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Old Dec 11th 2023 | 7:09 pm
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Default No more cheap flights?

The cost of being 'green'

https://spanishnewstoday.com/europea...2301775-a.html
 
Old Dec 11th 2023 | 7:17 pm
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Lets hope the EU also rails against the massive polluter that is the cruise business. European cruise business creates the same pollution as a million or was it a billion cars. ( I am always suspicious of exact round figures……)

Of course the solution regarding airlines would be for the EU to compensate the loss of tourism to the Southern European countries and get them to diversify.
 
Old Dec 11th 2023 | 8:30 pm
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Isn't that going to be the whole issue with the green policies, each country will do what has the least consequences for its own economy when push comes to shove.
 
Old Dec 11th 2023 | 8:48 pm
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Flights stopped being cheap a couple of years ago.
 
Old Dec 11th 2023 | 8:50 pm
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Originally Posted by olivefarmer
Lets hope the EU also rails against the massive polluter that is the cruise business. European cruise business creates the same pollution as a million or was it a billion cars. ( I am always suspicious of exact round figures……)
Good point!
 
Old Dec 11th 2023 | 8:50 pm
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Originally Posted by DLC
Flights stopped being cheap a couple of years ago.
Yes that's true
 
Old Dec 11th 2023 | 9:02 pm
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Originally Posted by olivefarmer
Lets hope the EU also rails against the massive polluter that is the cruise business. European cruise business creates the same pollution as a million or was it a billion cars. ( I am always suspicious of exact round figures……)

Of course the solution regarding airlines would be for the EU to compensate the loss of tourism to the Southern European countries and get them to diversify.
Isn't the cruise business though part and parcel of the same tourism issue? Areas of Spain and other tourist areas in the Med rely on cruise ships just as they do planes to feed their economy based on tourism. Add to that the ferry services to Spain again feeding into tourism. It's an overall issue because so much reliance is on tourism surely?
 
Old Dec 11th 2023 | 9:10 pm
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Originally Posted by bobd22
Isn't the cruise business though part and parcel of the same tourism issue? Areas of Spain and other tourist areas in the Med rely on cruise ships just as they do planes to feed their economy based on tourism. Add to that the ferry services to Spain again feeding into tourism. It's an overall issue because so much reliance is on tourism surely?
And that is also true - as said above, the (considerable) cost of going green.
 
Old Dec 11th 2023 | 9:34 pm
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Originally Posted by olivefarmer
Lets hope the EU also rails against the massive polluter that is the cruise business. European cruise business creates the same pollution as a million or was it a billion cars. ( I am always suspicious of exact round figures……).
Cruising is fun but the energy needs are ridiculous. And that's where the real scam of the century is: energy. And specifically: energy costs.

Back in the 80's you could have sworn that in 30-40 years energy will be so abundant and practically free that it will never be a concern. Fast-forward to today and we're being scammed completely. Some ports now allow (a limited number of) ships to connect to local power in order for them to stop generating power themselves. Turns out a lot of them aren't interested because it's way CHEAPER for them to generate their own power than to be connected landside.
 
Old Dec 12th 2023 | 12:55 am
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

I didn't see any mention in the linked article in the OP of what the amount of the tax might be, nor how that would translate in terms of seat prices.

Airlines and other interested parties predicting the end of affordability / tourism / the world would be pretty much par for the course for this sort of announcement that may, in the end, amount to only a small surcharge per individual on existing prices. I well remember, for example, the introduction of the now-commonplace city tax to Lisbon bringing about such predictions by politicians from opposing parties, property owners' associations, hoteliers, tourism business reps etc etc. "Killing the goose that lays the golden eggs" was a phrase that got a lot of wear at the time. And yet the city today teems with more tourists than ever and there are plans afoot for a brand new double-the-current-capacity airport and spangly new transport links to the city centre from whichever far-flung location is finally settled upon.
 
