mastered. By the way, if a wobbly learner puts a foot on the ground... that's an instant fail. So, no the "balance thing" isn't rubbish.

Then you really get crazy (and quite nasty if I'm to be honest). "Most experienced drivers could ride a bike perfectly safely" - no argument from me there. Given the correct training and time to practice, yes of course they could.

"...or at least as well as some of the "licenced" [sic] idiots that ride them."

Sigh. That is just uncalled for and a sign of your true colours.

"They don't call bikers "Organ Doners" [sic] for nothing."

Really? Who are 'they'? I've never heard this term. I will assume 'they' are your anti-bike friends.

So your second paragraph started off quite well before becoming a cross between misinformed ignorance and an anti-bike rant.

You saved the best for last though.

Bikers belong to a very welcoming community. You break down in your car and how many cars will pass you by? This is something of a generalisation but possibly... probably... none? You may get lucky and a friend might see you with your head under the bonnet but there aren't many good Samaritan types that will stop to help. Bikers on the other hand will stop. They will make their phone available if you don't have one, they may ask if they can ride off and bring something back to you, or if you're really lucky they will be able to get your bike running. And they will not accept anything in return.

Oh, and they would absolutely love everybody to ride bikes - safely which yes, means licensed and legal - because the more people ride bikes the less dangerous car drivers there are that just don't look and see bikes.

So your final paragraph is another load of nonsense.

Any further anti-bike baiting comments from you will not get a reply from me. It's very clear that you don't like bikes... which begs the question why did you post in this thread?

In case you haven't noticed, the title of this thread was "A quick question".

This has clearly been answered so discussions about the merits or otherwise of the Spanish licence laws are clearly off topic here.

If you wish to continue the discussion open another thread.

I am closing this one.