Installation of ICP - anyone know anything about this?
 

We've received a letter today from our electricity company (Endesa) something to do with insatallation of the 'Controlar la Instalación de Elementos de Control de Potencia' (ICP for short ;) )

It seems to be about buying or renting a piece of equipmet which needs to be installed in the fuse box and then sealed and certified. Does anyone know anything about this at all & enlighten us?

My OH had to go to Correos to sign for the letter. The postman then filled in a form on the bottom half of the letter then got OH to sign it - then postman tore the form off & kept it :confused:

Here's a link to the website on the letter www.endesadistribucion.com/compruebesuicp - any of it make any sense????

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Re: Installation of ICP - anyone know anything about this?
 

We had that done about 2 years ago after buying the house we had to have the meter box changed as part of the new bolitin. after the electrician fitted that few days later endesa came and he ICP in the fuse box or should I say trip box. The ICP is just another trip switch that cuts all the power off if you draw too much electric. If it activates assess what you are using and re set it. It seems to be often tripped when you have quite a bit of electrical equpment on then use the kettle.

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

Thanks for that Bob :)

The fuse box we already have does that - so what difference does this ICP make?

Also we're still not sure just what it was that the postman filled in and kept - surely he shouldn't have done that :confused:

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

The ICP specifically stops you from drawing TOO much power (from the grid) - that is total power not simply on a specific circuit.. Without it you can draw as much as you want with the possibility of burning out cables (not necessarily in your house)!

If you have one installed, then remove it and the electric company notice, you can be fined BIG time.

ICP's are quite a recent installation so older houses won't have them.

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

The reason this is now happening is mainly to get more money from the consumer.

Many houses have a contract for 3.3kw but have no ICP. They frequently draw much more than 3.3kw (for short periods) and have no problems.

What will now happen is that the electricity company will fit an ICP trip corresponding to the present contracted potencia - in this case 3.3Kw.

In many cases this will not be enough and it will trip whenever a high load is used - cooker and washing machine at the same time for example.

So, the user complains to the company and they will come and upgrade the ICP to a higher rating - say 5.5kw and charge extra every month - the standing charge is based on the contracted potencia and is about €2 per kw per month.

The bad news is that they will charge for that upgrade - anything up to €200 from my experience.

So, if you have a contract rated at 3.3kw and no ICP and you think that may not be enough then make sure they change the contract and fit a bigger ICP now.

If you just get a ICP to match your current contract you may get an expensive surprise later.

In my case it cost me over €400 before it got sorted out.

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

Yes forgot to mention that my potencia was upgrafed at the same as icp fitted to 5.5 stil trips now and again

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

Had mine upgraded to 9.5kw two years ago and it cost €150 - hasn't tripped since although I have changed the electric hob to a gas hob to try and reduce the electric bills

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

The reason it is happening now is because The Ministry of industria.........
has ordered the electricity distribution companies to control that their customers have installed (controls de potencia) ICP....power control
or if the customer does not comply they have to apply a surcharge on the following bills.
This order was made in 2005
Real Decreto 1454/2005

The order to make the surcharges was made on the 26 of June 2008
Orden ITC/1857/2008
When you take out a contract with the electricity supplier, or buy a property and change the existing supply in to your name the installation will be inspected and if it is suitable you will get a contract for the Kw you asked for. If not you will have to make changes and eventually the contract you get basically confirms that you instalation is suitable for that amount of consumption. BUT you can consume much more than the amount contracted.
putting in danger of fires your installation and that of your neighbours.
The fitting of an ICP stops you creating this danger and us seeing on television about the pensioners dying in a fire believed to have been caused by a short-circuit.
I have gone through this procedure recently. I bought the box and fitted it on the wall. I bought the ICP and put it in the box with lenghths of cable to make the connections.
I then telephoned a local approved electrician to make the connections.
He charged me 45 euros including some extra bits. The cost of the box and ICP was40 euros. The electricity supplier has to come and seal the box and charge 9,04 euros plus taxes for inspection and connection.

A neighbour of mine who lives in England , was faced with the notification about the ICP when he arrived for holidays.
He spoke in English in the local office of the supplier who quoted him
300 euros to do the job.
When he spoke to me I arranged for the approved electrician to
come and he has cuoted the job complete, except the final 9,04 euros.
will be 50 euros. The conversations were in Spanish.
They maybe going to get more money from the customer
BUT I WILL NOT HAVE TO SEE ON TELEVISION YOUR NEIGHBOUR IS IN
HOSPITAL WITH SMOKE DAMAGE TO HER LUNGS.

SALUDOS ,STAN RODGERS

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

Yes, in many cases, especially old installations, there is a risk if they use too much power at any one time.

In my case they just did it for the extra money! I have an installation rated at 25kw and a boletin to prove it - there is very little risk of exceeding that and I certainly could not afford the bills !

As a result of having to having an ICP fitted (which I did not originally have as they specifically would not allow one to be fitted) they have now charged me over €400 for the paperwork (not the labour or cost of installation) and my monthly charge is now over €1/day.

In my case it is not a safety issue - just an excuse to raise more money!

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

As has been said, if Endesa do this work it can cost up to 600euros.
It seems to me that it's only if you have some reason to contact Endesa that this situation arises.
If it does follow Stan Rodgers advice.

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

If you want to increase the potencia then you have no option but to pay the exorbitant charges that Endesa charge to change your contract.

If you just want an ICP fitted that corresponds to the contracted potencia then it can be done by a local electrician or by Endesa but that is only for the ICP and labour for fitting.

As I said, they hit your for big money if they have to upgrade your contracted supply, and also if you do not have a current "boletin" for the higher rated supply then a rewire, at considerable expense, may be needed.

In some cases the total cost can be easily in 4 figures.

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

All Mains supply cabling will (SHould) be protected independently, by trips or fuse to the correct value to protect the cables, ditto the supply to your house also should be, then your house input point should be be protected by trip then each individual circuit should be protected.

So chances of cabling burning out for this reason is quite low, usual and most common reason for cables burning out is poor connections/connectors.
3.3Kw is very low for domestic supply ( albeit quite common in Spain).
For example an electric kettle (1.5KW), washing machine (1.5KW) and pool pump (1KW) all on at the same time would probably exceed this!!

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

Iberdrola have just started delivering letters in our area about fitting icp's. Not the "20 day" warning letters - I guess they come next? The only sanction mentioned is to have to pay for 10kw contracted supply. Since we probably want 7kw anyway, that isn't much of a threat (3kw = about an additional 80 euros per year by my calculations) so I have considered ignoring it. However I have a feeling that there may be other sanctions down the road, fines, or surcharges maybe.

We live in an area where there are a lot of low income spanish families - many in houses with very poor wiring. They will not be able to have an icp fitted because their wiring will not meet the required standard. They won't be able to afford a rewire, or Iberdrolas' exorbitant administrative charges, so they will be hit by the 10kw charge which they simply can't afford.

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

Just had ours done. 50 Euro for the electrician and 117 Euro for Iberdrola.

Rosemary

Re: Installation of ICP ?
 

Hi Rosemary
Just out of interest , was the installation compulsory or did you request to have it fitted ?