Old Dec 12th 2023 | 2:29 am
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Cheap flights disappeared with Covid.
Almost all major airlines now run fewer services than they did before 2020 and all of the prices have, in most cases risen far faster than they would have otherwise.
Easyjet used to run 7 flights a day from Gatwick in the summer and most were 90% full and you could get a seat for £20. Now they run 5 a day and they are always full and prices start at about £60.
Although my sister and her husband got returns from Luton to Alicante last weekend for £70 total for them both.... So some deals are still out there.

We have just come back from Australia and the price difference here is even more staggering.
In Oct 2018 we went out to see our daughter and I paid £2100 for three return flights Gatwick to Brisbane on Emirates.
This year for flights at the end of Oct I paid £4600 for just two of us.
In 2018 the second leg Dubai to Brisbane had three flights per day, now its a single flight. The plane was almost empty in 2018 this time it was full.

However to look at the link from spainrico it is suggested that Eu countries dont like the fact that they may be asked to charge for increased fees due to the 'green' policy of the Eu as it represents unfair competition with the likes of Turkey etc...

Sorry what a bunch of whinging countries. I think these days we are all agreed that something has to be done about climate control, but come on..
There are two solutions here.
1. Leave the EU and then set your own rates. (Spain whinged about German and British tourists) dont most Germans drive here so they wouldn't be affected anyway?
2. Let Turkey and Jordan join the EU and force them to play ball.
In fact why not just let every country join and become one unhappy global family....

Its just the same with ETIAS. France asked for a delay as they were worried that it would impact numbers travelling to the World Cup.... Forget security we want tourists....

Last edited by Barriej; Dec 12th 2023 at 2:34 am.
 
Old Dec 12th 2023 | 4:17 am
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Originally Posted by Barriej
[...]However to look at the link from spainrico it is suggested that Eu countries dont like the fact that they may be asked to charge for increased fees due to the 'green' policy of the Eu as it represents unfair competition with the likes of Turkey etc...

Sorry what a bunch of whinging countries. I think these days we are all agreed that something has to be done about climate control, but come on..
There are two solutions here.
1. Leave the EU and then set your own rates. (Spain whinged about German and British tourists) dont most Germans drive here so they wouldn't be affected anyway?
2. Let Turkey and Jordan join the EU and force them to play ball.
In fact why not just let every country join and become one unhappy global family....[...]
Depends how you define EU countries' preferences, I suppose.

The only citation of protest in the link was of the President of the Airline Association.

EU rules are, of course, drawn up and agreed by the member states.
 
Old Dec 12th 2023 | 5:28 am
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Originally Posted by Barriej

However to look at the link from spainrico it is suggested that Eu countries dont like the fact that they may be asked to charge for increased fees due to the 'green' policy of the Eu as it represents unfair competition with the likes of Turkey etc...
So you consider it acceptable that some countries make no effort to mitigate global warming while others are expected to make sacrifices for the greater good.

BTW: Traffic levels across the world are either at, or very near to pre covid levels.
 
Old Dec 12th 2023 | 5:34 am
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Originally Posted by Red Eric
EU rules are, of course, drawn up and agreed by the member states.
But they are not though.
Poland and Hungary have been protesting about the EU migrant issues and how to make each member state 'take their share'
​​​​​​https://www.france24.com/en/live-new...ather-in-spain

It will be voted on by a majority instead of all countries accepting it...

Anyway back to the current program.
Flights are not going to get cheap again ever in my view, the airlines have worked out that people will travel no matter what they do.
Car hire is at an all time high cost wise, almost all of the providers sold off the fleets during covid and can now charge double or even treble the price from three years ago.
They are also keeping fleet numbers low, which in the Uk will push the second hand car prices up.

 
Old Dec 12th 2023 | 5:45 am
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Default Re: No more cheap flights?

Originally Posted by Barriej
But they are not though.
Poland and Hungary have been protesting about the EU migrant issues and how to make each member state 'take their share'
​​​​​​https://www.france24.com/en/live-new...ather-in-spain

It will be voted on by a majority instead of all countries accepting it...

Anyway back to the current program.
What on earth has the migration issue got to do with cheap flights and climate change?
And you had better learn how the EU works.
 


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