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Permanent Residencia ??

Permanent Residencia ??

Old Oct 24th 2022, 6:48 am
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Default Permanent Residencia ??

I've now been resident for 5 years and been hearing about becoming a permanent resident.

What are the benefits ? Any bad bits ?

I've also read that I can then automatically enter the Spanish Health system which is cool as I pay as lot for private health insurance

TIA for any advice or information
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Old Oct 24th 2022, 11:07 am
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Default Re: Permanent Residencia ??

Hi,
I think that you automatically become a permanent resident after 5 years but I didn't notice or gain anything different when I became permanent resident.

Even as a permanent resident I think you can only join the Spanish Healthcare services for free is if you have no other means of gaining healthcare. If you are receiving UK pension you will be entitled to apply for the S1 healthcare scheme which is paid for by the UK government. The other way is to join the Convenio especial but that can be as expensive as private healthcare.

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Old Oct 24th 2022, 9:46 pm
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Default Re: Permanent Residencia ??

You need to renew your TIE/green residencia form which will now be for 10 years and 'permanent'

Agree with above this will not give you automatic health coverage but depending on your circumstances may help an application.

But (I think I heard) the convention does not preclude any existing health conditions. More here

https://expatsmagazine.org/health/
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Old Oct 24th 2022, 10:25 pm
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Default Re: Permanent Residencia ??

The UK government website was changed when the new Universal Healthcare law was introduced a couple of years ago. I believe it is wrong. The universal healthcare law is for illegal immigrants or those with no resort to healthcare elsewhere. This is why it isn't available to Brits under retirement age as the law would consider that previous years the person would have been paying for healthcare through private insurance or the convenio.
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Old Oct 25th 2022, 5:33 am
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Default Re: Permanent Residencia ??

I thought if you worked and paid into social security or had unemployment benefit, you could access public healthcare, if you signed up for it. Am I missing something?

Last edited by DLC; Oct 25th 2022 at 5:36 am.
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Old Oct 25th 2022, 6:55 am
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Default Re: Permanent Residencia ??

Originally Posted by DLC
I thought if you worked and paid into social security or had unemployment benefit, you could access public healthcare, if you signed up for it. Am I missing something?
You do ...but not permanently. If you quit your job you only have 3 months healthcare. Most Spanish had healthcare as it is assigned to families but I think now all Spanish have free healthcare. Before some Spanish had to use the convenio. The universal healthcare law only applies to undocumented immigrants. As a foreign resident your residency is dependent on you having sufficient resources to not be a burden on the state....so if you don't contribute you don't get it. Just as in UK Spain struggles to finance its health service so they aren't going to be handing out free healthcare to foreign pensioners who don't contribute that is what the convenio is. The convenio is the way you contribute and it doesn't stop after 5 years unless the UK government pays for it because of the S1. It makes sense...imagine if every foreign permanent resident got free healthcare ( especially in early 60s) after 5 years...it would be quite a cost !!

Last edited by Ronnyone; Oct 25th 2022 at 7:05 am.
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Old Oct 25th 2022, 7:32 am
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Default Re: Permanent Residencia ??

I do remember the three month rule caused problems around 2010 when people started running out of unemployment benefit - for both the Spanish and for foreigners. That was changed so that you could still get healthcare even if you had run out of benefit, but you had to remain signed on as unemployed.

Healthcare isn't assigned to families, but non-working family members can set themselves up as dependent on another member of their family who does have work, and foreigners as a group more likely can't do that.

Then in 2018 coverage became almost universal, but the three month and dependency rules are still used to work out where the money to pay for it comes from.

If you just start residency you'll never have paid in or received benefit so can't get healthcare that way, and you won't be a dependent on a family member so can't get healthcare that way either, and if a condition of residency is you're not supposed to be a burden then I guess you don't have it. But even so, you'll get seen in Urgencias.

Last edited by DLC; Oct 25th 2022 at 7:38 am.
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Old Nov 1st 2022, 7:07 pm
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Default Re: Permanent Residencia ??

Originally Posted by DLC
I do remember the three month rule caused problems around 2010 when people started running out of unemployment benefit - for both the Spanish and for foreigners. That was changed so that you could still get healthcare even if you had run out of benefit, but you had to remain signed on as unemployed.

Healthcare isn't assigned to families, but non-working family members can set themselves up as dependent on another member of their family who does have work, and foreigners as a group more likely can't do that.

Then in 2018 coverage became almost universal, but the three month and dependency rules are still used to work out where the money to pay for it comes from.

If you just start residency you'll never have paid in or received benefit so can't get healthcare that way, and you won't be a dependent on a family member so can't get healthcare that way either, and if a condition of residency is you're not supposed to be a burden then I guess you don't have it. But even so, you'll get seen in Urgencias.
This is how I understand it too. There was a total misunderstanding back in 2019 thanks to overzealous ex pat sites telling everyone to stop paying the convenio or their healtcare policies and claim universal healthcare. One site was telling folk to wave the decreto at funcionarios !!! Then people starting posting about neighbours etc getting their monthly convenio refunded etc. It was all misinformation or individual cases where errors were made or people were unaware of their situations. Basically the universal care is for undocumented illegals not wealthy foreigners. You must contribute by work. Even Spanish who didn't contribute didn't get- although as said above in reality the majority all had family that they would assign to so it was never a problem. Foreigners with residency can not be a burden on the state- hence they pay in one way or another. The UK government site was changed in 2019 and is wrong in saying that you get free healthcare after 5 years!!
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Old Nov 2nd 2022, 3:55 am
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Default Re: Permanent Residencia ??

Originally Posted by Ronnyone
This is how I understand it too. There was a total misunderstanding back in 2019 thanks to overzealous ex pat sites telling everyone to stop paying the convenio or their healtcare policies and claim universal healthcare. One site was telling folk to wave the decreto at funcionarios !!! Then people starting posting about neighbours etc getting their monthly convenio refunded etc. It was all misinformation or individual cases where errors were made or people were unaware of their situations. Basically the universal care is for undocumented illegals not wealthy foreigners. You must contribute by work. Even Spanish who didn't contribute didn't get- although as said above in reality the majority all had family that they would assign to so it was never a problem. Foreigners with residency can not be a burden on the state- hence they pay in one way or another. The UK government site was changed in 2019 and is wrong in saying that you get free healthcare after 5 years!!

^^ unless you were here before April 2012. Before that date immigrants could get free state healthcare without ever having paid in (past or future)
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Old Nov 2nd 2022, 3:58 am
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Default Re: Permanent Residencia ??

Originally Posted by snikpoh
^^ unless you were here before April 2012. Before that date immigrants could get free state healthcare without ever having paid in (past or future)
I mentioned that earlier and of course its true but PP took that away when they were in power.
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