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Installing a small pool.

Installing a small pool.

Old Oct 14th 2014, 6:19 am
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Smile Installing a small pool.

I have recently purchased a villa in pina de la horadada and would like to install a small pool I have been told there are builders in the area that specialise in installations and land scaping
As anyone any recommendations, contact details or advice that they could share ?
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Old Oct 14th 2014, 7:11 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

Originally Posted by E8spf
I have recently purchased a villa in pina de la horadada and would like to install a small pool I have been told there are builders in the area that specialise in installations and land scaping
As anyone any recommendations, contact details or advice that they could share ?
I suspect that your first, main problem, will be getting permission from the local planning department at your town hall.

I would ask there first before employing builders.

It is your responsibility to get the architect drawings and the permission so don't leave it to the builders to get it - in all probability they won't and then you have a BIG problem.
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Old Oct 15th 2014, 3:05 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

Originally Posted by snikpoh
I suspect that your first, main problem, will be getting permission from the local planning department at your town hall.

I would ask there first before employing builders.

It is your responsibility to get the architect drawings and the permission so don't leave it to the builders to get it - in all probability they won't and then you have a BIG problem.
You should definitely make sure you have permission. It might be worth getting a property lawyer involved to make sure every angle is covered.
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Old Oct 15th 2014, 3:35 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

I can't see why you would need a lawyer - the town hall will either give permission or they won't.
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Old Oct 15th 2014, 4:20 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

Originally Posted by Fred James
I can't see why you would need a lawyer - the town hall will either give permission or they won't.
It often depends on what day, who you talk to, or who are "friends" at the town hall. Property lawyers and others who are active in property matters tend to have "friends" at the town hall who take a more favourable view of such things. Might cost a little "extra" to get it "expedited" though.
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Old Oct 15th 2014, 4:43 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

so when we see adverts about pools above ground dont need planning permission I take it, its wrong,
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Old Oct 15th 2014, 7:03 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

Originally Posted by HeikeundAlan
so when we see adverts about pools above ground dont need planning permission I take it, its wrong,
Planning permission usually is necessary for anything "permanent" - e.g. holes in the ground, concrete, etc.

An above ground pool is decidedly not "permanent" and therefore, not requiring planning permission. But it depends on how petty your local community is. Some will not allow you to have anything visible at all without explicit permission.
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Old Oct 15th 2014, 7:48 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

Did the OP mean Pilar de la Horardada? If so being in the 'coastal belt' getting permission should not be too much trouble, its something the townhalls deal with on a daily basis. There are many builders and pool companies that operate in the area. Just make sure the one you employ does get the correct architect plans and permissions from town hall. Don't take their word for it, you want to see the paperwork.

If you get a copy of Costa Blanca News there are loads of companies in there that offer these 'all in one' services. But whoever you employ make sure that what they quote you is correct. Companies, even individuals here seem to 'forget' the IVA (vat) So make sure any quotes you ask for are inclusive of all taxes. Nothing worse than paying out 10 grand or more for a pool only to be asked to cough up another 3-5 grand IVA 6 months down the line!
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Old Oct 16th 2014, 3:22 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

Originally Posted by snikpoh
I suspect that your first, main problem, will be getting permission from the local planning department at your town hall.

I would ask there first before employing builders.

It is your responsibility to get the architect drawings and the permission so don't leave it to the builders to get it - in all probability they won't and then you have a BIG problem.
As a matter of interest would there be a chance that building permission wouldn't be granted?
What reason(s) would/could a town hall put forward to refuse permission?
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Old Oct 16th 2014, 6:36 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

Originally Posted by Biffta
As a matter of interest would there be a chance that building permission wouldn't be granted?
What reason(s) would/could a town hall put forward to refuse permission?
We had to pay 291€ for our pool licence and then a fee of 600€ this was in case the builders damaged the road outside and it had to be repaired. This of course was never returned. Take a look at the photo's to see how absurd this charge was, the photo's were taken last week after the storms.
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Old Oct 16th 2014, 7:59 pm
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

When we had work done, we also had to pay the 'insurance money' - but we had it returned. Ask an abogado to get it for you - shouldn't cost much and certainly not 600€
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Old Oct 17th 2014, 2:15 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

Originally Posted by Biffta
As a matter of interest would there be a chance that building permission wouldn't be granted?
What reason(s) would/could a town hall put forward to refuse permission?
Again it varies by community, but here (technically) you need at least 11000 square metres of land in order to build an in-ground pool (or to build anything, really). We tried to apply for a pool permit in our first house, which was refused for precisely this reason.

