Hello everyone,

I am new to this but hoping for some advice.

We are planning to move to spain preferably Costa del sol area in a few years.
What advice would you give someone before making the move or what do you wish you knew before you went. Where are good family areas and where to avoid?

We have just started learning Spanish and hope to grasp the basics by the time we move.
Our daughter will be about 5 to 6 years old when we move.

We are hoping to open a cafe but still undecided if this is the best option.

Any advice would be very much appreciated.

Thank you

As Concierge for the Spanish section of BE I would like to say hello and welcome.

BE is a very large expat website, so if you have problems finding your way around we have concierges who will try to direct you. The moderators for the Spanish forums are Mitzyboy and Fred James, moderators are there to ensure that the site runs smoothly within the rules of BE. Problems and complaints should always be addressed to a moderador who will look into the matter and deal with it efficiently and fairly. Our members who post in the Spain Forums are friendly and helpful with a wealth of knowledge of the issues of living in Spain. At the top of the page you will find a quirkily named thread called Free Beer which is full of important and useful information. Hope you enjoy your time participating in the forums.

Please let me know if you need any further help.

Rosemary

Hi rosemary,

Thank you for the welcome.

Found some useful information in the free beer thread.

Thanks

Do a lot of research before you come, especially the opening a cafe idea, they are great big money pits at the moment, but who knows what things will be like in a few years. Cafes and bars open and close faster than revolving doors at the moment.
Your daughter will be of the right age for a Spanish state school, and will quickly pick up the language.

When you say few years, it's hard to say, as locations and the economy can change so quickly. As always it depends how much money you have and why you want to move? I don't think Spain needs more Cafes at the moment, but always depends on the area. There will still be plenty of empty units in the next 10 years, but these units are empty for a reason. If you want to go to a touristic area, you will need to be right at the front, which means higher rental costs and no business during winter. If you want to attract locals, you will have to keep prices low and offer something they want, but they just don't have the money to spend.

Have a look at the supermarket thread - some discussion on the popularity of cake/bread shops. If you can (and it's a big if) get the quality of your bread and cakes right, there is no reason why you can't operate as a cafe-bar too. You will need to be based in a large town or city, and have good Spanish, as it's the Spanish custom that will keep your business going throughout the year.

A HUGE IF. Even people who are successful don't end up with more than €1000 owning cafes these days. Unless you really have a skill and can bake stuff nobody has ever tasted (set a trend), it's going to be tough. If you aren't a real baker and haven't been in the business, franchising makes more sense.

Although there is a lot of useful information in there which will give you a good idea of what is involved therefore will provide a good background I would advise you to double check on issues as Free Beer has not been updated for a very long time.

Rosemary

By rights, a Greek delicatessen opening in Madrid, at the height of the recession, shouldn't last 6 weeks. After all, what's the point in selling Greek wine, olive oil, salads etc when you can already get the Spanish version?
But it's still there, and I can confirm it always seems to have customers when I pass by. Whether it's the delicious cakes they serve, or the economically-priced meals, or just the ambience, they seem to have hit the right spot.

Greek & Shop (Corredera Alta de San Pablo, 9)
http://www.notodo.com/placeres/delic...a_o_k_ase.html

I know it's very much an exception, but last month we had lunch one day at a cafe run by a British family (parents and daughter) in Almunecar. They've been running the place for 11 years, and still there despite the recession. I could see why, the personal service was excellent, all ingredients very fresh, they offered more imaginative sandwiches/salads than the usual ham/cheese options, and best of all, genuine home made cakes like lemon drizzle, apple cake and chocolate cake which went down a storm. I think the trick is to find the right location (much easier said than done) which has sufficient tourist trade to keep going all year long, without too much competition from similar businesses, and keep standards high.

Thank you all for your advice. It has been really helpful.


We are thinking of buying a house next year using this as a holiday home for a couple of years before making the move. As we don't want to rush into anything.

We are going over to Costa del sol in the summer to find out more and look at different areas.

Does anyone have advice on areas. I have been looking at areas just outside cartama and villafranco maybe alhaurin el grande?

Just to underline there seems to be a growing market for bakery-cafe establishments. Yesterday afternoon I passed two establishments quite close to me in Madrid, and despite it being Sunday they were quite busy. The first one, I later discovered, is part of a big franchise chain and they seem to be quite big in Valencia. The Madrid store had a cafe area where families seemed to enjoy meeting (at least that was the case yesterday)
http://www.panariapanaderias.es/es/nuestras-tiendas

The other place I saw was called Panic (amusingly). There was a substantial crowd inside, but they weren't buying bread. They were attending a breadmaking course. This seems like a great way to get new customers and spread the word.
http://www.plateselector.com/panic/

Of course all this means that the competition is very fierce. Remember that wherever you base yourself, you will inevitably need to attract Spanish customers as well as the tourist and expat crowd.

Funny you should mention Panaria, we had lunch at a branch in the centre of Valencia during our visit last year. It was very nice, reasonably priced and obviously very popular.

A few similar places (panaderias with cafes attached) have opened locally during the last year or so, two branches of MasPan, one here in Velez and one in Torre del Mar, and one called Di Carlo in Torre del Mar which always seems quite busy - very modern in style with bi-fold doors which open up the whole of the frontage.

Yes, I think there was obviously a need for a venue that people (especially families) could go, without feeling they were in yet another bar environment where you mix with the carajillo and gin-tonic crowd...
Danger is of course when the market gets saturated...