Lynn R

http://elpais.com/elpais/2013/07/30/...18_250470.html

More indications of a (slow and tortuous) recovery in Spain's economic situation?

jackytoo

Perhaps but I prefer to judge when I have read it outside of Spain. Today Spains retail figures came out. They were in the Telegraph at 8am. Still not in the Spanish press at 10.30am Sales were down again for the 36th month! Then there has been a lot of talk this month about Spains borrowing shooting up alarmingly.

Spain's central bank reports the troubled nation's debt jumped to a record 88.2% of GDP in Q1 2013. The year-over-year rise is also the fastest on record - so no green shoot there as the bank notes it expects the debt burden to rise to 90.5% of GDP by the end of 2013 (but may revise that forecast - up). The raw numbers are awesome. Spain's debt was EUR 922.8 billion at the end of March - up 19.1% from a year earlier


http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-0...elerating-pace

Dick Dasterdly

Slow and Tortuous it will most definitely be.
I heard a discussion on Radio 4 this morning in which Spain was described as a basket case.
Hopefully the patient isn't terminally ill and I think we may see the first few positive signs of recovery within the next year to eighteen months.
If not, doesn't really bear thinking about.

olivefarmer

Err, yes it is. Quite a few EU countries are basket cases but what else can they do but try and continue and keep their heads down. Without a massive readjustment ( bank account raids, huge haircut, war, plague etc) nothing is going to improve as debt continues to rise. Here today, gone tomorrow politicians don't help either.

What positive signs are you expecting? All the unsold properties to be snapped up so construction can start up again and give employment to folk. Ayuntamientos to shake off their debt? The banks to write off their 300 billion euro toxic debts?

There is a plus tourism is on the up. Thank goodness for the Arab Spring

HBG

The chaos in the Arab countries to which most Westeners had been previously attracted has helped Spain a great deal and not just their tourist industry - wealthy westernised Arabs are also fed up with the uncertainties within their own countries and are flocking to the UK and Spain, where they are welcomed.

They buy football clubs in the UK and palaces in Spain.

amideislas

Borrowing itself into oblivion, raising taxes and cutting everything (leading only to further economic decline), yet no sign of improvement. Seems to me something is seriously amiss. Where is all the borrowed money, savings from cutbacks, increased taxes and all other forms of revenue collection going?

If you're going to borrow yourself into oblivion, then at least radically cut taxes, reduce employment regulation and wasteful spending to give the economy a fighting chance.

But I reckon if Spain did that, the EU would scream bloody murder about how "uncompetitive" such tactics are (as the rest of the EU continues to find themselves mired in over-taxation, over-regulation and waste, unable to compete in the world economy).

Fredbargate

They should fit in well in Spain

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/p...095505475.html

steviedeluxe

Is the Wall Street Journal fine by you?

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...Popular_Europe

jackytoo

Well everyone possibly with you as an exception knows the reason for unemployment going down. The test results will be revealed around October. As one Spaniard said about the news that 64,000 have found work last month. What it really means is that 64,000 have a contract to work for a couple of days per week until Sept. As for house prices stabilising, I don't think so.

I am also confused about exports going up last year yet manufacturing figures are down...does it mean they are selling more tomatoes There are a few ifs and buts in that article.

steviedeluxe

As normal I didn't expect you to believe the good news - but you always believe the bad reports and never quibble then! Tide's turned Jacky - Great news for those Spanish who have suffered!

jackytoo

Great news indeed, my friends there will be pleased to know that house prices have stabilised. However, time will tell, it's not what the IMF is saying. Lets see in October.

cricketman

Unemployment is down by 77,000

I've heard that the long term unemployed who are not entitled to any benefits are not included in the paro figure, so that could account for that figure

Or it could just be the usual summer blip, lets assess in October!

Lynn R

Last week, I saw something I haven't seen for a long time - an advertisement hoarding for properties that have actually increased in price! It is outside a development in Torrox Costa which for a couple of years now has been advertising 2 bedroom apartments reduced from the original (ridiculous) price of €320,000 to desde €168,000. I thought my eyes were deceiving me, but no, they are now desde €172,000.

Dick Dasterdly

I would say wait until early next year to get a fairer picture, but as previously mentioned the recent claimed decrease in unemployment appears to have been down mainly to seasonal work, though according to this quite a bit of spin was involved as well.

http://elpais.com/elpais/2013/07/29/...96_647063.html


As for that increased house price that Lyn mentioned, it is not unusual for Spanish sellers to bang their prices up for no apparent reason even though their property has remained unsold on the market quite a while.

I recall it happening on occasions during the last recession when things were still going downhill and at other times as well.
What the thinking is behind it, I haven't a clue, maybe they're hoping it will bring them a change of luck or maybe trying to recover some of their losses due to inflation.

Lynn R

I'm well aware that this used to be common practice, one house we made an offer on in 2003, but they would not come down in price, was still for sale almost a year later and the advertised price duly went up by 10% from the beginning of January - I think they just looked at the average house price figures and increased them all accordingly, regardless of whether there were any buyers interested in particular properties or not. The Spanish agent actually said to me, when I said I thought it was overpriced, "but it will be worth more next year". I said it might be, but then again it might not!

However, certainly for the last 4 years in my area and the surrounding ones I have only seem them going one way - down, whether for new build properties or resales. Some have remained on the market for years with the price unchanged, but this is the first I've seen where there has been an increase, which is why it surprised me.