Now, having said that, there are plenty of pools in back gardens around here that fall far short of that requirement, and I admit I don't know exactly how that's done, but as in most things regarding builds, I suspect there are always certain "exceptions" to whatever rules may apply.

I've been told that an application for a "piscina" (difficult), is quite different from a "cisterna" (easy), yet (I'm told) that many "piscinas" are actually registered as "cisternas" because the permission is much easier to get.

Further, I've been told from more than one reliable source told that the cost of a pool permit (and all the extra costs associated with that) can actually be more than what you are fined for never applying for a permit in the first place, unless your neighbours file a denuncia, which can increase the fines substantially. I know of at least one pool built this way, and he says it was cheaper to simply not apply in the first place and pay the fine. But that sounds pretty risky to me.

But (as I'm told) if you apply, are denied, and you do it anyway, then the fines are outrageous. So, perhaps better to ask forgiveness than permission.

In any case, if you ever plan to sell, legalising it is all-important, so it's generally worth the red tape and costs of doing it legally.

Just as a final comment:

I understand and fully support the practical reasons for planning permission - to ensure safety, that it doesn't negatively impact the neighbourhood, that it's legally placed on your own property, etc...

... but over time, planning permission seems to have become a profit center for the the ajuntimentos, and for me, that places the entire exercise in question.

It is, after all, my land. Why should I pay some fart-arsed planning geek €1000's for nothing more than stamping a document - especially when I can prove I've taken all proper steps and assumed all the burdens and costs of ticking all the proper boxes?

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Old Oct 17th 2014, 4:01 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

I have to agree with many of your sentiments amideislas, while major works like pools or additions to building fabric I would always go the legal way of obtaining the correct permisos, for stuff internally its nobodys business except mine. If I want to change kitchen cupboard doors I will, if I want to paint the lounge purple and yellow polka dot I will. Its nobodys business but mine. Next year I need to replace 5 window frames, the current timber ones have been in for 9years since the build, they are falling apart now and leaking like crazy. I intend to put in upvc but in a oak timber pattern (did the doors this year) There won't be any license applied for and as we are 100 metres from the main road they will look like the originals.
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Old Oct 17th 2014, 4:03 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

Yes, some people subscribe to the "build now, pay the fine later", but that's OK so long as you would have got permission in the first place.

We have some friends near us in the Campo and they built a pool. Their builders said it wasn't necessary to get a licence! They didn't get a fine - just a demolition order! Or should that be a "filling in" order.

To be fair, they had already been conned by the builder to build on a plot too small to get permission for a house so they got permission to build a Nave - an agricultural warehouse! Presumably the planners are not happy with a pool attached to such a property.

We built a house in the campo with a proper licence but even then, the architect, when he applied for the licence, listed the pool as a water deposit for dual use as a water storage facility which could also be used for recreational purposes. I never found out why he did this but I guess it was it doesn't have to appear on the Escritura or the Catastral records so the IBI is less.

The rules vary so much from area to area that the only safe route is to go and talk to the local planning department.

Last edited by Fred James; Oct 17th 2014 at 4:06 am.
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Old Oct 17th 2014, 4:19 am
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Default Re: Installing a small pool.

When I had my pool built many years ago I was assured by the builder and a lawyer that I did not need a license

The builder finished the pool and walked out the gate with his final payment in his hand. He shook hands at the gate with the police who were delivering the denuncia.
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