rbs_gb

Imteresting social experiments but not sure it is relevant to #J23

rbs_gb

You're right they were indeed inspired by the Greek Syriza movement, but Lou71 describing them as a bunch of commies is perfectly correct. Check the background of all of the podemos founders....... 100% ex members of Partido Comunista Español

DLC

Well, the link also says this: "Cuando se habla de vivienda protegida, suele utilizarse el término VPO (vivienda de protección oficial) como concepto global, pero esto no es correcto del todo. Existen más tipos de viviendas protegidas que las VPO, por lo que, en realidad, debemos hablar de viviendas con protección pública o viviendas protegidas."

So there's you go, I guess the good news is I make the same mistakes the Spanish do.

I couldn't find "84" in that page, but it also says "también hay otros tipos de viviendas que gozan de protección por parte de las comunidades autónomas. Éstas no son consideradas VPO, sino que tienen distintas denominaciones según la comunidad autónoma en la que se construyan".

Apart from the autonomous communities mentioned there, there are also flats promoted by town councils for sale or rent, so that would explain the low number.

I'm only rubbishing the corruption trope. I think it must be obvious by now that a Brit can't lecture any country about corruption given what's been going on in the UK lately.

DLC

But can anyone point to a communist policy?

Also, Spain is at the top of eurozone growth, so even if there is some insidious communist influence on government policies... it's not damaged the economy.

rbs_gb

Totally agree that Nadia Calviño has been the success of this government, and deserves the respect on both sides of the house. I´m actually amazed that with so much state liquidity after all the windfall from taxes that the government received in the high inflation period that they did not use more "bribes" to the electorate! That was one thing I fully expected to happen if the current government had run it´s course until December.

As for policies, I get where you are coming from but it wasn't for the want of trying they did not get to nationalise most industries! Add in state price controls and Ley de Memoria Democratica....... Do you doubt what was the direction of travel? The repeated concession to ERC, EH Bildu and Podemos are all part and parcel of the perception of communist bias. Couple that to the total abuse of the powers of decree in law making, and you can understand why so many Spaniards perceive the government to be too extreme left wing and why now many do not want to risk another term of similar laws.

rbs_gb

Hey ho, I called that bit right, Irene Montero chucked out. Podemos could conceivably get zero seats in the final election after the lists indicated by Sumar when they confirmed the pact with Podemos tonight. Even Belara at #5 for Madrid is marginal. I don't know the party laws well enough to be able to say whether Montero could now produce a Podemos list in any constituency and effectively campaign as an independant. Have to watch and wait on that.

rbs_gb

So for this election cycle at least, the epitaph for Podemos has been written: https://www.rtve.es/noticias/2023061.../2449072.shtml

So far as Madrid is concerned, Diaz #1, then positions 2/3/4 filled by Mas Madrid which are the people that Iglesias effectively expelled from Podemos, and the first Podemos candidate is Belara at #5. That position is marginal for being elected if the expected swing to PP in Madrid comes true. We still have 9 days more of horse trading before the lists are finalised but it is difficult to see how or why Diaz will give any concessions to Podemos candidates now the coalition deal has been signed. Belara more or less had to sign to have any chance to save her own political career.

Ronnyone

Yes unfortunately I think that the way they reached a pact provides a negative message to the general electorate. It is the usual thing - the rank and file are too consumed by petty quarrelling and personal vendetta to see that for the average voter they come across as having zero interest in the things that really matter. It is now I think more a case of if POSE can hold together and the right come across as too extreme. No one now cares a damn about the economy- this is simply a binary black or white vote. It's a great shame but it is just going to be about insulting each other.

rbs_gb

Just been digging up the 2019 PSOE manifesto to see how many commitments they kept. https://www.psoe.es/media-content/20...s-sociales.pdf

How many folks, if asked "where did the phrase solo si es si originate?" would immediately go to Irene Montero and/or Podemos? I would, and we would all be wrong. The "solo si es si" was a PSOE pledge and #7 in their list of social commitments!

Ronnyone

All eyes on Valencia now as they cosy up with Vox. The difficult thing is that Flores from Vox has served time for malos tratos and however you spin it that doesn't sound good. I think they have avoided the issue by taking him off the governing body but put him up for the general election. Quite why people think a man who abused his wife and children and refuses to apologise is a good election choice- especially when every week someone murders there partner or expartner ( and then...the children) is beyond me...but that tells you alot about how modern politics works. One look at the news today tells me that probably the most dangerous country in the world at the moment is USA. Without a doubt Trump supporters have no issues with atomic warfare and mass genocide even on their own people!! This is the level of madness that presently engulfs us.

rbs_gb

Which just goes to show Ronnyone that if you all vote PP you will help keep VOX out..............

Ronnyone

Unfortunately I cant vote but after the all the corruption cases now surfacing after Rajoy I really don't think PP will be able to prevent Spain from falling back into the old ways. Still I look forward to them digging up Franco again and plonking him back in the basilica if only so the international world can mouth the words...WTF ??!!!

rbs_gb

I can only agree with that last bit. I firmly believe the Ley de la Memoria Democratica was the biggest mistake this current government made with the Spanish people. Think about it, the Spanish Civil war was BEFORE the second world war. To the vast majority of Spanish that is old history, they have moved on and it just wasn't a priority. How could the coalition prioritise that one issue above all others including far more important issues like housing and domestic violence? It reopened old wounds, and left important legislation undone, pushing many middle ground voters towards the right. The previous Zapatero government got it right, with a broad agreement designed to put the civil war and the franco regime in the past. This government did not heed the warning about letting sleeping dogs (and dead dictators) lie and will pay the price.

Casa Santo Estevo

Are you wring about the Ley de Memoria Histórica de España from 2007 or the Ley de Memoria Democrática from 2022?
Whilst I can see what you are saying that Sánchez and his coalition could better to have spent time on passing other laws. I will disagree with the sentiments you write about that the Ley de la Memoria Democratica was only about the Spanish Civil war. The provisions of this law covered far more atrocities instigated by Franco's regime.
Your point that the Spanish The Civil War may have been a long time ago does not sit well in the grand scheme of things. For instance repatriations are occurring dating back to atrocities from several hundreds of years ago. There are also others relating to injustices that occurred just before WW2.
Unfortunately the Spanish will never agree on any law relating to this subject. Both the 2007 and 2022 laws received a lot of criticism. Some say they do not go far enough and others say it is too much.

rbs_gb

I referred to both laws in my post No law is ever going to please both sides, but what the 2007 Zapatero law did was put a political marker down to put those grievances behind the country and to move on. It had broad agreement, with the marked exception of the republicans who will never be satisfied. By bringing in the new law Sanchez appeased the republicans, and reawakened all the old grievances. In my opinion, that is why there has been such a marked shift to the right. The average Spaniard had moved on, and was yanked back to the 1930s.

Just imagine if Europe suddenly decided to bring in laws to reopen all the old WW2 grievances! Everyone has moved on, so why do it?